"We the People.." Do Not Have Constitutional Right to Vote

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Truly Enlightened, Oct 10, 2019.

  1. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    not hardly, many republican have felonies, doctor shopping for drugs, ect...

    good people do bad things too, sad but true and not all felonies are equal

    Sentencing is for the punishment, the worse the crime the longer the punishment, I do think some punishments are too short and others too long

    but once the sentence is served, all rights should be restored, all free Americans have the right to vote and own a gun to protect their homes and families
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2019
  2. Truly Enlightened

    Truly Enlightened Active Member

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    You might find this video relevant.
     
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  3. carlberky

    carlberky Active Member

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    "Corporations are people, my friend." Mitt Romney

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_personhood

    "As a matter of interpretation of the word "person" in the Fourteenth Amendment, U.S. courts have extended certain constitutional protections to corporations. The basis for allowing corporations to assert such protections under the U.S. Constitution is that they are organizations of people, and the people should not be deprived of their constitutional rights when they act collectively."

    The only ones acting collectively are the corporate board members, and the people who acted collectively when they voted are deprived of their rights when the politically appointed delegates to the Electoral College vote.
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2019
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  4. carlberky

    carlberky Active Member

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    Sure, but the 26th Amendment says that you earn that right merely by becoming 18 … 16 in some states.
     
  5. God & Country

    God & Country Well-Known Member

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    There is nothing progressive about the "progressive left" because it is the the radical left and all of this talk about trying to protect the vote is subterfuge, bullshit. This crap about corporations controlling the narrative is another red herring. We know who controls the media and tries very hard to prevent any opposing views. I consider the policy of trying to unseat a lawfully elected president by fiat an act of sedition. I almost thought there was some room here for a conversation until you unloaded with the same old tired talking points I've already heard a million times, who writes this crap???? Donald Trump will be re-elected in 2020 by a considerable margin, there you will see what the power of the vote is. You are either extremely naive and completely in denial about what is really happening or just plain stupid. There is no other way to explain this fairytale.
     
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  6. yguy

    yguy Well-Known Member

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    Get real, you can't be deprived of a right you never had to begin with, and no American ever had the right to vote for the President directly.
     
  7. carlberky

    carlberky Active Member

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    Check out the 26th amendment.
     
  8. yguy

    yguy Well-Known Member

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    It doesn't militate against anything I said in the slightest. You're welcome.
     
  9. Truly Enlightened

    Truly Enlightened Active Member

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    I am really trying hard to be civil and respectful in this discourse. You may well be correct that I AM extremely naïve, or just plain stupid. But ignorance can always be cured by knowledge and facts. There is no cure for political fundamentalism, or top-down self-serving pseudo-sophistry. Cognitive dissonance is the enemy of an open and rational mind. Yours is a position of contradiction and inconsistency.

    You claim that the process/policy of impeaching a fairly(doubtful) elected President by fiat, is tantamount to sedition? This raises a few questions. If your false conclusion is valid, exactly WHO do we charge with sedition? The people, the representatives, or the collective members of the House and Senate? It is the House that impeaches, and the Senate the removes the President from office. But, it is both bodies of Congress that represents the will of its constituents. Maybe you haven't seen the polling of the people's support for ousting this embarrassment of the USA? So, please tell your elected representatives that since Trump was fairly elected, he should be allowed to destroy the entire planet, or commit any crime he wants. Tell them that, not only should Trump not be impeached for his blatant acts of illegality, and abuse of power, but that we shouldn't even hold an inquiry, because he is above the law. You are the poster-child for this kind of blind hyper-partisan fundamentalist thinking. The evidence is overwhelming, that corporate media, the DNC, and Corporate Media, are continuing to control the narrative of each candidate. Just ask 10 people about just one candidate, and see how many different narratives they will give you.

    You stated, "This crap about corporations controlling the narrative is another red herring.". But, in the next sentence you stated, "We know who controls the media and tries very hard to prevent any opposing views.". In the first sentence you claim/imply that corporations controlling the narrative, is just a red herring(false, distraction). But in the next sentence you claim that the news media corporation will try to prevent any opposing narrative. So which one is it, since both statements are contradictory?

