What are Liberal's position on higher corporate taxes causing business to move overseas?

Discussion in 'Budget & Taxes' started by kazenatsu, Feb 22, 2018.

  1. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    If a US company cannot compete with offshore labor then go down another path.

    Explain why a trade imbalance is a bad thing?

    Just because you impose tariffs or are against foreign labor, it is unlikely you can force labor in the US. Free trade is free trade without strings. The US can impose 100% tariffs on many imported items but there's no guarantee that these items will then be produced in the USA. The US unemployment rate is supposedly at what...4.5%...so most people have jobs who want to work. Not sure how you define 'good jobs'?

    No one is making higher paid workers compete with lower paid workers? US business decides what areas they can compete.

    There's no 'race to the bottom'??
     
  2. Reiver

    Reiver Well-Known Member

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    Its a bad thing, by definition (as it would need destabilising currency change to solve). Trade deficits? That's a different kettle of fish!
     
  3. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    Who is 'they'?
    Who has a 'strategy'?
    No one brings in Mexicans?
    The ONLY reason the US has immigrant labor is because Americans refuse to do the work.
    Business is not making business decisions, like hiring immigrants, for the good of the nation?
    Why not have Americans stop buying imports? Americans want stuff that is not made in the USA, most of which will never be made in the USA.
    We have the same trades taking place between US states, US cities...almost identical to foreign trade but Americans don't complain about this...
     
  4. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    Who cares what happens in another country?
    In the US all corporations pay applicable taxes on their taxable income...
     
  5. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    Existing unions have found some equilibrium with union-haters. Since they are not greatly expanding we can assume they are too weak but unions have found that today they cannot 'force' unions. It needs to grow from within...
     
  6. Reiver

    Reiver Well-Known Member

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    You say nothing. We go back to what you have to ignore: countries with much stronger unionisation have more successful manufacturing. Until you question 'why?', you're on a loser.
     
  7. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    I don't see how it can be a bad thing unless the imports are critical to the survival of the nation, like a nation who must import nearly all of their food. A trade imbalance on non-essential items should be acceptable because people can stop at any time consuming such items. Like in the USA, why should we care that we might import 100% of kiwi fruit consumed?
     
  8. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    I'd say the US is doing fine...
     
  9. Reiver

    Reiver Well-Known Member

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    Its about definitions. Trade deficits aint a bad thing. Trade imbalances, however, refer to the need for a structural change. In standard language it would be a simple exchange rate correction. Not so with the US! That sore of outcome could provoke economic collapse.
     
  10. Reiver

    Reiver Well-Known Member

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    Imagine how better it could be with union power supporting manfuacturing?
     
  11. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    Right now I'm imagining it's dinner time and I'm hungry...
     
  12. Reiver

    Reiver Well-Known Member

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    I'll put in easy terms. Without unions, you've got a ***** drooping sandwich
     
  13. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member

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    Then you miss the whole point. They pay less taxes because they're in another country. They can still sell to the U.S. without having their corporation there by setting up another corporation.
    Corporate taxes don't work like sales tax, you don't pay tax in proportion to the cost of how much you sell.

    Why don't you get this? What part of this don't you understand?




    They're only paying taxes on the profits from the sales part of their corporation, not the manufacturing part, even though that's where most of the profits are.

    If you think "it doesn't matter" then why not get rid of corporate taxation entirely for corporations that don't sell directly to the end consumer. That's basically what YOU are advocating for, except only for foreign companies. (even if you don't realize it)

    I've explained again and again how foreign corporations making profit from the U.S. don't have to pay taxes because those profits were officially not made in the U.S.

    Are you able to see the difference? "from" and "in"
    Not quite the same thing.

    It's called unfair competition.

    The same foreign corporation can just split their corporation into two and sell to themselves, locating half the corporation in the U.S. The profits made from their manufacturing half are just counted as expenses by their sales half. The sales half, which is the half actually operating in the U.S. is the only part that pays taxes. It matters what happens in another country because those corporations have access to U.S. markets. People will buy products from the country with the lower taxes because that often means they can offer lower prices. By only taxing production that happens in the U.S. you're incentivizing production to shift to where those taxes do not exist.
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2018
  14. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    I disagree...unions can disappear tomorrow and life goes on...
     
  15. Reiver

    Reiver Well-Known Member

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    We'd just be worse off...
     
  16. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    All corporations in the US pay applicable taxes. Assuming all corporations follow tax laws all of them pay applicable taxes. If you believe someone is violating US tax law then report them.

    Please provide the name of a corporation that does not pay applicable US income taxes?

    I'm not advocating any tax policy? All corporations function to the same tax codes.

    Please provide the name of a corporation that is functioning in the US with 'unfair competition'?
     
  17. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member

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    And corporations outside the US don't have to pay those taxes but their products can still be sold into the U.S. market. That's what tariff barriers would be for.

    You don't have a problem with tariff barriers, do you? It's in another country, so why should it matter?

    If you don't support equal corporate taxation then you should support tariffs.
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2018
  18. Reiver

    Reiver Well-Known Member

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    The idea that corporation taxes provide any justification for tariffs is laughable and inconsistent with any notion of valid economic comment.
     
  19. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    Please provide the name of a corporation that does not pay applicable US income taxes?

    I'm not advocating any tax policy? All corporations function to the same tax codes.

    Please provide the name of a corporation that is functioning in the US with 'unfair competition'?

    I hate tariffs unless a nation is purposely trying to undermine a specify industry or product.

    I support the tax laws which apply to all US business...
     

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