Why do debates about religion get so negative?

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by Defender of Freedom, Dec 5, 2014.

  1. robini123

    robini123 Well-Known Member

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    Indeed the Bible teaches tolerance as well as judgment. If one wants to be right with God on their side there are many passages of judgment... and if one is a kind soul that believe in tolerance then there are passages like Matthew 7. No one person can adhere to all of the dictates in the Bible as many of the dictates contradict one another while following others would get you arrested. Thus the Bible is one of the most cherry picked books in history.

    IMO one cancels out the other especially when some of the universal principles are steeped in judgment.

    And herein lies the problem in a free society. As America is not a Christian theocracy we are free to reject and otherwise ignore the principles of the Bible. I have had on more than one occasion had a Christian judge me because I am a man with long hair. The problem here is not my having long hair, its the Christian applying their interpretation of some Biblical standard to me.

    When morality is seen as universal, dictated by God and applied to all humanity, this sets the stage for strife. Religion tends to unify at a group level, but acts as a wedge outside that group.
     
  2. Defender of Freedom

    Defender of Freedom Member

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    I merely asked for toleration of others beliefs. I have no problem with others worshiping another god than myself or not worshiping one at all. However, if your religion requires you to murder 'infidels' or mutilate others, my tolerance for you ends until that ends. Radical Islam is an example. I have no problem with those who practice Islam, but there are radicals (as there are in any group) who say that they must kill others for their faith. At that point, that tolerance ends, because principles tell me that it is wrong and that the lives of others must be protected. I did not mean that these were based on one faith or another, rather an understanding between people. Some would be based in faith, but not all nor would any have to be.
     
  3. The Wyrd of Gawd

    The Wyrd of Gawd Well-Known Member

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    If your prayers are not answered will you accept it as proof that prayers are useless?

    Chances are you don't like my opinions because you lack faith in yours. Whatever you have countless other people have the same things and they didn't believe in your favorite ethnocentric Middle Eastern deity to get it. Peter claimed to have believed until he actually had to prove it. Then he ran like a frightened sheep from a hungry wolf and cursed and swore that he didn't know Jesus from a tree stump.

    It's easy for you to prove that you really believe. Just do what Jesus told believers to do. Sell all of your stuff and give the proceeds to the poor. Leave your family and go on the road telling people what a wonderful guy Jesus is. Walk outside right now and tell the nearest tree to uproot itself and have it do as you commanded it to do. Drink a glass of poison and handle live poisonous snakes without any protective equipment. Cure some sick people just by touching them (you can pray over them and rub special oil on them also if you want to).

    If you can't forgive me for trespassing against you how can you do any of those other things to demonstrate your faith? I think you will meet the lake of fire because you couldn't find the straight and narrow path.

    Be sure to do your praying in your closet. Jesus hates public prayers.
     
  4. Dood

    Dood New Member

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    You and your misquoting buddy are 90% of the problem. I've jumped into your threads to discuss your topics and all you do is put words in people's mouths. You two make me thankful for not being surrounded by atheists anymore, for that I thank you.

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    Prayers work. When was the last time you prayed?
     
  5. Dood

    Dood New Member

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    It's pretty clear about judgment.
     
  6. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    you're talking about individual people, which is not what I referred to. I'm saying most Christians known to me have believed their faith deserved unearned respect.
     
  7. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    why is it that whenever a theist here is asked a direct question (challenging the idea that christianity confers magical morality), the asker is angry?
     
  8. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    That's just it ... they rarely 'respond to criticism' at all, much less 'well'. FreedomSeeker asks very straight forward questions all the time but almost never receives actual answers from theists. All he gets is 'why are you angry' and other obfuscations. the very fact that these simple questions are apparently so difficult to answer tells us we really need to keep up our criticisms!
     
  9. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Both sides, basically any subject where someone cannot maintain a rational argument then you are touching something personal that may be so imbedded that the arguer doesn't even know why.

    Of the many Christians I have known, the most rational were the ones that actually knew the bible very well and had been Christian all their lives. The least rational were the new converts. Those athiests that are the most passionate tend to be like the new converts and have more anger about religion than lack of belief.
     
  10. Incorporeal

    Incorporeal Well-Known Member

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    Do you consider those on this forum as being known to you? They are, after all, within your knowledge base. If those on this forum are considered as known to you, then do you have proof of what they 'believed'?
     
  11. The Wyrd of Gawd

    The Wyrd of Gawd Well-Known Member

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    If I believed in a deity why would I have to pray? I would accept my lot in life because that's what the deity wants me to have. Whining about it in prayer would be telling him that his plans for me suck and that I want a better deal.

    Since all deities are imaginary why would I pray to an imaginary entity? It simply doesn't exist so what could it ever do for me?

    Therefore prayer is useless.
     