    I gave you examples of what Progressive policies were, and asked if you thought they were radical policies. No answer. I asked for examples of what you claim is the radical left, or any radical policies. Still no answer, other than citing an improbable amendment, relating to the Electoral College. Which in no way would be radical, since many conservatives and liberals are on-board with this idea. So, again, if this is not just an imaginary construct in your head, what would be an example of the "radical left"? And, what specific radical policies would be a "tyrannical replacement of our Constitution"? Never mind, I don't expect any rational response.

    I simply want Corporate America, mainstream media, and other corporate interests, to stop influencing the only thing we have left, to even the playing field. Our vote. If they can limit our choices of candidates, to only the candidates who will only serve their interests, then the nomination and election process is a sham and a fraud. It is easy to rote parrot corporate and conservative soundbites, when you are speaking to the choir. But it is not so easy when you have to OBJECTIVELY defend them outside the choir.
     
  10. God & Country

    God & Country Well-Known Member

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    Do you really believe Trump stole the election? With help from Russia???
    I would not be the least bit surprised that you aren't the DOJ is in the process of investigating this very thing.The IG Michael Horowitz is about to release a report on this very thing on Friday. I will also not be surprised if this report names Hillary Clinton and Barrack Obama as part of this sordid criminal enterprise.
    Nothing contradictory, the media is perhaps corporate in the business sense but that is just a front for their real purpose which is the organ by which the radical left manufactures all the lies, manipulations, deceptions, distortions and fabrications that support their agenda.
    I make no distinctions between Progressives, Socialists, or Marxist, they are all sides of the same coin, the radical left. They collectively are the diametric opposite of what America is and have no place here. If by some unfortunate turn of political events they were ever to take over here there would be bitter resistance that would fuel the iron fisted rule that always follows socialist revolutions. There would be no Constitution such charters don't exist in dictatorships.
    Where have I heard all of that before, especially the part about even the playing field? hmmmm, sounds like affirmative action at the voting booth, even the playing field rolls so nicely off the tongue, like redistributing wealth. If you want to be truly enlightened here is something quite enlightening. http://uselessdissident.blogspot.com/2008/12/love-letter-to-america-part-one.html This isn't overly long but should be read in it's entirety, it was written in the 80s but in context with the present frighteningly prophetic.
     
  11. ChristopherABrown

    ChristopherABrown Well-Known Member

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    Great post! Your opposition has lost all credibility your reply was so comprehensive.

    But this part, is not correct, emphasis of bolding is mine.

    There is another democratic way to control government in America. It is carefully avoided in all schools.

    Article V. But it requires states to be controlled by majorities within them to work forbthe people. Not easy when media does not serve the people. Article V is the orderly method to alter or abolish, we are 108 years late. The states were were trying to stop the federal reserve in 1911, congress violated the law, their oath and the constitution.

    Forty of the wealthiest people in America against the federal reserve died on April 15, 1912 in the titanic tragedy. This was by design. Another story.

    The real point is “WHY” are we participating in unlawful politics? We actually cannot even determine if the vote is secure. The notion of democracy with media manipulation is badly flawed. Then corporate money really takes it out of the realm of reason.

    Article V used this way is HOW the people become the rightful masters of the congress and court (Lincoln 1859).

    Also avoided in schools is the 9th Amendment. Nine out of ten adults have no idea of what it is. It is our, and humanities tool for mass social adaptation. By use of Article V right previously not written can be enumerated by 3/4 if the states and congress nor the court have authority over the Amendment.

    If the people focus on creating constitutional majorities in states, then use that lawful control to purify states of legislators that are serving the corporate government created in 1871, THEN a new political platform is created by the people. Any politician that wishes to distinguish themselves as “for the people”. Only need include support for that people’s platform and voters can safely vote for them. That is a simple benefit that occurs in the beginning of a snowball effect of unity under natural law that is also constitutional.

    Natural law is in our DNA. Or, we already unconsciously agree. The agreement only needs to be made conscious then formalized.

    I believe Ice determined which natural law can serve America this way, and it includes a vital adaptation using the 9th Amendment.

    1) We have the right to alter or abolish government destructive to unalienable rights.

    2) If the framers intended for Americans to alter or abolish then they intended that free speech have the ultimate PURPOSE of enabling the peoples unity under law needed to alter or abolish government destructive to unalienable rights.

    No one has ever defined another way for the people to unify adequately to alter or abolish. The natural law basis that is also biological social behavior is that the purpose of free speech is to assure infirnation vital to survival is shared and understood.

