Virus rebels from France to Florida flout lockdown practices

Discussion in 'Coronavirus (COVID-19) News' started by Space_Time, Mar 23, 2020.

  1. Space_Time

    Space_Time Well-Known Member

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    This seems incredibly foolish. I understand some of the revelers have tested positive. What should the authorities do:

     
  2. LogNDog

    LogNDog Well-Known Member

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    There are a lot of people that are ignoring the recommendations to distance and isolate. It's like everyone is on vacation!!!!!! Denver parks were full this weekend. They had to finally shutdown Denver. People are stupid. I am just staying in the mountains and telling people to stay the hell away.
     
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  3. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    While foolish, it’s not immoral to be foolish, and ought not be illegal. South Korea showed us the solution—test and isolate the sick and dying, not lock up the living.

    The virus is mean, but the government’s reaction is economically insane, medically unnecessary, and long term, extremely harmful to liberty and prosperity.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ny...oronavirus-south-korea-flatten-curve.amp.html
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2020
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  4. David Landbrecht

    David Landbrecht Newly Registered

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    The situation needs some reason and intelligence applied. The elderly and others especially vulnerable should have special times and areas they can circulate with caution. Those who are identified as immune one way or another should be out helping in contexts where they do not risk carrying the virus to others. Otherwise, prudent exercise by individuals could be organized, perhaps by alphabet, to go out briefly at certain hours. At any rate, such a general shut down attempt was bound to have the results we are seeing.
     
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  5. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    Actually, it's the height of immoral to be foolish if you're hurting people by being foolish. What is needed is BOTH approaches, test and isolate AND employ social distance. The idea is to give us time to prepare for the disease's real onslaught. It won't be forever, it shouldn't really even be that long.

    Had Bonespurs not decided to abolish the Office of Pandemic Awareness we might be ready now or at least a good deal further along towards that goal. Think on that the next time you hear someone giggling at Trump as if he's just a harmless fool
     
  6. VotreAltesse

    VotreAltesse Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That's why french and italian government believed, and they just woke up in the middle of the epidemic.

    Paradoxally, they created much more damage because they didn't took measures early enough, and yes, when you have to lockdown an entire country, it's a full disaster, but there is a reason why some countries such S.Korea, Japan, Taiwan had to take less extreme measure : because they reacted more quickly.
    Governments have let thing worsen because they didn't want to cut a finger, and now the whole arm is infected.
     
  7. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Hmmm. Explain South Korea. No lockdown.
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/carlie...wn-but-with-nearly-250000-tests/#21d45559576b
     
  8. VotreAltesse

    VotreAltesse Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Because of what I have wrotten just before ? They were much more reactive from the very start.

    They took the big C seriously from the start, and they provided themselves the means : 250 000 tests. As far as I know, neither any european country or american country are even able to do so much tests. Clearly in France, they already don't test some people because they can't.

    There is globally a huge gap between the way western and asian countries have managed the situation.

    In that kind of crisis, we can clearly see which country have an effective culture and organization, and the oen which haven't, and that doesn't honor myy country.
     
  9. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The testing. It was key. No lockdown. No cites lockup. No smashing of the economy. Trump had the money, the knowledge, the opportunity. He blew it. And now the Democrats are trying to outdo his bumbling.
    Isolate the sick and dying, not lockup the healthy and living. You don't murder your sick dad to save the family from a 99% survivability virus. We just did.

    Both the Religious Right and the Progressive Left are using this virus to increase their power, not protect our rights, wealth, and health.
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2020
  10. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Hmmm. Skimmed too quickly. It's a good spot on post.
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2020
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  11. VotreAltesse

    VotreAltesse Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    A lot of people were knowing that the economy was sick anyway, no healthy economy has this amount of debt, either public or private. The coronavirus would expose dysfunctionnal elements of the economy more that it would create dysfunction. A healthy economic system does have some resilience. If it don't have, it's because it doesn't work well.

    I think even if it will be very hard, and I apprehend the suffering of the people which will loose their jobs, it's better to brought face to face with those problems now, rather than later after they worsened up. I must admit that the situation doesn't look great for me because I'm crippled, I'm dependant of the state for my own life, which is a very poor situation when the state is failing.

