Zimmerman Trial (monday July 8th) MOD ALERT

Angedras · Jul 8, 2013

MOD EDIT

Guys, the old thread Zimmerman Trial (Weekend Edition), is past post capacity, and will soon be closed. This is a continuation thread. Feel free to continue the discussion here, but please, be mindful of posting guidlines.

Link to old thread...

Zimmerman Trial (Weekend Edition)

Thank you, for your contributions/opinions. ~

`

Angedras · Jul 8, 2013

Monday July 8th., defense to continue its case.

Jurors in the George Zimmerman murder trial now will hear the defense's presentation after listening for two weeks as prosecutors made their case.

Zimmerman's attorneys will continue calling witnesses Monday. That could include some of the same neighbors and investigators called by prosecutors.

The defense called its first two witnesses Friday after prosecutors rested and Judge Debra Nelson denied a request for acquittal.

Zimmerman's mother and uncle testified that it was Zimmerman screaming for help on a 911 call that captured the fight between Zimmerman and 17-year-old Trayvon Martin.

Zimmerman is pleading not guilty to second-degree murder for fatally shooting Martin. He is claiming self-defense.

Still uncertain is whether Zimmerman will testify.

Jurors already have heard his account through videotaped police interviews played in court."
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http://www.star-telegram.com/2013/07/08/4986945/in-zimmerman-trial-defense-to.html

Angedras · Jul 8, 2013

Below are a couple links to streaming trial coverage. The first is commercial/ad free, the best in my opinion.

Uninterrupted Streaming Trial Coverage

HLN News Feed~ http://weplaylive.tv/zimmerman-trial-live-stream/

TomFitz · Jul 8, 2013

I'd be shocked if Zimmerman testified.

The prosecution was so inept that they practically gave their case away.

We know from the taped testimony that Zimmerman is a liar (on several points), so putting him on the stand would be a very risky proposition.

Angedras · Jul 8, 2013

TomFitz said: ↑

I'd be shocked if Zimmerman testified.

The prosecution was so inept that they practically gave their case away.

We know from the taped testimony that Zimmerman is a liar (on several points), so putting him on the stand would be a very risky proposition.
Click to expand...

I don't think he will take the stand either, Tom.

I feel certain O'Mara would advise against it.

DonGlock26 · Jul 8, 2013

TomFitz said: ↑

I'd be shocked if Zimmerman testified.

The prosecution was so inept that they practically gave their case away.

We know from the taped testimony that Zimmerman is a liar (on several points), so putting him on the stand would be a very risky proposition.
Click to expand...

They didn't have a case to begin with. They limited their witnesses to limit the chances of O'Mara being able to bring up TM's thug life.

Angedras · Jul 8, 2013

If anyone is interested, here is an article recapping the trial thus far..........

http://theweek.com/article/index/246407/the-george-zimmerman-trial-a-day-by-day-recap

superbadbrutha · Jul 8, 2013

TomFitz said: ↑

I'd be shocked if Zimmerman testified.

The prosecution was so inept that they practically gave their case away.

We know from the taped testimony that Zimmerman is a liar (on several points), so putting him on the stand would be a very risky proposition.
Click to expand...

I agree it looks like this cat is basically going to get away with murder. I have found it amazing listening to the Zimmerman defenders on this forum pretty much attack this kid and claim that he was a thug, gangsta, etc. Now had Trayvon been white the same folks on this forum who attacked this kid and claims he got what he deserved would be screaming for Zimmerman's head on a platter. It just shows we still have a long way to go in this country. Hopefully this is a case we can all learn something from.

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DonGlock26 said: ↑

They didn't have a case to begin with. They limited their witnesses to limit the chances of O'Mara being able to bring up TM's thug life.
Click to expand...

Here is a prime example of what I am speaking of.

Foolardi · Jul 8, 2013

I say ... Stand Your Zimmerman - THE only option left since the SYG {Stand Your Ground }
pre-trial defense was waived.Now is not the time to waive or waffle further.
Stand by your man.Who cares if our President pulled a nutter Skippy Gates
and himself acted " stupidly " by personally inserting his most personal of
2 cents worth.Who cares what Al Sharpton thinks.Just a month ago when
debating O'Mara he lied BiG Time.He accussed { Big Al Loves to accuse } O'Mara
of " poisoning the public against Trayvon ". This from a guy who within 24 hrs.
of the Event going viral, put out Zimmermans complete history of arrests and any
altercations.Which were actually very limited.BiG Al while debating O'Mara
told the whopper " Your clients Past ... who had been Arrested TWICE.Trayvon
was never arrested,your client was. "
O'Mara making it clear that George was arrested Once and the charges were dismissed.
No biggie ... right.Wrong ~ ! It was just that kind of unbridled use of Lies that BiG Al
used to drive this Event into the public domaine.
I never to this day heard Sharpton even mention the THREE suspensions that
Trayvon had.Talk about One-sided Bias.
Stand by Your Zimmerman.