    I have very good reason to believe this process is absolutely needed for humanity to survive and evolve on this planet. I have some exclusive info I base that statement on, and current events developing over the last 20 years tend to prove it.
     
  12. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    This above is wrong - you are the one who is confused if you don't realize - that big Establishment money interests who control the companies within the Military Industrial Complex do not influence foreign policy decisions.


    If you understand that power and money fuel corruption in every sector of our society - and that big lobby is a problem ... you should realize that there are big money interests that influence foreign policy in this nation ... and thus are involved in war decisions.

    Where is the confusion here ?
     
  13. Truly Enlightened

    Truly Enlightened Active Member

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    As I have said before, your imaginary and uninformed mindset is only part of the problem. With all due respect, your ignorance is the source of your borderline paranoia, and your dissonance to reality. This self-created nonfactual ideology, only highlights other cognitive issues. It is confirmation bias, selective perception, and positive(or negative) social feedback, that fuel and shape our view of reality. Just a reality check to address your fear of government occupation and control. Do you really think that people in communities can resist a government that can remove the entire community with one missile? This is just delusional, and watching too many action movies. I'm sure you think that the Green Berets and the Seals are truly America's best? What is an example of our government ruling with "an iron fist"? Never mind, there ARE no examples, except in your mind. Just like the mindset of people conditioned to believe, that it was our job to stop the spread of Communism, and now Terrorism. The Government couldn't even stop prohibition, or pornography.

    By lumping Progressives, socialists, and Marxist on the same side of the same coin--the radical left, only highlights that you clearly have no idea the differences between a political ideology, a political philosophy, or a political principle. It would be the same if I claimed that Nationalism, Libertarianism(not Liberalism), and Fascism, are on the same side of the same coin--the radical right. and https://www.quora.com/Is-totalitarianism-right-wing-left-wing-or-some-other-wing I, like most rational people, DO make distinctions between all political ideologies. Their political perspective is not simply derived from, "me right, because all rest wrong". Most humans are not one-dimensional thinkers, but hold different views on different issues. Only hyper-partisan fundamentalist derivative thinkers, hold the same views on all issues. If this is your skewed view of reality, then you are simply entitled to your own opinion. But the sea-changes that are needed to address the real problems that my fellow citizens are facing, will never come from people with your political mindset. These people will mindlessly resist any changes to their status quo, but will gladly accept the benefits of those changes. If you had any understanding of what socialism is, you would know that the US IS a Democratic Socialistic country. Without socialism, there would be no Medicare, Medicaid, Affirmative Action Programs, Social Security, Food Stamps Programs, Veterans Benefits, Unemployment Benefits, National Defense, Education, Federal Housing Programs, Women's Abuse and Family Abandonment Programs, and many other socialist orientated programs run by the government. Our government spends 4 Trillion dollars on these programs. So, are you advocating that we stop all these socialist programs, because of your fear of socialism in America?

    I do NOT believe the Russian Government would bother interfering in American Politics, nor care. What I do know for certain, is that Corporate America, the DNC, and the Corporate Media, DOES blatantly interfere in our political system. They create only the narratives that benefit their Corporate masters, and NOT "We the People..". Just look at the blatant hit piece by the NY Times on Tulsi Gabbard? She is the only candidate with a viable plan to stop all wars, and use the(and other) savings to pay for social reforms. Anything else, is just empty rhetoric. Most rational people on either side of the political spectrum, would consider her policies as a no brainer. And, it would certainly resonate as being a practical and logical narrative. The problem is, that her narrative would devastate the MIC, the FFI, Big Pharma, Corporate America, Wall Street, and would directly challenge the power of the Meritocracy and Plutocrats. People will believe anything, if the narrative is package well, repeated enough times, convince people it is their idea, or just blatantly smear and demonize the candidates that pose the greatest threat to them. They know that todays movie generation, responds only to spectacle and controversy, not to the truth. No other candidate has the courage or the strength to stand up to these powerful industries, that run American Politics, by shaping the American narrative..

    The "trickle down" economic policies of both Republican Presidents(Reagan and Bush) failed, and only quadrupled the national debt, and greatly increased national unemployment. The initial premise itself was ludicrous. Did anyone really think that if you incentivise the wealthy, using tax breaks, that they would voluntarily redistribute their own wealth? Hence, the big jump in the number of Millionaires and Billionaires. The only real way to help the majority of people, is to freeze the prices on basic commodities, and not interfere in the elective process. Let the best person win or loose on their own merits. Lets just keep money, lobbyists, special interest groups, and corporate favors, all out of politics.

