Why you can’t ban AR-15s

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Hoosier8, Feb 20, 2018.

  1. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    For one they are just a rifle. You cannot ban a whole class of firearms in common use.

    You could still buy an AR-15 during the Clinton AWB.

    What is an Assault Style weapon? It’s like hair, you have styles of hair like a flat top.

    The AWB banned certain ‘stylistic’ features of a rifle. As long as they had only two of those cosmetic features they were not considered ‘assault weapons’. The definition of ‘assault weapon’ came from the law since it had to be invented.

    So you can’t ban a rifle but you can ban accessories that provide style.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2018
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  2. TheAngryLiberal

    TheAngryLiberal Banned

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    All I can hope for is that the parents of these Kids murdered in Florida were all Gun Rights 2nd Amendment Nutjobs who believe that every Tom Dick and Harry are allowed to purchase Assault Rifles no matter how mentally insane they are. That being said, these idiots would probably make their children Sacrificial Lambs in order to protect the rights of mentally disturbed people the rights to walk in a purchase an AR15 as if it was a gallon of Milk.
     
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  3. APACHERAT

    APACHERAT Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    With most liberals and snowflakes any rifle that is black and scary looking is politically incorrect and is called an assault weapon.


    [​IMG]

    California where 2/3 of the population are low information and most of the state legislature have no freaking idea what they are legislating on use cosmetic features to classify a rifle as an assault weapon.


     
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  4. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    I love how you think this is a reasonable response.
     
  5. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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  6. APACHERAT

    APACHERAT Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Assault weapon, not an Assault rifle.

    An assault rifle is a selective fire rifle that uses an intermediate cartridge and a detachable magazine.[1] Assault rifles are currently the standard service rifles in most modern armies. Examples of assault rifles include the StG 44, AK-47 and the M16 rifle.

    The Germans were the first to pioneer the assault rifle concept, during World War II, based upon research that showed that most firefights happen within 400 metres (1,300 ft) and that contemporary rifles were over-powered for most small arms combat.[2][3][4][5][6] They sought to develop a select-fire intermediate powered rifle combining the firepower of a submachine gun with the accuracy and range of a rifle.[2][3][4][5][6] This was done by shortening the standard 7.92x57mm cartridge to 7.92x33mm and giving it a lighter 125 grain bullet, that limited range but allowed for more controllable automatic fire[3][4][5][6][7]

    The result was the Sturmgewehr 44, which the Germans produced in large numbers; approximately half-a-million were made.[3][4][5][6] Unlike previous rifle designs it introduced an over-the-barrel gas system, straight stock and pistol grip to reduce recoil and improve handling characteristics.[2] "The principle of this weapon...was probably the most important advance in small arms since the invention of smokeless powder."[7]

    DEFINITION
    According to the legend, the name was chosen personally by Adolf Hitler[8][9]for propaganda reasons and literally means "storm rifle" as in "to storm (i.e. "assault") an enemy position," as a new name for the Maschinenpistole 43,[nb 1] subsequently known as the Sturmgewehr 44 or StG 44. Although some sources dispute that Hitler had much to do with coining the new name besides signing the production order.[10] The StG 44 is generally considered the first selective fire military rifle that served to popularize the concept and form the basis for today's modern assault rifles. The term assault riflegradually became more common for similar firearms sharing the same technical definition as the StG 44.

    In a strict definition, a firearm must have at least the following characteristics to be considered an assault rifle:[11][12][13]

    • It must be an individual weapon
    • It must be capable of selective fire
    • It must have an intermediate-power cartridge: more power than a pistol but less than a standard rifle or battle rifle
    • Its ammunition must be supplied from a detachable box magazine
    • And it should at least have an effective range of 300 metres (330 yards)
    Rifles that meet most of these criteria, but not all, are technically not assault rifles despite frequently being called such.

    For example:

    • Select-fire M2 Carbines are not assault rifles; their effective range is only 200 meters.[14]
    • Select-fire rifles such as the FN FAL battle rifle are not assault rifles; they fire full-powered rifle cartridges.
    • Semi-automatic-only rifles like variants of the Colt AR-15 are not assault rifles; they do not have select-fire capabilities.
    • Semi-auto rifles with fixed magazines like the SKS are not assault rifles; they do not have detachable box magazines and are not capable of automatic fire.
    The U.S. Army defines assault rifles as "short, compact, selective-fire weapons that fire a cartridge intermediate in power between submachine gun and rifle cartridges."...



    ASSAULT RIFLES VS. ASSAULT WEAPONS
    The term assault rifle when used in its proper context, militarily or by its specific functionality, has a generally accepted definition with the firearm manufacturing community.[1] In more casual usage, the term "assault weapon" is sometimes conflated or confused with the term assault rifle. The use of the term "assault weapon" is also highly controversial, as critics assert that the term is a media invention,[48] or a term that is intended to cause confusion among the public by intentionally misleading the public to believe that assault weapons (as defined in legislation) are full automatic firearms when they are not.[49]

    In the United States "assault weapons" are usually defined in legislation as semi-automatic firearms that have certain features generally associated with military firearms, including assault rifles. The 1994 Federal Assault Weapons Ban, which expired on September 13, 2004, codified the definition of an assault weapon. It defined the rifle type of assault weapon as a semiautomatic firearm with the ability to accept a detachable magazine and two or more of the following:

    • a folding or telescoping stock
    • a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon
    • a bayonet mount
    • a flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor
    • a grenade launcher
    Assault weapons legislation does not further restrict weapons capable of fully automatic fire, such as assault rifles and machine guns, which have been continuously and heavily regulated since the National Firearms Act of 1934 was passed. Subsequent laws such as the Gun Control Act of 1968 and the Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986 also affected the importation and civilian ownership of fully automatic firearms, the latter fully prohibiting sales of newly manufactured machine guns to non-law enforcement or SOT (special occupational taxpayer) dealers.

    source -> http://self.gutenberg.org/articles/eng/Assault_Rifle
     
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  7. TheAngryLiberal

    TheAngryLiberal Banned

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    It's absolutely a reasonable response, it's incredibly sad if Parents who are against Assault rifles and want stronger Gun control laws to be passed loses a child to a maniac with an AR15, but if it has to be a Parent who suffers this type of loss, I want it to be one of these crazy 2nd amendment people who are against any Gun restrictions at all.
     
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  8. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    There's not an ounce of reason (or truth) in it; the fact you believe it to be reasonable explains why the pro-gun side refuses to give an inch.
     
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  9. APACHERAT

    APACHERAT Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  10. TheAngryLiberal

    TheAngryLiberal Banned

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    I don't care what your little cherry picked definition of an Assault rifle is, if a person has an AR15 with a 50 round magazine, equipped with a Bump stock and a Bayonet attached and he's using it to kill kids, it's an ASSAULT RIFLE in my book. I'm sure if it had been a bunch of Isis Terrorist this maniac had killed with that Gun, nobody would have any issues calling it an Assault rifle.
     
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  11. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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  12. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    Ah. You aren't willing to accept reality and instead believe you can substitute your own.
    Again -- this is why the pro gun side refuses to give an inch.
     
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  13. APACHERAT

    APACHERAT Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The top rifle we have what snowflakes call an assault weapon and below because there's no flash suppressor and bayonet lug snowflakes don't call it an assault weapon.

    Spent years researching trying to find the last time someone was bayoneted in America. looks like 1878.
     
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  14. TheAngryLiberal

    TheAngryLiberal Banned

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    Well, it's my opinion and hope is that the only people killed by Mass shootings are the same people who hope to keep these Guns in the hands of these murderers and protect their 2nd amendment rights. That would be a great penalty for their ignorance.
     
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  15. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    OK. Fine.

    Ban magazine fed semi-auto rifles
     
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  16. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    The fact you believe this to be reasonable explains why the pro-gun side refuses to give an inch.
     
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  17. TheAngryLiberal

    TheAngryLiberal Banned

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    Oh! no, you can't do that, then these AR-15 type Guns wouldn't be as cool, plus it takes at least 30 rounds to take down a Buck during hunting season.
     
  18. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    Why do you refuse to understand this violates the constitution?
    The fact you believe it to be reasonable explains why the pro-gun side refuses to give an inch.
     
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  19. APACHERAT

    APACHERAT Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Before the 1980's it was just a service rifle. Today it's refereed to as a battle rifle.

    But guess what, California just decided to classify the Springfield Armory M-1A as an assault weapon.

    To the best of my knowledge no Springfield Armory M-1A has ever been used in a crime.

    [​IMG]


    National Match M1A™ | Best Tactical Competition Rifles
    Springfield Armory
     
  20. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Not to mention, the first major mass school shooting occurred years after the AWB was put in place, and the most deadly school shooting didn't involve a rifle.
     
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  21. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    The fact you believe it to be reasonable explains why the pro-gun side refuses to give an inch.
     
  22. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    They don't care - they just want to ban as many guns as they can.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2018
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  23. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    Most of the DP hunters I know own and love their AR-15s.
    Trump's support in the "Big Blue Wall" states increases every time there is a move to ban them.
     
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  24. Capt Nice

    Capt Nice Well-Known Member

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    I disagree that it's just a rifle. When the Constitution was written it took (I'm guessing) roughly 30 seconds to reload a rifle. The intent of the 2nd amendment was not to allow people to commit mass murder but rather to provide food for the table and defend their home and property in peace time or in war. Using the 2nd amendment to justify owning any semi-automatic or automatic that is a magazine fed 'weapon' is simply wrong. In my hunting days I owned a .270 Mannlicher Schoenauor, an Ithica 12 ga. pump, Winchester 94 .30-.30 lever action and a Browning .22 automatic (tube fed). The idea of hunting for sport soon left me and I sold all my long guns. If I was hungry I was able to afford to buy food. For personal carry I had a s.s..38 S&W Chief Special, s.s. Walther .32 PPK and today for pocket carry I have a s.s.Ruger LCP .380.

    I think it's safe to say that even though I am a lefty I am not anti-gun. I don't belong to the NRA and I'm not paranoid enough to think 'they want to take my gun away from me'. I do feel the 2nd needs an update and I like the latest move by the kids: If a politician is owned by the NRA vote them out of office.
     
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  25. TOG 6

    TOG 6 Well-Known Member

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    These weapons are in common use for traditionally lawful purposes - and thus, "bearable arms" under the constitution.
    The 2nd Amendment protects all "bearable arms".
    So, to ban these weapons, you need to repeal the 2nd.
    You don't have to like it, but you do need to accept it.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2018

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