DonGlock26 · Jul 8, 2013

How did the State's case come to this?

Zimmerman Trial Review– How We Got Here, And Where We’re Going

Posted by Andrew Branca Thursday, July 4, 2013 at 6:30pm

As the State prepares to rest its case against George Zimmerman as early as tomorrow, I can’t help but juxtapose where we ought to be in terms of the weight of evidence of Zimmerman’s guilt of second degree murder, and contrast it with where we are. The gap is of Grand Canyon proportions.

The Charge: Second Degree Murder

R George Zimmerman, defendant, survivor

First, it is worth recalling that Florida’s second degree murder statute requires that Zimmerman have possessed a “depraved mind” when he killed Trayvon Martin. For more information on what is required for a “depraved mind,” and why the State is so unlikely to prove, beyond a reasonable doubt, its existence, see:

Getting to Murder 2: Finding George Zimmerman’s “Depraved Mind”

FLJI 7.4 MURDER—SECOND DEGREE

To charge Zimmerman with second-degree murder, then, the State had to somehow acquire facts suggestive of this mental state. These facts would then provide the foundation for the affidavit of probable cause providing the legal basis for Zimmerman’s arrest and prosecution on murder 2.

The Shameful Affidavit of Probable Cause

So, what did the affidavit allege to advance the State’s theory of a depraved mind?

Angela Corey, Special Prosecutor, responsible for this prosecution

In the context of the nationally-known racial activists who descended on tiny Sanford FL in the wake of the shooting, the affidavit claimed that “Zimmerman felt that Martin did not belong in the gated community,” a “dog-whistle” claiming that racism had motivated Zimmerman’s suspicions of Martin. This sentiment was buttressed by the contemporaneous release by NBC news of Zimmerman’s non-emergency call to police to report the suspiciously wandering Martin, in which he appeared to make an unsolicited identification of Martin as “he looks black.’ In fact, as everyone involved in the case knew, that tape had been doctored to create exactly the desired perception of racism:

Zimmerman Trial: Myth Busters: Did Zimmerman really “racially profile” Martin?

That affidavit claimed that “Martin attempted to run home but was followed by Zimmerman”. But this cannot be true, because if Martin had indeed run home it would have been impossible—based on the times and distances involved—for the older, clinically obese Zimmerman to catch up to him before he secured safety.

Myth Busters: Did Zimmerman “Chase Down” a Fleeing Martin?

The affidavit claimed that “Zimmerman disregarded the police dispatcher[‘s alleged instruction to not follow] and continued to follow Martin”. This also is known not to be true, because alleged instruction never occurred.

Zimmerman Trial: Myth Busters: Did Zimmerman “chase” Martin against police orders?

The affidavit goes on to claim that “Zimmerman confronted Martin.” Another untruth, as testified to this past week by Rachel Jeantel, who claims to have overheard, by cell phone, the brief confrontational speech between the two men.

Worst of all, however, is the fact that ALL of these foundational claims of the affidavit for probable cause were known to be untrue at the time the affidavit was sworn to and filed with the court.

Keeping in mind the foundational and demonstrably false “facts” that were included in the affidavit, we can take a look at some critical information that was left out of the affidavit.

Noting blandly that “a struggle ensued” between the two men, the affidavit fails to acknowledge the almost total absence of injuries on Martin (absent, of course, the gunshot wound that ended the fight), except for cuts on his hands consistent with having struck a blow. Similarly, no mention was made of Zimmerman’s far more extensive injuries, including abrasions, contusions, and lacerations all around his head, consistent with having had his head beaten against a concrete sidewalk (as Zimmerman claimed was the case), nor Zimmerman’s bloody and broken nose, the initial blow that left Zimmerman dazed, on his back, and vulnerable to Martin’s unrelenting (until shot) aggravated assault. Further, no mention was made of any fact consistent with Zimmerman’s claim of self-defense. Nor was that very claim of self-defense mentioned.

