This is more of a philosophical question than a religious one. Masturbating and having sex is something most people enjoy doing but there seems to be this cultural need to shame people for it. The reason why I don't accept the religious side of it is because it's quite common within secular things for there to be shame and guilt associated with it. I've broken the shackles of that guilt cycle and looking at it from this side it seems almost cult like and almost everybody engages in it religious or not. So I would like to hear your theory as to why we shame people for this sort of thing.
My theory is that controlling sexual behavior is a societal benefit, which is why you see traditional societies all over the world that control sexual behavior through their cultures in pretty much the same way. There is an institution called marriage, it's considered a societal expectation that nearly everyone will get married. Cultures seem to take a great interest in protecting women and girl's sexuality (less so for dudes). I'm thinking it has to do with assurance of paternity and preventing the type of chaos that results when everyone is banging everyone.
but it doesn't control sexual behavior simply causes neuroticism. 90% of people masturbate and 10% of people lie about masturbating so many people feel ashamed for it doesn't stop it from happening it just causes people to feel like there's something wrong with them for being human. happily ever after is a fairy tale. I think marriage would have more validity if it wasn't used by the state to control people. so you have to shame people for having sexual urges to convince them not to have those in order to protect them from what? Breeding? Why is breeding dangerous? wouldn't this be a reason to encourage masturbation so that someone doesn't feel the need to seek to fulfill the desire with people outside of the couple? Your argument here isn't making sense. Sexual desire is a fundamental biological component of life. If we didn't have that in society would be over you probably wouldn't exist. Isn't gratifying those urges by yourself controlling your sexuality? I recall being about 14 and one thing occupied about 90% of my thoughts the only way I was capable of satisfying that urge was finding someone else to do it for me then there'd be a lot more pregnant teenagers and you wouldn't be protecting anybody's sexuality that would be destroying it.
Well I'm sorry if my argument doesn't make sense to you, but you touched on it a bit (pun not intended) with your comment about being 14 and that one thing occupied 90% of your thoughts. Yeah, that's the human condition. Where I'm coming from is this: We are animals. Intelligent animals sure, but animals none the less. Without culture and all the trappings of society that we've constructed, human sexuality would pretty much resemble the sex lives of the Great Apes, gorillas, and chimpanzees. So there would be an alpha ape that would get all the chicks, and everyone else would be scrambling. In other words, for males, it would work out for a few, and suck for the majority, and for females they would get to share with a bunch of other women. A society with marriage allows the vast majority to get their share of the sexual pie, men get their own women, and women don't have to share a man. So I think all of those cultural aspects that have evolved over thousands of years evolved for a reason: cultural stability, in a way that helps the most people. I'm unclear what vision you have for human society in which there is no marriage, and no sexual norms.
it's not that it doesn't make sense to me it's that it doesn't follow logic. So humans should be ashamed of being human why? You didn't answer that question you made excuses. this is a disconnect you're having here I never said we just given the anarchy. I spoke about being 14 and how 90% of my thoughts were consumed by something doesn't change just because you make someone feel ashamed of it all it does is create neuroticism and impotence. So I think you're arguing against someone else not anything I said. marriage doesn't do any such thing. Just because the man marries a woman doesn't mean she sleeps with him it doesn't mean she doesn't sleep with other men. Tell all the men that divorced their wives over infidelity that marriage restricts that it doesn't. Disagree. Some cultural standards yes not all of them. Something seem to be made up by people who were perverts themselves and thought that punishing everyone else would be away to fix themselves this is very very common among sexual concepts. You're unclear because you are making up a straw man and you're confusing that with what I said. Why do we make people feel shame for masturbating or for wanting sex it has nothing to do with the marriage in fact it may help. That's a far cry from the complete anarchy straw man you fabricated I don't know where you got that from. Maybe you didn't understand my original post.
If God was really offended in any way by human sexuality, He would have simply made Humans with a one week window for reproduction, and then killed the sex drive for the rest of the year ... He didn't. End of story.
We are in fact animals. There are those that think we're not really. That we are somehow above the fray. Sorry, we are not. Our sex drive is as strong as our drive to find food, i.e., pretty strong. Given the right circumstances, we will kill for a moldy slice of bread. Suppressing our sex drive often leads to various perversions. Kids, boys, feet, whatever, you name it. Lil Mike mention the sexual actions of apes and chimps. There were, maybe still are, places where humans act the same way. The Mormons of yesteryear, for instance. Over all, humans are serial monogamists. We hook up for a few years, then drift apart, find other partners... The spike of divorces at 10 and 20 years, are behind this trait. But find the right person and the relationship can stay strong and last a lifetime. So our actions are not so cut and dried. Humans are actually all over the map sexually. That's why we have an over populated this planet.
OK I think I misunderstood your intent for this thread. I thought you wanted to discuss the general tendency of societies to regulate sexual behavior, and it seems you are really more interested in masturbation.
Not just masturbation and other sexual behaviors but don't take it away yes you should read the opening post.
people masturbate because being naughty is far more fun than following the rules! On a more serious note sounds like left overs that came from back when procreation was part of a necessary fabric of building societies.
My thought is that folks are jealous of other folks' fun. And because they might not feel the need, they feel the entitlement to judge. I've seen it often. In both religious and non religious contexts. Some people just can't stand that others might be having fun... and worse, without them.
Maybe, I think you've touched on something here and I'd like to expand. Maybe they're jealous for you your lack of guilt. Maybe they feel that that guilt they carry around and somehow invalidated for choosing not to.
There is more to it than that. emotional connections are like buckets filled with emotions, they have a certain amount of water in them. it was explained to me that what happens to people when they jerk it they use up some or at some point all of that water, much the same as cheating on someone, you can feel it when someone is cheating on you, the emotional density is no longer there, so when your partner comes home at night and they want sex you have little to nothing left in the bucket to give them because your emotional bucket has been satisfied. It can work in both directions, bucket empty and satisfied or bucket full and satisfied while our partner gets the short end of the stick. another path for this
This seems like a religious explanation trying to hide it's religiousness. It's dangerously close to that idea that you'll expend all your vitality or male essence or magical juju in masturbation and that's utter huey. So I'm not buying that.
On one level...... the near death experience account of Mr. Christian Andreason may offer a clue........ perhaps LUST is a more serious flaw in our thinking than we tend to realize??????? https://near-death.com/christian-andreason-nde/
