USSA (command economy)?

Discussion in 'Opinion POLLS' started by Canell, Jan 26, 2018.

?

Could (Soviet style) Socialism work in the U.S.?

  1. No, no way

    17 vote(s)
    65.4%
  2. Probably not

    3 vote(s)
    11.5%
  3. Yes, in certain conditions - martial law, war, natural disasters, etc

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  4. Probably yes

    2 vote(s)
    7.7%
  5. Yes, this is the future of civilization. Bring it on!

    3 vote(s)
    11.5%
  6. I don't know

    1 vote(s)
    3.8%
  7. Other

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. Canell

    Canell Well-Known Member

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    Howdy

    Is Soviet style Socialism possible in the USA? How would America function under Command Economy? How would an eventual Marshal Law be different from Socialism? War time economy? What if Walmart, Amazon, the Military Industrial Complex, Boeing, Apple, Microsoft, JP Morgan, Goldman & Sacks, CNN, CNBC, etc, etc, etc, are confiscated and nationalized for the benefit of the state and ordinary people?

    Wanna try your imagination? :cheerleader:
     
  2. GoogleMurrayBookchin

    GoogleMurrayBookchin Banned

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    The soviet style of socialism is inadequate because it keeps key features of capitalism like wage labor, the commodity form, and the law of value.
     
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  3. Canell

    Canell Well-Known Member

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    Why, at least I got 1 answer in the thread. Thank you, GoogleMurrayBookchin, very much!
     
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  4. ESTT

    ESTT Well-Known Member

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    Personally, I don't think socialism works well in the vast majority of places where it currently is implemented. But it would definately fail for a nation with a population as large as the United States has. Resources would get spread too thin, and it would likely have for example, the same food issues as the Soviet Union did. I isn't that I'm completely against the idea of a totalitarian state, but I don't see Marxist-based economies as something favorable.
     
  5. tecoyah

    tecoyah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The current state of our government and population as far as the ability to agree or implement virtually ANYTHING makes any socialist model impossible. A state that cannot function cannot run a business...we would end up like Trump University or Casinos.
     
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  6. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Wallmart nationalised... snort...so Wallmart shoppers can also frequent JP Morgan and Goldman & Sacks.... :lol: I'd really like to see that

    (I was going to insert some wallmart people pics but I just don't hate anyone on here enough.)
     
  7. Crawdadr

    Crawdadr Well-Known Member

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    Is has not been effective anywhere I do not see how it could be effective here. Is there any reason you think it would be effective here? A no from me is all well and good but a yes from you with some reasoning may make for a discussion.
     
  8. Canell

    Canell Well-Known Member

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    Well, the US of A have not seen a real war since the Civil war. Not a war on own territory at least. Think in that direction. :cowboy:
     
  9. Crawdadr

    Crawdadr Well-Known Member

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    I am sorry perhaps I am being a tad dense but what does that mean? If we have a civil war it would work? Or if we would try it we would have a civil war? Or are we talking about some one invading us if we do or do not do it?
     
  10. Canell

    Canell Well-Known Member

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    Lol, that would be a sight - a Socialist revolution in the US, followed by UN invasion to restore Capitalism. :D
    No, more like how would the US economy operate in a civil war mode. :smoking:
     
  11. Crawdadr

    Crawdadr Well-Known Member

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    Well it would depend upon who succeeded or what parts of the country left us. For the most part trade would continue unhindered in areas not directly in the conflict other then rationing and such. If trade did go belly up entirely (like if a large portion of our navy got appropriated by the rebels then do not be surprised if the UN does step in. We are quite literally to big to fail. If our economy disappears the world enters a depression the likes of which has never been seen. Imagine if China, India, and the EU all lost about 20% of their trade economy in under a year. The great Depression would look like a failed yard sale.
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2018
  12. Questerr

    Questerr Banned

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    The US does not have a history of authoritarian rule or a largely uneducated peasant population as was the case in every country where Soviet style rule and economics took hold through revolution (the imposition of Soviet style government and economics on Eastern Europe post-WW2 is a different matter).

    I think a socialist USA would look a lot more like syndicalism state focused on unions and granges than anything like the Soviet Union.
     
  13. Soupnazi

    Soupnazi Well-Known Member

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    Socialism cannot work anywhere. It did not work in the Soviet Union.
     
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  14. Soupnazi

    Soupnazi Well-Known Member

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    It is not inadequate it is an abomination and evil at it;s core.

    The only law of value s that value is subjective and cannot be determined by any objective standard.
     
  15. GoogleMurrayBookchin

    GoogleMurrayBookchin Banned

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    The law of value (German: Wertgesetz) is a central concept in Karl Marx's critique of political economy, first expounded in his polemic The Poverty of Philosophy (1847) against Pierre-Joseph Proudhon, with reference to David Ricardo's economics.[1][note 1] Most generally, it refers to a regulative principle of the economic exchange of the products of human work: the relative exchange-values of those products in trade, usually expressed by money-prices, are proportional to the average amounts of human labor-time which are currently socially necessary to produce them.[2][note 2]
     
  16. Soupnazi

    Soupnazi Well-Known Member

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    And it is also one of the many reasons Marx's theory is abominable garbage.

    Value has no such law and it is nothing more than a piece of propaganda to justify marxist tyranny.

    Objective value does not exist and value cannot be placed on the labor of another.
     
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  17. GoogleMurrayBookchin

    GoogleMurrayBookchin Banned

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    Marx wasn't a prescriptivist, he was a descriptivist. His definition of value was derived as a description of the observable functioning of capitalist systems.
     
  18. Soupnazi

    Soupnazi Well-Known Member

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    No it was not derived from any observable functioning.

    Marx never observed any capitalist system functioning. He merely read selective ideas and never worked a day in his life. His definition of value is false and meaningless like nearly all of the **** he spewed.
     
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  19. GoogleMurrayBookchin

    GoogleMurrayBookchin Banned

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    What do you think Marx believed? Entertain me
     
  20. Soupnazi

    Soupnazi Well-Known Member

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    You said it yourself.

    I do not deny it is what he said and believed he was just a complete fool and was full of of ****.
     
  21. Brexx

    Brexx Well-Known Member

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    Great title for a comedy.
     
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  22. GoogleMurrayBookchin

    GoogleMurrayBookchin Banned

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    I don't think you can hear Marx mentioned without getting too mad to think. I think that your understanding of Marx is formed entirely from lazy polemics against Marx's intellectual heirs
     
  23. Soupnazi

    Soupnazi Well-Known Member

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    I stated no polemics nor did I get mad I stated fact. Value is strictly subjective. That is fact which destroys his idiotic belief in a law of value.



    Marx has brainwashed heirs not intellectual heirs as he was no intellectual. His heirs are just dupes and losers
     
  24. GoogleMurrayBookchin

    GoogleMurrayBookchin Banned

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    Marx does not assert an objective value, he describes how the subjectivity of value functions in capitalist societies
     
  25. Soupnazi

    Soupnazi Well-Known Member

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    If you call it a law it is not subjective.

    Nor did he or his heirs have any idea how value functions in capitalism. He was massively ignorant of capitalism. He was wrong as he was about most things and easily proven so.

    He was evil and a complete fool.
     

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