Why do Republicans lobby on behalf of people who live like royalty?

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Durandal, Dec 13, 2018.

  1. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    I am sure you have no problem with billionaires getting huge tax cuts. No you rather focus on a small percentage of our national budget that helps the poor...you rather see them suffer so the affluent can keep more money they don’t need ...I don’t have kids in school so therefore I don’t want to pay taxes for those moochers . I don’t go to national parks, why should my taxes go to funding them? I’d rather Walmart get huge ge tax cuts so they can pay their employees less
     
  2. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    Do you have a terminal disease? I hope not but most of us get more from Social Security than we contribute
     
  3. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    And rich daddies! Like the Orangeman
    It also depended on your race and gender
     
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2018
  4. jcarlilesiu

    jcarlilesiu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You are playing with words.

    When talking about the rich, you say "huge tax cuts" all while ignoring the fact that they already pay the overwhelming majority if taxes. Then, when talking about the poor, you say "helping the poor", ignoring the fact that they pay zero tax.

    So in essence, what you are saying is "screwbthe fact that the rich pay almost all the tax liabilities now, they need to pay even more, but only to cover the cost of the poor but also to give money directly to the poor."

    Let's at least start being honest in our conversations of what agendas we support.

    You want wealth redistribution. Plain and simple. Right?
     
  5. Sanskrit

    Sanskrit Well-Known Member

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    Here's a -fact- for you and others running the grievance industry shuck and jive. No career is "unavailable" to any American based on race or gender, and this has been the case for decades, I'll wager longer than you've been alive.

    Actually, I need to edit this. As a white man, I probably couldn't get a job as a black grievance industry huckster, so there are some examples of careers still unavailable to Americans based on race and gender.
     
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2018
  6. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    My freshman year of college I began pursuing forestry and wildlife management. I was told by my advisor the employment opportunities would be severely limited. To confirm this I checked out hiring statistics of graduates by state and federal government agencies. It was obvious getting hired into a position I wanted would by highly unlikely. Certainly not worth the risk of four years of college down the drain.

    I also desired to become a large animal veterinarian. I watched as white males a year or two ahead of me with 4.0 GPA, excellent credentials in club and association leadership, and a lifelong desire to become veterinarians applied for slots at schools of veterinary medicine. Every one was turned down. At that time virtually all those admitted were minorities or females. Someone had determined almost all large animal vets were white males and that just couldn’t do anymore.

    I depend on large animal veterinarians today. It is getting better now because several years ago they started taking males again, but for many years there was a terrible shortage of large animal veterinarians because the women all took jobs spaying cats in St. Louis and Witchita instead of going to large animal clinics in the country. I’m sure you will find this sexist, but it is the rare female that has the physical strength to be a large animal veterinarian.

    My wife is the exception. But only because she DID something instead of making excuses why she couldn’t. I’m sure that does sound silly to you.

    Do you see what you are saying? That everyone is a victim of the wealthy and bigoted. You are lumping everyone but white males into victim groups. While racism and poverty certainly are negatively impactful on some, they are minor influences compared to other dynamics that determine success.

    I am not the bigot. I see the potential and value in the individual regardless of their genetics or background. You make excuses for bad choices and underachievement. You expend your energy on applying victim status instead of equipping people to succeed in the face challenges.
     
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  7. Robert

    Robert Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I was watching how useful Mink are at catching rats and also catching fish.

    Let me explain why I bring this up. Democrats see the rich the way minks see rats or fish. To them they are the natural born enemy. The target worth ruining the day of. If they break them they do not care. They see the rich as minks see rats, more than one can capture.

    They act as if money does not matter. But find any of them wanting taxes cut. They do not suffer their earnings being used for lousy things so they don't mind it at all.
     
  8. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    Yes I have a terminal disease. I’ve been dying since the moment of my birth. :)

    I’ve seen the dumpster fire of SS disability in action. I would not go down that road even if I became disabled. I’m early 40’s and I don’t believe the Ponzi scheme will last till retirement age for me. I’ve been content to invest in more sensible retirement plans. Plus, I wouldn’t sleep at night knowing I was taking more than I put in.

