Would you trade more in prison in exchange for fewer murders/crimes?

Fireman and paramedics have national standards and certifications, but police don't. It has been shown the better trained police departments have fewer citizen complaints and that translates into better policing. Each state is free to have their own police training practices. Minnesota has 280 hours of training, one of the shortest, and Hawaii has over 1000 hours. Draw your own conclusions. The last five years there has been an attempt to nationalize standards, most states have signed on....not Minnesota.

Crime would not be the violent level it is without guns is obvious and crime follows poverty not the other way around..

Gun ownership per household has been going down. Those buying guns already have guns.

Don't know till we try.

 

There are many groups and associations which publish recommended and suggested standards the local and state officials set which ones they will use.

So should we just catch fewer criminals and get down the number we had in prison or catch as many as we can and if the crime dictates put them in prison where they can't commit any crimes on the citizens? If that means that we have more in prison per capita because we do catch and prosecute more should make efforts NOT to do as well so that we more match those other countries?

 

See the German judicial system that Robert suggested.

 

This is about the American system of justice, but if you have something say then say it.

 

Spreading wealth does not spread character, capacity, civility or worthiness. And removing guns from society likewise does nothing to address the lack of character, capacity or civility anymore than does forbidding guns from the prison population. What you propose is the plunder and captivity of American freedom. If you really wanted to address poverty and crime, you'd look at the breakdown of the family, the promiscuity and out of wedlock births to fatherless/husbandless homes, all made possible by the Democrat social welfare system, from which the excess of our nations problems spring. Going left created this issue. Going farther left will only make it worse.

 

Curing poverty? What? Poverty has never been "cured' anywhere in the world. It is a universal part of every society in history.

 

So you're not too curious about how the US criminal justice system could be improved and would rather ask silly questions....there, said it.

I suspect they give out a manual at the meetings. How many times have I heard that. The poor are of low character and its the fault of the leftists. If they take away guns we'll lose our freedom. Nonsense.
With a certain amount of wealth comes security, stability, less a feeling of helplessness, an ability to not be self serving because your needs are met, more self worth, less anger, can support a family, can plan for the future rather focusing on immediate needs....your "character". To get that "wealth" the rest of society may need to help them to earn that. That may be through increased social services, quality early childhood daycare, technical schools that work with business, less incarceration...
Complaining about "character" does nothing for the situation besides making the complainer feel superior.

You are right, but like a chronic disease it can be treated.

 

It can be treated in poverty stricken nations, but not in those providing personal opportunity.

 

Poverty can be treated?

You mean with free groceries? Snap and Wic?

Free school meals?

College assistance? Pell grants, free community college and loans?

Housing assistance? Like public housing and section 8?

What about head start? So we have free education pre school-community college and that is not enough?

Keeping in mind that liboturds run these cities, these schools.

We have been "treating poverty" for 56 years. Good to know Edna missed that.

 

Let's dump a million inner city failures in a country like Zimbabwe or Haiti and see what kind of hyper industrious people they become. No white republicans to blame it on when they fail.

 

I live in Tennessee one of those racist red states that voted for Trump!

There are 6 free pre schools in my town. Tennessee was the first state to offer free community college and tuition beyond community college is free at state schools if you maintain a B average.

1.5 million Tennesseans get free health care through Tenncare which is medicaid here.

Poverty is being "treated" here. Of course it has not stopped people from being violent.

 

You confuse the term treat with cure.

 

How?

 

Well this is about crime and whether catching and convicting and incarcerating criminals means fewer crimes and in particular here murder. How does doing the opposite make the US criminal justice system better and lower the amount of crime especially murder?

 

Yet cities where more is done to "help" the poor and more is done to reduce gun rights, have the highest crime.

 

Who said anything about prosecuting and convicting fewer violent criminals? Who suggested doing the opposite? We can make the judicial system more efficient, can we not? We do not need to incarcerate all non-violent law breakers and you will see on Mr. pie chart how many unconvicted are in jail because they cannot make bail. I suggested looking at the German system.

Is that why they need more help? Would more guns and less "help" mean less crime?

 

I would prefer that non-violent offenders be hit with serious fines that even substantially compensated the victims and allowed to do some sort of productive work at a reasonable amount of pay but........... they would not get the money for their work.... or at least only get a small portion of their pay........ their victims would get most of it.

Participation in a program like that would have to be voluntary...... but could be used as a way to reduce sentences. In a way this is already being done through Community Service for certain types of crime but this basic principle is preferable over a straight forward jail sentence.


Proverbs 6:31
"But if he is caught, he must pay back seven times what he stole,
even if he has to sell everything in his house."

 

There are ways to set in motion a major trend for people to leave cities and make their primary dwelling in a more rural setting.


http://www.politicalforum.com/index...-income-dramatically-reduce-abortions.556917/

 

Well that is how we get criminals into prison, we catch the perpetrators of the crime, then we successfully prosecute them for the crime and then we institute legal sanctions against them including putting them in prison. If we manage to do that better that other countries should we do less of that in order to match their rate of success in doing so?

Taking guns from law abiding citizens engaging in their right to keep and bear arms for their own protection? How would lowering that mean less crime?

 

I don't know that our policing is any better than other countries it is just that we have more armed criminals which ups the violence and they get longer prison times.
The only people currently taking guns from "law abiding citizens" are thieves. One study showed the largest proportion (43%) of how criminals got their guns was through theft.

 

Well you guys complain we catch to many of them and put them in prison compared to other countries and yes the Dems and Left want to disarm the citizenry and none of their laws would remove them from the hands of criminals. Heck Biden's own son violated the gun laws and do we hear Biden condemning it, no the left ignores it. Enforce the existing laws, put the criminals behind bars.

 

Your solution has already been tried and results speak for themselves. Gun control is not from a position of concern for human life.

 

So the plan is buy more guns, hire more police and build more prisons. That does not sound like the recipe to fix the problem.

So you suggest more guns and more people in poverty? I think part of the third world has tried that, hasn't turned out well.

 

No I did not suggest that. You suggested government interference and I pointed out that results already show that it makes things worse. On poverty, California has the 5th largest GDP in the world combined with the highest taxes and still leads the nation in poverty. I can easily make the same case in areas with strict gun control.

Gun control is not from a position of concern for human life.

 

How does not catching and arresting the criminals, not trying them in court and not incarcerating those found guilty fix the problem. If you want to buy a gun go buy one I don't own one except for a pellet. Yes we need to hire more police but more important put them where is the crime and then not arrest them every time they have to lawfully use force against a resisting suspect they are arresting and yes if we get even better at catching the criminals and prosecuting them then we will need to build new prisons. What do you believe the capacity of our prison system be based upon. Should there be a limit based on the number citizens who live there or something. Once we hit that limit we only send a new prison when an existing prisoner gets released?