  12. gamewell45

    gamewell45 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    There are two things which divide men in society: religion and politics; when discussing these two items, people who are deeply entrenched in their convictions will do whatever they deem necessary in order to cement their beliefs with those who do not agree with them. It's unlikely ever to change in our lifetimes.
     
  13. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    I'll wager you have me in that 'newly converted' category of atheist. Yet I was born and raised such. Or rather, raised til the age of reason without taint of religion OR atheism. Neutral, you might say. Atheist since then, effectively.
     
  14. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    At least in this thread I can't say you have resorted to emotionalism, just your opinion based on your own experience, your own filter. I don't see you calling people names or sounding angry which usually indicates an emotional state.
     
  15. kgeiger002

    kgeiger002 Active Member Past Donor

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    Ok this may get complicated so I will do the best that I can establish where it it is I am coming from....since this thread went some what off-topic on why things turn negative then so be it. Here's my take on why Athiesium is naive:
    Us humans dont have a clue on the "Big Picture" and I for one will acknowledge that....I for one look all that is given to us on this planet Earth - from my simple mind perspective... I think how the hell is all this by chance?Come on people (Athiests) how can the tomato,banana,onion,orange,green pepper,watermelon,olive,grapes,beans,nuts,fish ...I can go on but I hope the point is made. How is it all the raw materials are available to allow technology to flourish as it has. I don't claim to be any kind S. Hawkings but from just a simple mind it does make you wonder? So my question is why do Athiests? - who feel that they have it all figured out will not acknowledge that there are way too many things in play on Earth to simply discount as simply Chance!!
     
  16. Incorporeal

    Incorporeal Well-Known Member

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    So a non-theist spouts off saying "Damn... give me a break already." Who is the non-theist praying to?

    a prayer is a "petition" and a petition is defined as -----: "4. Something requested or entreated." ----- when not addressing a god or God. I have seen many people enter a "prayer" to the court, and the prayer was answered in the affirmative; so your blanket statement that "...prayer is useless." is not a valid statement.
     
  17. robini123

    robini123 Well-Known Member

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    Then why all the disagreement amongst the worlds 2.2 billion Christian I wounder? Or why have there been so many schisms in the Church if "It's pretty clear about judgment."? Do you believe that your interpretation of the Bible typifies the interpretation of Christians in general? Why do some Christians support same sex marriage while others demonize gays?

    What the Bible says to each individual who reads it is relative to that individual.
     
  18. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

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    """""Here's my take on why Athiesium is naive:""""

    First: It's "atheism".

    Second : that statement is why debates about religion get negative.

    I don't know any atheists who "have it all figured out".....I don't. I just won't make up stuff to make myself feel better.


    We humans don't have a clue on the "Big Picture" and you for one will acknowledge that....then why claim you know more than atheists?
     
  19. kgeiger002

    kgeiger002 Active Member Past Donor

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    I accepted the fact that I have questions? Tell me do Athiests question anything about human life??
     
  20. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

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    See, this is how it works. Atheists are individuals. They have ONLY one thing that connects them in any way, they do not believe in god.

    They all do not possess the same brain, they do sign a contract declaring they'll believe what every other atheist believes, they all don't like donuts....they act a lot like humans!!!!:eekeyes:
     
  21. kgeiger002

    kgeiger002 Active Member Past Donor

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    My apologies. What i should have wrote was: Do Athiests question anything "more?" ... beyond human life?? As I said I have questions? I would very much like to here (from Athiests) if our existance is simply a basis on Chance?
     
  22. The Wyrd of Gawd

    The Wyrd of Gawd Well-Known Member

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    Since man is on Earth why do all of the other celestial bodies exist? What good are they when man isn't on them? Nitrogen and dirt are more abundant than oxygen is. Why can't man live off of them instead of having to breathe scarce oxygen?
     
  23. kgeiger002

    kgeiger002 Active Member Past Donor

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    Oxygen is one piece of the puzzle (granted a huge piece) ....but is everything else (as mentioned before) just some crazy coincidence? I am not trying to set any trap with my questioning. I for one think there's way too many conveniences to right them all off on chance. But that doesn't mean I'm right. It's just my take (belief) on it.
     
  24. Defender of Freedom

    Defender of Freedom Member

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    I have not seen Freedomseeker's posts, though I have seen others that have very negative aspects about them. So far I believe I have responded well as well as others on this thread. I have seen many atheists respond negatively to our criticisms of their beliefs. Some things are left to faith, interpretation, and/ or can be explained.
     
  25. Defender of Freedom

    Defender of Freedom Member

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    I see your point, I myself do not know the Bible word for word and maybe I am not the one who can debate it best, however the words of the Bible as I understand it speak volumes to me, that is why I am a Christian and believe Jesus is our savior.

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    It seems we finally agree on something lol
     

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