    My occupation makes it relatively easy to avoid most SS contributions so I do.
     
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2018
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  9. spiritgide

    spiritgide Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    And I hope you would understand that there are, as I pointed out- distinctive differences in why people are where they are in life, and that changes the nature of the problem. Two people can have the same situation, but one can be helped and will get back on their feet and pay it forward, while the other will assume that since someone else bailed them out today, they will do it again tomorrow and next week. They see no reason to be responsible for their actions, because someone like you will tell them they are not, and somebody else will pick up the slack for them.

    These are character differences, not just knowledge you can teach, not qualities you can give- it is a quality that person must earn for themselves, or they will never have it. Of course they feel sorry for themselves; and they blame others for it- therefore they have no power to change it and wait for those others to do right by them. Indefinitely. And of course, a certain amount of the public can't look past the "need" of the moment, and subsidize such people. Stereotpying assigns the same labels to everybody in a situation- and that IS NOT what I'm speaking of. I think you know that, but need to make an argument to support your own ideology rather than understand what I'm trying to say. Nothing I can do about that.

    When you are in a poor position because you continue to make poor choices and expect the rest of society to continue to bail you out, you are not a good person "in need", you are a lazy person who is living as a parasite by choice. The biggest problem with our system of support is that we cater not to those in genuine need that want to return to a productive life- many of whom are too proud to ask- No. We cater to the people who think it's owed to them, and are eager to tell us whatever story gets the free money. I AM "prejudiced" against people who refuse to do their best to take care of themselves, who look at using others as a way of living. That damn sure isn't "unknowledged", I know exactly what I'm talking about and I know exactly how they think.

    You sound like an ideologist that has read the books, talks the talk- and has never been in the hands-on side of such things. I have.
    Most people who are poor are poor because of their decisions. Because of their attitudes, their perceptions, their procrastination, their inability to make long term plans, their lack of self discipline to follow plans, and their inability to choose and follow proper priorities. Those ARE choices, not accidents. You need to be able to see the difference, and act accordingly- or you only subsidize the very weakness that keeps those people down. You can support them for life, but they won't appreciate it, and they won't get better as a result. On the other hand, when I give a hand-up to a good man who is in trouble, he does appreciate it, he gets himself back on track and productive- he wins and will gain confidence in his fellow man, I win because I helped make the world a better place for someone else. I will do that at every opportunity, voluntarily- but I don't give hand-outs to support those who will not support themselves. The government doesn't know the difference, and some of our political groups are even worse. You can call that discrimination- but it's not. It's judgment, taking the responsibility for the long-term effect of your actions. If we don't- tomorrow won't be a damn bit better than today. I never aimed to teach anyone to get-by; I wanted to teach them how to thrive, to be strong, confident, whole people- but never to feel sorry for themselves and live off others.
     
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  10. Robert

    Robert Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It definitely kept you from other issues. I suspect like other Democrats you got immune to it and pretended it was not impacting your life.
     
  11. Robert

    Robert Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Frankly I see her as crutch for the weak and you as the solution. In her case, she spends her day trying to cure them of bigotry and prejudice but that is not what the problem is. And when she is done chatting, they forgot her message.

    Sadly even when trying to help people achieve great things, a lot of that also gets ignored.
     
  12. jay runner

    jay runner Banned

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    It's always been people richer than me who paid me well on a job. So I'm grateful to them, having been born a po' boy with nothing owed to me in this world. Without the rich I would have been SOL.
     
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  13. jay runner

    jay runner Banned

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    I was born with an undated death warrant by variable means on my forehead also.
     
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  14. Observing

    Observing Well-Known Member

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    Because they are citizens and have rights and interests. "Rich" people make the investments that allow us to have such a rich nation. Now I think that Romney's income should have been treated as earned and not capital gains but 200 elected democrats also voted for that law.
     
  15. Quantum Nerd

    Quantum Nerd Well-Known Member

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    For someone willing to pay taxes you spend an awful lot of time ranting about the evil moochers who want to pick your pocket.