Again, every one of these facts excluded from the affidavit was known to investigators at the time the document was sworn and filed.

The affidavit closes with the following sentence:

“The facts mentioned in this Affidavit are not a complete recitation of all the pertinent facts and evidence in this case but only are presented for a determination of Probable Cause for Second Degree Murder.”

No kidding.

Career Prosecutors, Police Pressured to Bring Unwarranted Charges–Resigned, Fired, Demoted

Why, then, was this prosecution brought at all? We now have sworn testimony as an answer–there was pressure being brought upon the lead investigators, both from within and without the police department to bring charges of second degree murder against Zimmerman, when neither the lead investigator, his Chief , nor the local prosecutors handling the matter believed such a charge was warranted.

In short order the lead investigator was re-assigned from Investigator to the much less prestigious job of Patrolman, the Chief had been fired, and the local prosecutor had resigned and been replaced by a Special Prosecutor, the politically-ambitious Angela Corey, appointed by the Governor, along with her hand-picked cadre of State attorneys our of Jacksonville, a city with no relationship whatever to the Orlando-suburb of Sanford where the events occured.

Prosecution, Fearless of Sanctions, “Slow Rolls” Discovery

As the case proceeded to trial and both sides began to investigate and share, through mandated discovery, the findings of their investigations, it became increasingly clear that the State was “slow-rolling” its own discovery obligations, and being duplicitous in the discovery it did provide.

For example, a State-generated report summarizing the data gathered from Martin’s cell phone–a process requiring equipment available only to law enforcement–was presented to the defense, along with a copy of the raw (and, to the defense, unreadable) data. When a State employee noted the discrepancy and consulted legal counsel to determine his exposure if he remained silent, that legal counsel was required by legal ethics to inform the defense of the deceptions. In court the State argued that they had, in fact, complied with their discovery obligations by providing the raw data unreadable by the defense.

This is an interesting interpretation of discovery obligations to be sure, but one which led to the initiation of sanction hearings against the State prosecutors. Ultimately, however, Judge Nelson proved uninterested in hearing the matter of the State’s dishonest discovery practices until after the jury had handed down a verdict.

Similarly, the State’s key witness who claimed to have overheard the confrontation between Zimmerman and Martin had lied under oath while being deposed on an issue directly impacting her credibility as a witness. The State informed the defense of this perjury only months after they had learned of it themselves, during which they pretended to be trying to hunt down the records that would have affirmed the known-to-be false claim by the witness, and even then only when they were ultimately cornered in Court with facts.

Prospective Jurors Lie and Deceive in Attempt to Deny Zimmerman Fair and Impartial Jury

Then came jury selection, in which it was discovered that more than one juror claiming to have not yet formed an opinion on the case had in fact advocated strongly for the arrest, prosecution, and imprisonment (or in at least one case the actual death) of George Zimmerman. This was in effect an deliberate attempt to deny Zimmerman his due process right to a fair and impartial jury. It is not anticipated that any of the individuals involved will face sanctions of any sort.

Zimmerman Prosp. Juror E7: “no conclusions,” but posted on pro-Trayvon, anti-Zimmerman site containing threat against Zimmerman

Jerry Counelis (prospective juror E7) Facebook post

State’s Opening Statement Writes Checks Unlikely to Clear at Closing Argument

Then, of course, came the start of the trial proper, and along with it each sides’ opening statements. The State went first, as is the norm, and presented a histrionic and largely fact-free emotion-laden narrative for the conviction of George Zimmerman for second degree murder. In addition to the already debunked claims of having “profiled” and “chased down” Martin, the State emphasized the dangerous manner in which Zimmerman carried his personal defense handgun with a round in the chamber as “ready-to-go, all he had to do to kill Trayvon Martin was pull the trigger.” The State also emphasized how the muzzle of the gun had been in contact with Martin’s shirt when fired, suggesting the kind of callousness the State prosecutors had so desperately been seeking to support their theory of a depraved mind.

At trial, it would be revealed, however, that carrying a semi-automatic pistol intended for personal protection with a round in the chamber was the normal and accepted method of such carry–and the manner in which every Deputy in the courtroom was carrying their own sidearms. In addition, it was shown that although the muzzle of the gun had been in contact with Martin’s sweatshirt, it had not been in contact with Martin, as the sweatshirt had hung down from Martin’s torso as he straddled the largely helpless Zimmerman “MMA-style” and rained down blows in a “ground-and-pound” attack intended to debilitate, or perhaps even kill, Zimmerman.

