Who does a $15 an hour minimum wage help?

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by doombug, May 2, 2018.

  1. doombug

    doombug Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 19, 2012
    Messages:
    56,871
    Likes Received:
    22,778
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Here is a video that explains the situation very well:


    For the naysayers who claim the video is wrong and is just propaganda, what is explained is already happening:
    https://www.google.com/amp/abc7ny.c...wants-surcharge-to-counter-pay-hikes/3395935/

    Are those who push a $15 an hour minimum wage clueless?

    It seems the liberal progressive answers to problems is more of the problems. The answer to poverty is more poverty. They seem to believe if everyone cannot be wealthy the no one should be wealthy.
     
  2. Stevew

    Stevew Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2015
    Messages:
    6,501
    Likes Received:
    2,613
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Excellent video.

    Steve
     
    ButterBalls likes this.
  3. ECA

    ECA Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2018
    Messages:
    31,942
    Likes Received:
    15,602
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Seems silly to make such a huge jump all at once. No need to go from avg of $7.25 to $15. I have no problem with increasing minimum wage but let's take small steps
     
    CCitizen and ibobbrob like this.
  4. Stevew

    Stevew Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2015
    Messages:
    6,501
    Likes Received:
    2,613
    Trophy Points:
    113

    Democrats have run out of time to make small steps. They've been losing elections SINCE 2010 and now need some major election wins to recover losses, somehow. Even if it means outright lying to the people.

    Steve
     
    ButterBalls likes this.
  5. tkolter

    tkolter Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2012
    Messages:
    7,134
    Likes Received:
    598
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    And as a disabled person its hard enough now to get work on the books if you have both physical and cognitive/mental disabilities in enough ways to bring down your employability and now your telling employers to pay us fifteen dollars and not a fit person who brings a lot to the table without help adapting who is the better choice with less hassle. I hope they like handing out more welfare to the disabled if this goes through.
     
    CCitizen and 557 like this.
  6. Fangbeer

    Fangbeer Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2011
    Messages:
    10,670
    Likes Received:
    3,709
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I would like to be taller, but I don't need to be 6'5" all in one go. Can we just stretch the length of a foot a little every year?
     
  7. TomFitz

    TomFitz Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2013
    Messages:
    40,413
    Likes Received:
    15,901
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I'm always amused that right wingers need these simplistic cartoons.

    I'm also amused at the two faced nature of their positions.

    Out of one side of their mouths, they denigrate teachers and fast food workers who strike for a living wage, and insiste that everyone is overpaid.

    Out of the other, they vote for people who make empty promises that high pay low skill jobs will magically return to the rust belt (jobs that they themselves used to attack the workers for being overpaid).

    The hypocracy is obvious. But it's also typical.
     
    One Mind, Giftedone, DavidMK and 2 others like this.
  8. Fangbeer

    Fangbeer Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2011
    Messages:
    10,670
    Likes Received:
    3,709
    Trophy Points:
    113
    High pay low skill?

    Do you not see the contradiction there?

    Liberals hate heirarchies of value. Over and over they attempt to change the heirarchy by manipulation the tools we use to measure it. Over and over they fail to have the intended impact on the value they want to regulate.

    They need to pay more attention to the simplistic cartoons, because their view is the one that is overly simplistic. Value is not a social construct. You can't control it by fiddling with money.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2018
  9. rcfoolinca288

    rcfoolinca288 Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2016
    Messages:
    14,301
    Likes Received:
    6,629
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    That's called a violation of the ADA act.
     
  10. ocean515

    ocean515 Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2015
    Messages:
    17,908
    Likes Received:
    10,396
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    I'm amused by left wingers who apparently don't care about young people ever getting jobs.

    Remarkable how willingly they abandon people they claim to care about.
     
  11. Fangbeer

    Fangbeer Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2011
    Messages:
    10,670
    Likes Received:
    3,709
    Trophy Points:
    113
    It's not just young people. It's everyone with a wage below 15 for reasons the liberals haven't considered.

    It's a Grandma who wants to sit on a chair at Walmart for 4 hours a day welcoming people to supplement her retirement and to get her out of her empty house. It's a mom with a consignment shop who wants to hire a friend to watch the business nights so she can attend her daughter's dance classes. It's a military vet or a retired police officer with a good pension who just wants to stand in front of a school and protect kids. There are more reasons to work for less than 15 dollars than there are jobs that pay less. Conversely, there's only one reason libs want to eliminate those jobs.
     
    ocean515 likes this.
  12. ocean515

    ocean515 Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2015
    Messages:
    17,908
    Likes Received:
    10,396
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Very good point.

    "Living wage" - What a delusional bit of dog whistle liberal propaganda.
     
    Bondo likes this.
  13. Steady Pie

    Steady Pie Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2012
    Messages:
    24,506
    Likes Received:
    7,247
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Fair enough.

    Ever watched Vox? Ever watched *shudder* Queer Kid Stuff?
     
