What's happened to all the manufacturing jobs?

Discussion in 'Economics & Trade' started by LafayetteBis, Jan 26, 2017.

  1. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    Look at any graph of the decline in union memebership since 1950.. Its practically vertical.
     
  2. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well put.

    "The Future of Demand" is a well written article that describes how Consumer Demand will change given the advent of the Information Age and, most importantly, the increased usage of female employees.

    It is interesting to scroll down to page 8 and this topic: "Profile 2: Female consumption power" - where the nature of consumption shows changes that will occur ...
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2017
  3. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well, despite the fact that Unions deserve it, their decline in importance remains a great shame.

    They simply have not improved their "Demand for services", having all too often focused uniquely upon pay-scales in companies closing down because their product-niche was migrating to China.

    Yes, people want a decent income for their work - but it seems now that even that is threatened by the very fact that "their work is obsolete".

    Unions can respond by negotiating on behalf of workers not only pay-grade but the ability to learn new skills and competencies. (Either in-house, or outside in state-schools).

    Companies are going up-market in terms of their skills-needs - there is no doubt about it. But, companies can be made to contribute to solving that problem by undertaking the cost of Competence Enhancement in its work-force.

    No doubt, it would help also if those costs were made corporate tax-deductibles ...
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2017
  4. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    I have no use for unions today...
     
  5. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    Actually today and into the future there is very little 'manufacturing' being done in the USA. We don't really make much from scratch...with our hands. What we mostly do today in the USA is final assembly of subcomponents which are mostly produced offshore. Sure there remains some fringe manufacturing in the USA but not at levels that will ever create millions more middle class paying jobs. And when we're mostly doing assembly this is a process which fits nicely with robotics and automation which further exacerbates the need for more labor...
     
  6. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    Actually, there is alot MORE manufacturing in the US today with fewer workers. I don't have time to look it up again.
     
  7. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    That's exactly what my post said...about manufacturing jobs...we no longer build stuff with our hands...so robotics and automation come into play...which translates to less labor needed in 'manufacturing' type work. Of course we need more labor in other types of jobs but most American workers do not qualify for these types of jobs...
     
  8. Kenny Naicuslik

    Kenny Naicuslik Member

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    What happened is that your federal government raised the minimum wage which makes it more economically viable for big multinationals to outsource cheap jobs to cheap countries. You destroyed your own economy by voting on Democrats.
     
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  9. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    Your comments are absurd...the national minimum wage law is just about meaningless when it comes to the cost of doing business in the USA...
     
  10. ibobbrob

    ibobbrob Well-Known Member

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    In my view, the bath and alarm clock part, although necessary for gainful employment, is questionable. However, the responsible adult
    part is right on.
     
  11. Roon

    Roon Well-Known Member

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    In the Auto manufacturing example you need to look no further than the unions to understand why "the big three" lost and jobs disappeared.

    Unions necessarily increase unemployment. As the cost of labor rises it becomes prudent to replace labor with capital (automation).

    Foreign manufacturers simply beat Detroit to the punch and by the time they caught up they had lost market share, needed to retool and start over.
     
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  12. james M

    james M Banned

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    not really libcommies want to set it at $15 which would have a chilling affect everywhere!
     
  13. james M

    james M Banned

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    In part because libcommie govt made labor, benefits, firing, taxes so diffficult
     
  14. ibobbrob

    ibobbrob Well-Known Member

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    A $15 minimum wage has everything to do with the cost of doing business. The minimum wage is a learning wage and not an earning
    wage. If unskilled workers are paid a starting wage of $15, what happens to the skilled workers who have been with the company
    and whose wages will be much closer to the minimum wage? They will have to be given comparable increases since they are skilled
    or morale will plummet, and many would quit or develop poor performances. California is the exception, since one needs $150,000
    to live there. An $18 minimum wage has much less effect on the skilled workers in that state.
     
  15. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    The comment is about current MW rates which are basically meaningless since almost no one pays $7.25/hour...
     