Zimmerman Update Exclusive — Mid-Day 8 — State Wins Evidentiary Battle, Loses Testimony War

ZIMMERMAN TRIAL BLOCKBUSTER — TRANSCRIPT — Eyewitness Good: Black guy in black hoodie on top punching down Mixed Martial Arts style

Clearly, much of the State’s opening was being shown to be lacking in factual basis.

State’s Own Witnesses Routinely Undermine Their Theory of the Case, Buttress Defense Claims

This unraveling of the State’s theory of the case under the relentlessly unfavorable testimony of their own witnesses was the norm, rather than the exception, in this trial. One by one, the State’s witnesses were consistently co-opted to testify favorably to the defense, shown to be substantively lacking in credibility, or at best to testify ambivalently on the events at issue. Witness after witness found themselves subject to the raised, angry voice of State prosecutor Bernie de la Rionda practically shouting at the witness–his own witness!–that in fact they knew nothing about anything, isn’t that true?

Indeed, after eight solid days of the State presenting its case, and benefiting from a tailwind of consistently favorable rulings by Judge Nelson, it can not honestly be said that they walked away from any single one of those days the clear winner–and at the end of more than one of those days they left the courtroom soundly beaten.

Such a performance would not seem to have the makings of guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.

The Few Witnesses Supportive of State Have Credibility Damaged, Destroyed

Perhaps only five of the witnesses overall could be said to have clearly favored the State.

One ear-witness was Selene Bahadoor, a neighbor, who claimed that she had heard the sound of the two men moving from one region of the courtyard to another, as if one person had been chasing another. This was the first testimony consistent with the State’s theory that Zimmerman had “chased down” Martin. On cross by defense attorney Don West, however, it was soon revealed that she was disclosing this critical information for the first time in court that day, despite having been repeatedly questioned and deposed in the 14 months since the events occurred. She had also, it was disclosed, signed a petition in support of the arrest and prosecution of George Zimmerman. Thus, her credibility was destroyed.

Zimmerman Trial Day 2 –Analysis of State’s Witnesses

State witness Selene Bahadoor

Jane Sudyka was another such ear-witness, but her histrionic 911 call and her insistence that she had heard a physically impossible three shots fired collapsed her credibility (and drew some concern about her mental state generally).

State witness, Jane Sudyka

Jeannee Nanalo, another neighbor, testfied that it was the “larger” person on top during the physical confrontation between the two men, but on cross admitted that it had been too dark to see anything definitely, and that she was basing her judgement on post-event photos of the two men–photos in which Martin was consistently portrayed as being younger, and in some cases years younger, than the night of his death. Her credibility as a witness suffered accordingly.

Zimmerman Trial Day 3 – End-of-Day Analysis & Video of State’s Witnesses

State witness Jeannee Nanalo

Rachel Jeantel, previously mentioned for her perjury during deposition, testified that she had overheard Zimmerman speak to Martin in an aggressive and angry tone, consistent with that day’s theory of the case for the State that although Zimmerman was outwardly calm and polite on the outside, he was a seething cauldron of hatred on the inside. Unfortunately for the State, not only was Jeantel carrying the burden of having lied under oath about several facts relevant to the case, her claims regarding what she had overheard were based on sworn testimony she gave to Prosecutor Bernie de la Rionda while sitting in Trayvon’s living room with the dead boy’s weeping mother at her side and other family members and advisors strewn about the room. A more coercive and leading environment is difficult to imagine.

Zimmerman Update Exclusive — Mid-Day 4 — West’s Cross-Examination of Rachel Jeantel

State witness Rachel Jeantel

Finally, the State called in the medical examiner–or, rather, “a” medical examiner. Rather than call to the stand Dr. Shiping Bao, the ME who had actually autopsied Martin, they instead brought in Dr. Valerie Rao, an ME who had been disgraced in her former professional position, fired, and had her career resurrected by the good graces of Special Prosecutor Angela Corey. If the obvious incentive for being biased in favor of the State wasn’t enough, she hilariously characterized Zimmerman’s injuries as inconsequential, in line with the State’s theory of the day that because Zimmerman had not suffered life-threatening injury his use of deadly defensive force could not have been justified.

