Why did John the Baptist baptize Jesus

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by Margot2, Feb 16, 2019.

  1. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    I'd like to explore this question. John the Baptist was a Jew like Jesus so why would he baptize? What did baptism mean in this context?

    We know the story:

    13 Then Jesus came from Galilee to the Jordan to be baptized by John. 14 But John tried to deter him, saying, “I need to be baptized by you, and do you come to me?” 15 Jesus replied, “Let it be so now; it is proper for us to do this to fulfill all righteousness.” Then John consented. (Matthew 3:13-15)
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2019
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  2. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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  3. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    the following items about John appear relatively trustworthy. He was born somewhere in Judaea (localized at ʿEn Kerem from at least 530 ce) to Zechariah, a priest of the order of Abijah, and his wife, Elizabeth, perhaps a relative of Mary, the mother of Jesus. His formative years were spent in the Judaean desert, where monastic communities, such as the Essenes (a strict Jewish sect that existed from about the 2nd century bce to the end of the 1st century ce), and individual hermits often educated the young in their own ideals.

    In 27/28 or 28/29 John attained prominence, not as a priest but as a prophet. He was active in the region of the lower Jordan valley, from “Aenon near Salim” (near modern Nāblus) to a point east of Jericho.

    His austere camel’s hair garment was the traditional garb of the prophets, and his diet of locusts and wild honey represented either strict adherence to Jewish purity laws or the ascetic conduct of a Nazirite (a Jew especially vowed to God’s service).

    His mission was addressed to all ranks and stations of Jewish society. His message was that God’s judgment on the world was imminent and that, to prepare for this judgment, the people should repent their sins, be baptized, and produce appropriate fruits of repentance.

    Certain problems about the meaning of John’s message continue to be debated: In Matthew 3, John says, John says, “He who is coming after me is mightier than I”; this might refer to God himself, a human messiah, or a transcendent divine being.

    He also says, “I baptize you with water…; he will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire”; this second baptism might symbolize the judgment the one coming would carry out.

    John’s followers were characterized by penitent fasting, beyond the demands of Jewish Law, and special prayers. John’s ethical call for justice and charity in Luke 3 requires righteousness from everyone.

    Although, like earlier prophets, John had an inner circle of disciples, baptism was not an admission rite into this group. It was a rite (immersion in running water) that symbolized repentance in preparation for the coming world judgment and was to be accompanied, before and afterward, by a righteous life.

    It was hardly conceived as a sacrament, in the Christian sense, conveying forgiveness, or as superseding Judaism and marking off a new people, including both Jews and Gentiles, prepared for God’s final kingdom.

    Nor is a hypothesis that it symbolized a new Israel’s crossing of the Red Sea toward a new national deliverance demonstrable.

    Equally unprovable is that it was a rite symbolizing man’s reunion with divinity and return to his heavenly home—a sacrament of salvation and rebirth.

    The Jewish rite of baptism of converts differs fundamentally and is not its source. There were several other baptizing groups found about the same time and place, but none of these various and little-known baptisms can be shown to have inspired John’s. His may have
    resembled in parts the initiatory baptism of the Essenes, though their other baptisms were more concerned with maintaining their community’s ritual purity.

    John’s baptism probably symbolized not so much anticipated entrance into the kingdom of God as an anticipatory submission to the coming world judgment, which was represented as a coming second “baptism” by the Holy Spirit in a river of fire.
    [​IMG]
    baptism of JesusThe baptism of Jesus by St. John the Baptist, from an Armenian evangelistary (1587).© Photos.com/Thinkstock

    Sometime after baptizing Jesus, John was imprisoned by Herod Antipas, ruler of Galilee and central Transjordan. His crime was hardly the innocuous moral message Josephus presents, nor would his message, as found in the Gospels, have had much more immediate political bite.

    Herod had married (illegally, by Jewish Law) Herodias, the divorced wife of his half brother, after divorcing his first wife, the daughter of King Aretas IV of the Nabataeans, an adjacent Arab people. John’s denunciation of this marriage doubtless presented Herod with the danger that his Jewish subjects would combine with his semi-Arab subjects in opposition to him. John’s execution certainly preceded Aretas’s victory over Herod in 35–36, a defeat popularly considered to have been divine vengeance on Herod for killing John.

    According to the Gospels, John’s death preceded Jesus’; any greater chronological precision depends on the dates of Jesus’ ministry and death. It is probable that John’s followers recovered and buried his body and revered his tomb. The traditional burial site, at Sebaste (originally Samaria), near “Aenon by Salim,” is attested from 360 onward.


    Possible relationship with the Essenes
    The discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls drew attention to the numerous parallels between John’s mission and that of the Essenes, with whom John may have received some of his religious training.

    Both were priestly in origin, were ascetic, and had intense and, in many respects, similar expectations about the end of the world. But John neither belonged to nor intended to found any organized community, he did not stress study of the Mosaic Law, and his message was more widely directed (to the poor, to sinners) than was that of the Essenes.

    Jesus, who was baptized by John, saw in John the last and greatest of the prophets, the one who prepared for the coming of God’s kingdom (Mark 9, Matthew 11, Luke 7), and in many ways his ministry continued and developed John’s.

    Whether John, who probably expected a divine Son of Man, recognized him in Jesus is not clear, but many of his disciples later followed Jesus.

     
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  4. The Wyrd of Gawd

    The Wyrd of Gawd Well-Known Member

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    The Jesus character thought that if you had ever had a bath all you had to after that was just wash your feet and you would be good to go = John 13:10

    John the Baptist had to baptize Jesus because he stunk. Jesus never did take another bath. Every time he was near water he either walked on it or turned the water into wine. He preferred to douse himself with perfume. He wouldn't even wash his hands before eating.
     
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  5. JET3534

    JET3534 Well-Known Member

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    It is likely that the story of John the Baptist baptizing Jesus is true since his followers would hardly invent this sort of story which places Jesus in a subordinate position. Jesus was probably at one time a follower of John the Baptist who branched off on his own so to speak.
     
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