    Again, more disassociated logic. If corporate media is in bed with the radical left, then how did Trump get elected? I know you want to believe that all ideas from the left are radical, and all ideas from the right are sensible, but you need to objectively support your assertions with evidence and not with just more rhetoric. Your statements were blatantly contradictory, and I demonstrated why. I'm still waiting on just one example of a radical policy, from the radical left, that threatens a tyrannical replacement of our Constitution. I also think that your 35 year old McCarthyist, Fascist, and Paranoid love letter of America, is certainly a red herring.
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2019
  14. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

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    I see. So the corrupt establishment allows itself to be influenced to start a war? Shame on them. Yes, corruption exists in every sector of society but you appear to think the corruption here belongs to war machinery manufacturers and not the government. I see it the other way around.

    The part about being involved in war decisions. Can you prove a situation in which a military action was started because of corporate influence? If you can, then the government is not only corrupt but incompetent.
     
  15. Truly Enlightened

    Truly Enlightened Active Member

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    Thank you. Again we are still talking about the power of the votes. It doesn't matter if we are talking about citizens voting in the Caucuses, Primaries, or in the General Election. Or, if we are talking about their elected State and Federal representatives, voting to propose, or ratify any new Amendment to the Constitution(including changing Art. V). Since Art. V has been the process by which 27 new amendments have been added to the Constitution(4 still outstanding), it is NOT a politically latent process. Also, please relook at Art. V, and the real purpose of the 9th Amendment. These videos are from the "Constitution for Dummies" series. They are very good, and very basic for context.
    and

    What people do not understand is, that they are responsible for the Government they have.


    And, the debtor economy we have allowed to occur.


    These tangential issues are at best a corporate distraction, designed only to protect their own interest. We as a society must become smarter than the "dumbing-down" ads would indicate. The first step in addressing our economic crisis, is to stop all wars, bring our troops home, end crippling sanctions, stop wasteful military spending, stop borrowing more money, and use the trillions in savings to address urgent social reforms. Next freeze all prices on basic goods and services. It does no good to increase minimum wages to $100 per hour, or give people $10,000 per month, if the cost of goods and services also increases to compensates for the change. Unless the government also makes comparable savings adjustments to all personal savings, then this stimulus package approach, is nothing more than another form of inflation. More borrowing, and more national debt.

    Our inability to mobilize or form a unity, is because we have become so divided, that we have become individual corporations. Our views, asperations, and needs, or only an imaginary corporate created "consumer need". Do we really need to have thousands of varieties of cheeses, or over 350 varieties of bread in Italy alone? Do we really need a fridge, with a computer interactive display screen? Do we really need multi-million dollars cars, to get us from point A to point B? No, we don't. In a Capitalist(Materialist) world, everything is a commodity, and everything has a price. The idea that if we have more "stuff", we will be happier. Every day we are bombarded by over 1600 ads(TV, Print, and internet) telling us that our lives will not be complete if we don't buy this particular product or service. This culture of consumerism promotes that it is good and natural to want more "stuff".

    This is wrong. Consumerism is manipulative, and create a fake desire or need, that we may never have had. It exploits those without the knowledge or experience to think critical about these "stuffs". Consumerism is intrusive. Advertising is everywhere, and can be an annoying, patronizing, intrusion on your personal space. Consumerism does not meet our needs. Materialism does not address more important things that promote real happiness. Such as, love, friendship, creativity, and a sense of purpose and belonging. The problem is that people are fooled into believing that Consumerism CAN promote real happiness. Because, it uses ads to link its products to the real things that do make us happy. Consumerism is unsustainable. We live on a planet with over 7.5 Billion people, with a finite set of resources. We are already living well beyond the planet's limits. Consumerism restricts our lives. It tries to brainwash us into believing that this is the only way to live our lives and be happy. Instead of giving us the more freedoms and choices it asserts, it actually takes away the freedoms and choices to think for ourselves, and to decide the life we want to live.

    The same principles and practices of Consumerism, also applies to the political arena. Think about it. What if half of the Democratic Candidates debated their policies at a garbage tip in Houston, and the other half at the Waldorf Astoria in NY, which candidate's policies will be more effective to the citizens? If people are bombarded with negative information, slurs, slander, smears, or hostile attacks on any one candidate, how do you think that candidate will perform? Truth, facts, or natural laws do not apply here.