State witness, Medical Examiner Valerie Rao

There was much humorous cross in which defense attorney Mark O’Mara held out a series of large color photos of Zimmerman’s head, taken at different angles, and asked her if this, that, or another abrasion, contusion, or laceration, was a meaningful injury. The good doctor either mocked them as insignificant or refused to acknowledge they existed at all. By the close of her testimony one could only wonder how many times Dr. Rao’s own head would need to be smashed against a sidewalk before she would consider the blows “significant.”

Zimmerman Trial Day 7 Wrap Up: Prosecution recovers a little, prepared to introduce college records

State Witnesses Routinely Co-Opted by Defense, Undercut State’s Theory of the Case

The other State witnesses either presented testimony at least consistent with Zimmerman’s claim of lawful self-defense or positively favored the defendant.

Wendy Dorival, who coordinated the local Neighborhood Watch Program for the Sanford Police Department, thought so highly of Zimmerman that she tried to recruit him to be a “Citizen on Patrol,” in which he would be supplied with a police department issued patrol car and a uniform of sorts. In sharp contrast to the State’s repeated characterization of Zimmerman as a “wannabe” cop who went over the edge in his pursuit, confrontation, and shooting of Martin, Ms. Dorival regretfully stated that Zimmerman had declined the offer.

State witness Wendy Dorival

Another State witness, Donald O’Brien was President of the Twin Lakes HOA, which had paid out a very healthy settlement to the Martin family, and clearly not a fan of Zimmerman. Nevertheless, on cross he revealed that he had commended a group of workmen a the townhouse community for their efforts leading to the apprehension of a burglar. Their method? Following the suspect from a distance so that he could be definitively located and identified by responding officers–exactly as Zimmerman had intended to do that night with Martin.

State witness, Donald O’Brien

Zimmerman Trail Day 2 — Analysis of State’s Witnesses

The testimony of the only real eye-witness, neighbor John Good, was particularly destructive to the State’s theory of the case, because he stated with utter conviction that it was the man in the dark hoodie [Martin] who was “mounted MMA-style”" on the man in the red/white coat [Zimmerman] raining down blows in a “ground-and-pound” style. So obviously dangerous was the beating that Good immediately phone the police emergency number.

State witness John Good

ZIMMERMAN TRIAL BLOCKBUSTER — TRANSCRIPT — Eyewitness Good: Black guy in black hoodie on top punching down Mixed Martial Arts style

The next day then-Investigator Chris Serino testified the Court through a video re-enactment of by Zimmerman of Martin’s brutal attack upon him, and his desperate fight to live. Serino also testified that he believed Zimmerman to be telling the truth when he recounted how he had to shoot Martin to save himself from the other man’s brutal aggravated assault–a comment which the State convinced Judge Nelson the following day to strike, meaning only that the jury got to hear it twice.

State witness Chris Serino

The next day Federal Air Marshal Mark Osterman, who described Zimmerman as his best friend, appeared as State witness and testified at length in and in horrific detail about Martin’s brutal attack upon Zimmerman, and Zimmerman’s desperate fight to live.

Zimmerman Update Exclusive — Mid-Day 7 — Serino more ambivalent, Osterman supports self-defense

State witness Mark Osterman

The next day the State produced as one of their “witnesses” an interview given by Zimmerman to the Sean Hannity show in which the jury got to hear once again–you guessed it–the defense’s narrative of Martin’s brutal attack upon Zimmerman, and Zimmerman’s desperate fight to live.

Zimmerman Trial Day 7 Wrap Up: Prosecution recovers a little, prepared to introduce college records

Finally yesterday, after much finagling and over the defense’s objections, the State managed to call to testify two of Zimmerman’s criminal justice professors. All wondered how badly the defense would be hurt by the testimony of these two witnesses the State had struggled so greatly to have admitted to testify.

In the end, the first professor, Army Captain Alex Carter testified that Zimmerman had been one of his best students, to whom he had given an “A” grade, and that it would have been foolish for Zimmerman to have waited until he was gravely injured before using deadly force to defend himself. The other professor, Scott Pleasant, was ambivalent about every “fact” the State had claimed would reveal Zimmerman’s secretly nefarious nature, but did testify that Zimmerman had told him his career goals were to become an attorney and then a State prosecutor.

Zimmerman Update Exclusive — Mid-Day 8 — State Wins Evidentiary Battle, Loses Testimony War

State witness Captain Alex Carter

State witness, Professor Scott Pleasants

I have, of course, left out a great deal in the above recounting–nothing about the Frye hearing, the repeatedly denied defense motions for a continuance, the still incomplete State discovery obligations, the as yet to be deposed Benjamin Crump–he who arranged for the coercive interview of Rachel Jeantel, among much else.