    Considering the survivability, an important elements have to be taken in account :
    The survivability highly depend of the number of people infected, as long you have available ventilator, yes, the sickness won't kill many people, but at the moment your hospitals are overloaded, then the survivability drop as people that could have survived would die simply because they didn't access to some ventilators.
    In France, we went from a regular medicine, to a "war medicine" as now doctors have unfortunately to sacrifice some patients to save some other. That's what they do in Italy, they sacrifice their elderly. Young people that got the virus because they weren't cautious enough may indirectly "murder" some old people.

    I love that quote from Seneca, the one below every of my post, "difficulties strengthen the mind, as labor does the body". That kind of situations show the weakness of our mind, and so the necessity to reinforce it.
    We're living in difficult times, it depend of us to not simply to live it in a passive way or to take it as a possibility of bettering ourselves.

    I'm not sure my grammar was perfect in that post, I hope it can be still understood.
     
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  12. Space_Time

    Space_Time Well-Known Member

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    Well at least he apologized:

     
  13. Paul7

    Paul7 Well-Known Member

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    Not really: https://www.politifact.com/factchec...nald-trump-fire-pandemic-officials-defund-cd/

    You think if Plugs were POTUS we'd be the only nation without the virus? Thank goodness Trump restricted China travel over the objections of the LW.
     
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  14. AmericanNationalist

    AmericanNationalist Well-Known Member

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    Fauci just gave more examples/proof of the wisdom of that decision by noting that one of the big reasons Italy's suffering to the horrific extent that it is, was because of Chinese tourism.
     
  15. Space_Time

    Space_Time Well-Known Member

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    This seems incredibly irresponsible:
     
  16. Lesh

    Lesh Well-Known Member

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    Trump is anything but harmless..especially now
     
  17. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    That is why most people are saying that increased testing is the way to go right now, it will make things easier on everybody overall if we know where and when we will need what resources, but hospitals are largely fixed structures. We have to allow ALL the hospitals time to get ready, .

    Unless you think that most people can get used to stepping over corpses on the way into Starbucks then we have to save more than this virus will take if allowed to spread as fast as it seems it can, and the only way to do that right now is make sure the hospitals are ready to take care of all of them as they get sick. We have to stop the spread.
     
  18. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    And in the case of the USA the gangrene was in the head to begin with
     
  19. David Landbrecht

    David Landbrecht Newly Registered

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    History is consistent with its lessons about dividing people in order to control them.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2020
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  20. VotreAltesse

    VotreAltesse Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I think it's quite interesting to see that a wide variety of government had poor reactions, and it go beyond the divided between conservative and liberals. Two good examples of that are italian and spanish government. Both had extremly slow and poor reaction, and one is radical right and the other radical right. To my opinion, it confirm that the problem of leadership go much beyond the notion of right wing and left wing.

    But to be fair, most political side see what they want to see in that crisis.
     
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  21. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    Proper response to epidemics is well known and there is little dispute as to whether it should be done by anyone.

    You may be right. Leaders of all kinds seem to be more interested in pushing their ideologies than doing their jobs

    The Asian countries have a lesson for the "Western" cultures here.
     
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  22. One Mind

    One Mind Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    They tested and isolated anyone with the virus sick or not .

    At least be accurate.

    Too bad this just doesnt kill the young and stupid. If so they would not be irresponsible towards others that it does kill. But there aint no justice .
     
  23. Space_Time

    Space_Time Well-Known Member

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    Will 'covidiot' wind up as 2020 word of the year:

     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2020
  24. SkullKrusher

    SkullKrusher Well-Known Member

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    Free citizens of France and the USA unite in protest against the Socialist Globalist Agenda, exercising their self evident rights established by logical reasoning by philosophers from the beginning of Western Civilization to the present year of 2020 A.D
     
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  25. One Mind

    One Mind Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Lol. Socialist global agenda ? The world is run by a few rich elites who have influence on govt. That influence in the west has given us fascism, oligarchy with the latest being globalism a war against labor creating serfs.

    The western elites are not creating socialism with their money and power! Lol They are not suicidal so your conspiracy theory is negated by reality. This socialism deal the fringe right is not supported by anything but delusion. And people who have no clue as to what reality is.

    If there is ever a push to socialism it wont come from the elites but the billions of serfs that capitalism is exploiting by neoliberal tools like sweat shop globalism to max profits for the rich .
     
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