    We all need to be more diligent in protecting our Democracy from the threats it faces from within. It only takes minimum effort, but maximum understanding.
     
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  16. God & Country

    God & Country Well-Known Member

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    Did you read it or just dismiss it out of hand? Either way this is all I need to know about you.
     
  17. ChristopherABrown

    ChristopherABrown Well-Known Member

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    Excellent post! I agree very much with your position on consumerism and materialism.

    Media serving corporate interests has exploited human nature for 3 generations. There is no reversing it until the END of the abridging of the PURPOSE of free speech is effected.

    No, we are talking about democratic control by signature on lawful petition.

    I’ve studied A5 for 20 years. There has never been an A5 because co great always amends BEFORE the states unify enough to use the process of A5 outside of congress.

    The states can have conventions within them, propose Amendments back and forth. If 3/4 ratify, congress and the court have no authority.

    This is what we need. They are both infiltrated.

    The reserve does rights doctrine was First Nations Law and impressed the framers very much.

    Because we do not know the future, we do not know what rights we will require to meet our needs. The 9th serves to make our society able to adapt to changing conditions.

    Like I’ve said, the 9th is not taught in schools so that “scholars” can credibly misrepresent it’s purpose.

    This will require state Citizens to control their states. After Citizens end the abrdging of the PURPOSE of free speech they will have the authority to do this. No way now.



    They only do not apply because the people have not formed a majority upon them. When they are also law, the people gain immense power.

    Once a candidate accepts we have the right to alter or abolish and that free speech serves to enable the unity to do it and people vote for them; if they go back on that, it is treason against the people and the constitution.

    Correct. And understanding our own nature, DNA, natural law that is also constitutional law is the path to effective unity.
     
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  18. Truly Enlightened

    Truly Enlightened Active Member

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    My wife and I have received at least three letters from Russian dissenters, highlighting American beliefs and ideologies in a positive way. Normally, I would ignore the opinion of a KGB's concerns about our western rights and freedoms, simply out of relevance. I never dismiss anything a poster takes the time to post. It also allows me some insight into why the poster thinks the way they do. I did not read the section on his life's story, because of its relevance, or its connection in addressing anything in my post.

    Have you any idea of the war atrocities, our corporate and military imperialism, our illegal regime change policies, our unlawful sanctioning of sovereign countries, our illegal foreign occupation of sovereign countries, our manufactured consent and lies to the public, our dissemination of disinformation, our arming anyone who can afford to buy our weapons, and the blatant disregard to the purpose and aim of our Constitution? The KGB's beliefs about American social and political ideologies, are NOT a true depiction of what America now stands for. Therefore, his opinions are based entirely on political and social fallacies, about America.

    The one clear point he referenced, is that all wars suck, no matter how well-intentioned they are. Wars create suffering, fear, economic instability, and hate. No one wins from war. This is why I support Tulsi Gabbard. Getting us out of all wars around the globe, is the first step for a peace on earth. No other issue is possible without stopping all these wasteful, unnecessary, and costly wars first. Why are we still in Syria, Iraq, Turkey, Iran, Saudi Arabia, and Afghanistan? We were never asked. We have no allegiance to Turkey, the Kurds, or Syria. How would we feel if any of these countries occupied our American soil?

    Clearly your non-response dismissed my entire post. You addressed not even one issue I raised. Out of respect, I addressed all of your concerns. I also expect the same level of respect. If not, I consider this your swan song.
     
  19. God & Country

    God & Country Well-Known Member

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    Now who's spinning from their imagination? America has always been a great benefactor in both money and blood. I would like to remind you of the sacrifices made in two world wars. Your accusations about atrocities and imperialism and the rest are old saws, nothing new and oft repeated clap trap. Unless you have some personal information on this matter you're disseminating disinformation.
    Our involvement in these "wars" started in Viet Nam and I would remind you that it was initiated by Democrats and it wasn't just good intentions gone awry. In the time since you must look at who authorized these actions and why before you jump to the imperialism thing.
     