  14. expatpanama

    expatpanama Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2017
    Messages:
    710
    Likes Received:
    229
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Reality is that minimum wage laws do not require employers to raise wages, they simply make it illegal to employ low pay workers. Since no employer can pay more in wages than the value that the labor brings in, the low value employee has to get fired.
    While the extreme left may say that wages must be 'more equal', everyone (including our Marxist colleagues) turn right around and happily pay more for talent --for every thing from rock stars to sports greats to the lawyer that keeps 'em out of jail.

    Everyone has to either pay more for talent or else they end up w/ bad music, lost games'n'matches, and then they go to jail.
     
    Longshot and 557 like this.
  15. Bow To The Robots

    Bow To The Robots Banned at Members Request

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2009
    Messages:
    25,855
    Likes Received:
    5,926
    Trophy Points:
    113
    It helps nobody. You could set the wage at $50,000/hr. and those at the bottom will always be at the bottom. The market is an elastic entity that responds organically to inputs over time. The low wage earner may experience a temporary increase in spending power, but it will quickly be erased as prices rise in response to the increase in the input known as payroll.

    Better to encourage people to obtain a marketable skill rather than just artificially raise the value of their labor. This is the only way to lift them out of poverty.
     
    ibobbrob and James Knapp like this.
  16. Guyzilla

    Guyzilla Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2016
    Messages:
    13,230
    Likes Received:
    2,062
    Trophy Points:
    113
    George Soros? I win the internets.
     
    rcfoolinca288 likes this.
  17. Bow To The Robots

    Bow To The Robots Banned at Members Request

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2009
    Messages:
    25,855
    Likes Received:
    5,926
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Better to eliminate minimum wage and let the market dictate the true value of a given job.
     
    557 and Bondo like this.
  18. Guyzilla

    Guyzilla Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2016
    Messages:
    13,230
    Likes Received:
    2,062
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Better for who? Not the guy that has to survive, nor the taxpayer that has to SUBSIDIZE your enforced slavery.
     
    ronv, DavidMK and rcfoolinca288 like this.
  19. Bow To The Robots

    Bow To The Robots Banned at Members Request

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2009
    Messages:
    25,855
    Likes Received:
    5,926
    Trophy Points:
    113
    No. Better for that guy. He will have to obtain a skill that increases the value of his labor.
     
    ibobbrob and Bondo like this.
  20. ECA

    ECA Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2018
    Messages:
    31,942
    Likes Received:
    15,602
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Don't agree with that.
     
    FreshAir likes this.
  21. Guyzilla

    Guyzilla Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2016
    Messages:
    13,230
    Likes Received:
    2,062
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Yes, you frame your druthers correctly. Do or die. Cull the poor. They CHOOSE to starve.
     
    rcfoolinca288 likes this.
  22. Idahojunebug77

    Idahojunebug77 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2017
    Messages:
    1,155
    Likes Received:
    655
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Increasing the minimum wage benefits the big box stores and national chains, it hurts the small independent businesses and their employees, especially in the rural towns.

    Small businesses with a slim profit margin shut down and the employees must either move to the city, or commute, to find work. This often increases the employees cost of living greater than the increase in pay.
     
  23. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2016
    Messages:
    26,311
    Likes Received:
    7,461
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    It's a pitch. I can refute every point in the video but I won't waste my time unless someone asks about some specific point. I'll just say that the claim that employers can't afford to pay higher wages is refuted by three points:

    1) Remember that income disparity has become huge? Most of the new income for over 30 years has gone to the top, hence income and wealth disparity that is out of control. They could have shared it and we would have avoided the disparity.

    2) Remember this?...
    https://www.epi.org/files/2012/ib330-figureA.png.538

    3) I like to look at extreme examples in order to bring out principles at work. So consider a business that an entrepreneur wants to start and he says it can be profitable with workers being paid $1.50/hour today. Should we let him go into business with that business plan? -an income of $3,000/year for working 40 hours every week? Suppose unemployment is very high at the time. Who would apply when they can get more on public assistance?

    If a business cannot operate while paying workers a living wage of enough that they do not qualify for any public assistance, that business should not be allowed to operate. Capitalist's profits are not that important.

    Also, the video mentions that a $15/hour minimum wage is already in place for NY, D.C., CA, and Seattle. Has the right abandoned their reverence for states' rights? Those states and cities did it for a reason, and they are all high-cost areas to live in. Hence they require higher pay. But the resistance to $15/hour is a lie, like most RW BS is. Those calls for $15 just about all call for something around $12 today with a program/policy to increment that to $15 by some year in the future.

    Summary: this thread is a right wing effort to preserve the impoverishment of the people in order to assure the extremely wealthy of greater wealth to come.
     
    gamewell45 likes this.
  24. Heartburn

    Heartburn Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2015
    Messages:
    13,499
    Likes Received:
    4,973
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Working the counter or the grill in a fast food place is not supposed to provide a living wage. It's an entry level position for teens or perhaps teachers during their summer vacation.
     
  25. Bow To The Robots

    Bow To The Robots Banned at Members Request

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2009
    Messages:
    25,855
    Likes Received:
    5,926
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Please explain.
     

Share This Page