What's Up With Australia

We don't know what will happen next, but it looks like a choice between a roller-coaster ride of peaks and dips and a one-and-done "Get 'er done," at the moment....at least to Texans. We have excess hospital capacity, except for the southern border towns, and border people can be flown to hospitals outside their region if that is the family's choice for the elderly with pre-existing conditions who are unlikely to make it.

 

I was almost speechless there for a minute, until I realized Texas is at one and point five and hoping that's enough.

 

You can't really compare border states like Texas, Arizona and California to a virtual island like Australia. We offer medical care to anyone who shows up at emergency rooms whether they are U.S. residents and citizens, or not. It would be difficult for non-Australian citizens to walk or drive to the border seeking, and be accepted, for health care. Australia would not have the excess hospital capacity to deal with the situation, if it existed.

 

Yeah, and the Cuban's are swimming into Florida.

 

Geography is cool...

 

Florida has tourism, retirees (old people) and New York snowbirds.

 

Actually that's not accurate. We always had our international borders open to returning citizens, that has never changed. But, anyone coming in is locked up in quarantine for 14 days .. by law - citizens included. The breach in quarantine only happened in one state. In other states there have been no breaches of quarantine, and so no further COVID.

As for 'severe' lockdown, ours was nowhere near as severe as it could (and probably should) have been. We remain hopeful that stronger measures are taken if it gets out into the community in other states. The outbreak state has already moved up to stage 4 restrictions .. whereas the nation has only had stage 3 up until now.

 

Okay, I'll defend the Texas governor for requiring masks to avoid another complete authoritarian shut down. You defend Australia for giving parts of your country only four reasons to go outside, including banning exercise.

And your country did have a quota on citizens returning to your country almost a month ago, regardless of whether they had to quarantine or not.

 

I have no especial faith in a pending vaccine. If we get one, great. If not, we need to know NOW how to handle the inevitable next pandemic. All nations with food insecurity or an interest in globalism, need to figure out a way to survive these lockdowns. These pandemics are not going away .. new viruses are increasing, just like their hosts (humans!), aided/abetted by constant movement. These are unprecedented conditions with no equivalent in history, thanks to profligate travel. IOW, consider this a full dress rehearsal for much worse.

Talking of the health of small business and freedoms, is like discussing whether to turn the lights off before escaping a burning building. It only makes sense to be concerned about those things when everything is perfect (iow, when the building isn't burning). We need to learn new ways to keep everyone fed etc, NOW. It's a very steep learning curve, but has to happen alongside mitigation. Our Govts should be working on it as we speak. If they're not, they're failing badly. Something to keep in mind next time you vote.

 

How does your freedom serve you when everything is closed, no one has any money and/or jobs, and people are dying because they can't get proper care for non-COVID health issues?

You're talking about a freedom which is effectively equivalent to choosing to let some crazed despot keep doing his thing, instead of fighting him. If you want future freedom, you have to fight. That's how wars work.

 

Absolutely. Our governments have specific jobs and our vote should be according to how they address the needs of the people. The federal government is responsible for national and border defense, international trade policy, energy infrastructure, and agriculture self sufficiency. If they do those things, we can ignore the rest of the world for a little while. We would have tremendous bargaining power.

 

Sure there are quotas, since we can't accommodate many thousands in quarantine at a given time. It has to be staggered. That's just logistics.

And yes, I absolutely defend those restrictions. IMO, they're too lenient. I'd prefer the harsher New Zealand approach. Most of us would, remember. Most of us want it ended. We've tasted the glory, so we know what's possible.

 

Not only that, but America is rated as food secure. You can feed everyone, if it comes to that.

 

We're not a virtual island, we ARE an island. And no, we don't provide free medical care to non-citizens (outside of initial emergency life/death treatment). That's how we're able to afford high quality care to all citizens via public health.

 

Other than when I was sick, I haven't missed a day of work since this started. Since early March, I've been working 55 hours per week. The shutdown orders have been on the state level. Very few businesses have been shut down for long in Texas. Bars are the biggest exception. Even restaurants and some bars have been selling carryout and delivery service.

 

Yes, well, I understand that you are also in favor of not allowing any immigrants into Australia ever, so you are a Nationalist/Protectionist. I can empathize with your point of view on that, though I think the U.S. can still allow some immigration from other countries. And regardless of our immigration "laws", we have a very hard time enforcing them because we are not an island.

 

I get that that's what has been happening, but if the numbers keep increasing that won't last. I'm asking what your freedoms will do for you when it gets to that point. When there is massive unemployment, no money, and an overloaded healthcare sector?

 

On the contrary, I'm all for merit-based immigration. If someone is able to self-fund for a minimum of five years (in case they can't work, as they should be ineligible for govt assistance for the same period), and are qualified for fields in which we need people, they're very welcome.

I'm also in favour of accepting bonafide refugees - IOW, when Australia is their nearest safe harbour, and when they are escaping immediate and direct physical harm. Those traversing even one safe harbour (whether via air, land, or sea) should never be accepted, since it's clear that they're economic migrants, not refugees. I've worked with the real thing, and know that the genuine don't care where they go, as long as they and their family are physically safe.

 

Our governor will shut down more activity again if the hospitals reach capacity. That's the main thing we're aiming for (hospital capacity) since there is no way to "wipe out" the virus. It will keep coming back to us either way. We are not an island.

 

so far, we've managed to flatten the hospitalization curve every time it has spiked. We have opened up with gradually increasing occupancy, mandatory masks, and social distancing. It's not perfect and not everyone gets to go back to work, but it keeps most businesses open.

 

If it wasn't for a bad bat we would all be home free.

 

Okay. Perhaps I confused you with someone else who was a Nationalist and generally opposed to tourists and immigrants. Not taking time to search your prior posts for quotes.

 

If "bad bat" were your pet, you'd name him "TrumpBat" and I would call him "Xi PingBat". LOL

 

That's today though .. tomorrow it could (probably will) be worse.

 

You could close your borders, other nations have. Vietnam is not only not an island, but shares a border with CHINA of all places - yet they have virtually wiped out COVID. Jordan ditto, and also not an island. Thailand and Greece, same.