  20. Truly Enlightened

    Truly Enlightened Active Member

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    I am also a veteran of the Viet Nam war. I'm afraid that the lives of my fellow soldiers and the innocent victims of wars, is much more important to me, than the fear of exposing the inconvenient truth. As my wife has told me for years, I have very little in the way of an imagination. Especially, when the truth is far worse than anything that I could ever imagine. It is you who is suffering from "Nationalistic Denialism", not me. We went into Viet Nam on a lie(Bay of Tonkin Incident), which killed over two million people. We went into Iraq over a lie(WMD's), which killed 288,000 people. We went to Afghanistan on a lie(Sept 11 attacks), where almost 5000 peopled were killed. Lets not forget the atrocities committed in the My Lai massacre, the Abu Ghraib prisoner torture and abuse, Guantanamo Bay, and the millions of women and children killed because of our crippling sanctions. There are also countless videos of American troops committing war crimes and atrocities in every war, including WWII. So, whether atrocities were committed by all sides, is a question that is beyond dispute.

    You don't seem to have any idea why America is forced to continue these regime-change wars, do you? Do you think that we go to war with these countries to help them? Okay, name me just one country we have helped because of our intervention? Just one. You can choose from over 73 countries in Africa, South America, Central America, Europe, or the Middle East. Surely, after 75 years of being a "great benefactor in both money and blood", at least one country should be better off because of our sacrifice. Like Orwell said, "..war is not meant to be won, it is meant to be continuous.".

    Tulsi is the only person that will stop this madness, which is blowing out our total debt(160 Trillion dollars). Why don't people see the obvious? Corporations are getting richer, and we are getting poorer. Greed will always be the enemy of democracy. Just what is it going to take, a nuclear winter? She is truly our last hope, and I pray everyday, that she makes it, If her and Bernie were the ticket, it would be a whitewash. All wars would end, and countries could begin to rebuild again. Both parties are responsible for these wars. And, both parties must share the guilt. Especially, since we seem to want to keep repeating history.

    If the people ignore it, then we will are doomed to keep repeating the same mistakes. All we need is the right leadership.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2019
  21. God & Country

    God & Country Well-Known Member

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    that would be putting all your eggs in one basket, good luck with that.
    I am not obscenely wealthy but I am comfortable. I was not born to wealth but I amassed some wealth, invested some, became wealthier, invested more and so on. I have not gotten poorer and when you say we, who are you talking about? Corporations are wealthier by the same aforementioned system that I used except with more money to invest. This is America and if you or anyone else has not acquired some wealth they only have themselves to blame not corporations. In fact I never got a job from some poor person, my wealth is a result of taking advantage of an opportunity offered to me by a corporation albeit on the very bottom wrung. It is always those on the left who rush to vilify corporate America for all of America's ills instead of looking inward. America was built on capitalism, it is not perfect, but it is the only system that works for the American way of life. You accuse me of being a nationalist, thank you, I wasn't always so, didn't have to be but I am now. I'm not in denial of anything, I know first hand what some corporations are guilty of but you paint all of them with the same brush. Look around, it doesn't take much to recognize the grandest nation in the history of the world. It isn't magic, this wealth didn't just burst out of nothing into existence it exists because of American industry and the extraordinary men who created it. I can tell you this, of all the truly wealthy people I know not one has become so on ill gotten gains and are more interested in the well being of their fellow Americans than any soap box liberal. These are people who give away more money than the wealth of some small nations but they do it because it is the right thing to do and not for political purposes. America changed course in 2016 and Donald Trump was elected not because people suddenly fell in love with him but because of a collective epiphany about who was running the country. Trump was the slamming of the brakes on what these people where doing to America. Ms. Gabbard is just another one of those people, I'm sorry to say it but it's true. We need to stay the course and flush the DC sewer and the only way forward is an outsider, a boorish, crude, unlikeable lout, who is also smarter than anyone with a D after their name.
     
  22. carlberky

    carlberky Active Member

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    Of course not. Don't mention it.
     
  23. carlberky

    carlberky Active Member

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    Now who is painting with a broad brush? Stay the course and help make the sewer bigger, since it's gotten stuffed in the last few years.
     
  24. rahl

    rahl Banned

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    No. Citizens aren’t state citizens. They are US citizens. The 14th amendment incorporates the bill of rights to the states. The supremacy clause places federal law above state law. This is basic 6th grade civics.
     
  25. carlberky

    carlberky Active Member

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    Would you apply that to someone whose crime involved a gun?
     

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