    As to adopting, we were in the same boat, I postponed having kids for career for too long, so we needed help of medical services to get our two beautiful children. Would have adopted too if that hadn't worked.

    The point is, I worked hard too, often 7 days a week for long hours, to get to the point where I am at right now. Do I complain on an internet forum about it? No, that was my choice. I also don't complain that a few bucks of the taxes I pay go to the less fortunate and needy. In fact, I am happy that society provides a safety net so my children may be able to use it, should they ever need it (I pray to god they don't).

    I could tell you another personal story about my late father that is interesting and eye opening, yet I don't because I am pretty certain it will fall on deaf ears.
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2018
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  16. Quantum Nerd

    Quantum Nerd Well-Known Member

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    Careful there. The world is littered with people with the attitude of "live fast, die young", and there they are in their mid 80s in a wheelchair in a nursing home.

    The number, however, who pull the plug when they become disabled: Very few. You NEVER know what you will do when (hopefully never) that situation arises. Statistically, it is more likely than not that you, like most others, will spare no expense, from the public purse or your own, to prolong life just another day. It's human nature.
     
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  17. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    My approach is far from live fast and die young. It’s more like live healthy and die when it’s my time. I’ll spend from my own purse in the future just like I do now. I have had health care expenses in the past and I expect them in the future.

    But I’ve planned the best I can and have no fear of death. But you are right, one never knows...

    However, the manner in which one lives their life today is, I believe, a good indicator of how they will bow out. Patterns of responsibility or lack thereof typically continue until the day of death.
     
  18. Quantum Nerd

    Quantum Nerd Well-Known Member

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    Yes, one never knows. The likelihood is far from zero that one could incur health care expenses far above one's lifetime contribution. I saw it with my late dad.

    I think everyone lives the dream of a healthy life until the day we quickly drop dead. Unfortunately, this is not how it plays out in the vast majority of cases. Instead of dropping dead, or becoming disabled in an instance because of a car accident, the decline is often very gradual, over many years. That's why so many end up as vegetables in the nursing home, despite the best intentions. What to do about it? I don't know. I do know that "everyone for themselves" is not the answer.
     
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  19. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    So what if they pay the majority of taxes? They make the majority of money, they get the majority of tax cuts also. Where is your empathy? So you want the person who works at minimum wage to pay more in taxes? When they buy clothes they are paying taxes. When they buy gasoline they are paying the same tax I am paying. And it means nothing to me and so much to them but hell with them after all you Got yours
    Thank goodness I know very few people who think like you
     
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  20. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    As I thought there is no career unavailable to white men. You just want to be a victim so badly so you can deny all the privileges you have and couldn’t make it big.Perhaps you couldn’t get a job as a “black grievance industry huckster” but you could get a job as a white hood seller,
     
  21. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    My sister-in-law has a blood cancer and cannot afford the $6000 deductible for treatment She and her husband had a lot of pride and didn’t want to take it from and I don’t want it to be a loan because if they can’t pay it back that’s the end of the relationship. I insisted and thank goodness she’s had the surgery. This blood cancer caused her femur to break and she was in agony. Why should anyone have to live without knowing they can get healthcare
     
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  22. ocean515

    ocean515 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Why do the leaders of the New Democratic Party "bed" some of the richest people in the world, while suggesting the party is the voice of the little people?
     
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  23. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    Once again blaming the victim.There are people who live hand to mouth day to day and they aren’t lucky enough to be able to save up money
     
  24. Mike12

    Mike12 Well-Known Member

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    Amusing. Is this why clinton had more millionaire donors than trump during 2016 campaign? Have you heard of soros? Whacky tom steyer? Of course the best of the millionaire bunch who live like royalty are athletes and hollywood, arguably, the worst type of wealthy - entertainers who don’t make a habit of even educating themselves. In the case of hollywood, a value system based on decadence, drug use, sexual abuse, hypocrisy - an immoral, unprincipled life doing much harm to fabric of american culture.
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2018
  25. Turin

    Turin Well-Known Member

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    Glad to know you support starving people to death in order for the few to have more than they can ever need or use. It speaks volumes about yourself and your character.
     
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