  16. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    Another stupid comment...how about with your finite wisdom you build yourself a laptop computer identical to an Apple MacPro...using ONLY your hands...
     
  17. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    The comment was about current MW rates being meaningless. I'm 100% against $15 or higher MW...
     
  18. james M

    james M Banned

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    lots of factories all over the world still use manual labor especially where it is very very cheap. in USA it is made very unnecessarily expensive by liberal govt interferance
     
  19. Ashwin Poonawal

    Ashwin Poonawal Active Member

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    Machines produce more, raising the standard of living. In an isolated economy all levels of labor benefit from this by diminishing rate, from top to bottom. This in itself is a good thing. That is why our labor is so expensive. But the recent trend of globalization, which is unstoppable, tends to even out the world-wide labor rate, by having mature economies exporting jobs. Trump's gestures of blocking globalization are futile, and divert our focus from the real solution, which is to shift emphasis to newer and higher technologies, like green energy, transportation technology, defense technology, and information technology. His efforts of enticing/forcing American manufacturing to remain in the country, and encouraging fossil fuel energy by rejecting the green house effect issue, is an effort to revert to our 'glorious' past. But past never repeats. Life can only move forward.
     
  20. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    Wake up!! Everything in the USA costs more than it does anywhere else in the world! It makes no difference all the crap you dream up about manufacturing because if the business model is not viable then industry seeks other options. When they run out of options they go off-shore or close the doors. And if you do some research you'll find that it's not always labor costs that force industry to look outside of the USA. Lastly, there is very little manual labor in an Apple MacPro computer...most of it is automated because humans cannot possibly do the work! There is NO 'liberal govt interference'!
     
  21. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    "Less than half (45%) of the 2.6 million hourly workers who were at or below the federal minimum in 2015 were ages 16 to 24."
    "About 20.6 million people (or 30% of all hourly, non-self-employed workers 18 and older) are “near-minimum-wage” workers."

    http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/01/04/5-facts-about-the-minimum-wage/

    "Opponents of raising the minimum wage, like Furchtgott-Roth, argue that these workers are young teens — half are under 25, she says — who are working jobs supplemental to their families’ income; poor families they are not necessarily. That’s no longer the case, disputes Bernstein. In a report he helped prepare for the Economic Policy Institute, Bernstein cited data from the Congressional Budget Office describing the average minimum wage worker as full-time and 35 years old."

    http://www.pbs.org/newshour/making-sense/undisputed-facts-minimum-wage/

    "Eighty-eight percent of workers who would be affected by raising the minimum wage are at least 20 years old, and a third of them are at least 40 years old."

    http://www.epi.org/publication/wage-workers-older-88-percent-workers-benefit/
     
  22. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    And it's all manufactured by the same companies, which should tell you that prices are not based on costs of manufacture, or on supply and demand, but on what the manufacturer can get out of you! This also called "what the market will bear, like EpiPens for $300 when they cost $8 to make.
     
  23. james M

    james M Banned

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    of course that makes no sense. If things were more expensive here we'd be the poorest people not the richest
     
  24. james M

    james M Banned

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    like thats typical rather than a 1 in a million exception? Most stuff sells for pennys over cost, if not a competitior will under sell you and drive you onto bankruptcy. You have learned this lesson 67 times now.
     
  25. james M

    james M Banned

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    Reasons intelligent people oppose minimum wage:

    1) makes it illegal to employ people not worth minimum wage
    2) raise prices for poor people who often shop where minimum wage folks work
    3) speeds up automation and replacement of minimum wage jobs
    4) teaches workers that you get ahead with govt violence rather than being worth more
    5) raises prices, reduces demand, and thus reduces employment
    6) makes American workers even less competitive with foreign workers
    7) makes a huge % of work force (42%) minimum age workers with no incentive to improve their skills.
    8) speeds up transition from high density brick and mortar employment to low density on line employment
    9) encourages govt to enact more libsocialist policies to get more votes from the supposed beneficiaries
     

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