So, Here We Are, On Cusp of State Resting Its Case

Nevertheless, that brings us to today, the ninth day of State witness testimony. It is expected that Sabryna Fulton, Trayvon Martin’s mother, will testify that the now unforgettable screams on the Jenna Lauer 911 tape were made by her son, and perhaps finally Dr. Shiping Bao who peformed the autopsy upon Martin.

How those two additional witnesses, or any number of additional witnesses, is supposed to create for the State a compelling narrative of guilt beyond a reasonable doubt is beyond this observer’s ability to foresee.

Keep in mind, as well, that we are not at the end of the trial, with closing arguments about to occur. We are merely closing in on the end of the State’s case, during which the defense has been constrained in its questioning of witnesses to the range of issues raised by the State on direct questioning.

The defense has not, as yet, presented so much as a single witness, nor a single fact not already put into evidence by the State.

If the State’s case is this much of a shambles on the eve of the start of the defense, is it likely to be any stronger a week or so of defense produced witnesses, testimony, and evidence.

One would think not.

Despite this, for both legal and political reasons it seems clear that Judge Nelson will not cut short this trial by signing off on a motion for a directed verdict when the State rests, and we can therefore all look forward to another week or so of testimony favorable to the defense in the matter of Florida vs. Zimmerman.

What Does the Defense Have Planned?

How many of the State’s witnesses may be recalled as defense witnesses, given their earlier testimony favorable to the defense? I dare say most of them are on the list. Might Zimmerman be obliged to take the stand in his own defense? I stand apart from the majority of MSM analysts who seem (almost desperately) certain this will happen, but I just don’t see the upside for the defense given the train wreck that is the State’s case. Will Rachel Jeantel be brought back as a hostile witness for the defense, now that the jury has seen through the paper thin narrative of guilt and may have lost what many assumed was an initial degree of sympathy for her? I certainly hope so.

Only the defense team knows for sure, and as they’ve demonstrated they are darned good at keeping their cards close to their chest.

I’ll be here, watching, analyzing, and commenting–and you should be, too.

–Andrew, @LawSelfDefense

http://legalinsurrection.com/2013/07/zimmerman-trial-review-how-we-got-here-and-where-were-going/
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Foolardi · Jul 8, 2013

superbadbrutha said: ↑

I agree it looks like this cat is basically going to get away with murder. I have found it amazing listening to the Zimmerman defenders on this forum pretty much attack this kid and claim that he was a thug, gangsta, etc. Now had Trayvon been white the same folks on this forum who attacked this kid and claims he got what he deserved would be screaming for Zimmerman's head on a platter. It just shows we still have a long way to go in this country. Hopefully this is a case we can all learn something from.

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Here is a prime example of what I am speaking of.
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Stop it already You wannabe racist.Finding it suitable to declare yourself Judge
Jury and God himself.Making the case for murder when clearly there was no
premeditation.If there was than prove it.I suppose if Zimmerman walks your are gonna
further smear him.I hope Zimmerman does walk.But I am very leery that will happen.
But if Zimmy does walk,then we'll see firsthand if what Al Sharpton insisted holds
water.Sharpton insisted all along he only wants Zimmerman to be charged.If that
warrants a Trial than we must respect that.And that we must respect whatever result
a Trial bears.
We'll see.I'm not holding by breath.

RosePop · Jul 8, 2013

I would skip all the forensics and just put that lying, scumbag crip stepping father of his on the stand and then point out every one of his lies. Grieving parent my ass. Nasty ass spreading his seed all over, already replaced Trayvon with a new kid. I hope he rots in a jail cell when this is all said and done. Oh, and he will because he has the impulse control his son had, except for some unfortunate reason hes lived this long.

DonGlock26 · Jul 8, 2013

superbadbrutha said: ↑

I agree it looks like this cat is basically going to get away with murder. I have found it amazing listening to the Zimmerman defenders on this forum pretty much attack this kid and claim that he was a thug, gangsta, etc. Now had Trayvon been white the same folks on this forum who attacked this kid and claims he got what he deserved would be screaming for Zimmerman's head on a platter. It just shows we still have a long way to go in this country. Hopefully this is a case we can all learn something from.

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Here is a prime example of what I am speaking of.
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His texts and cell phone photos tell the tale. I'm sorry that your Trayvon the angel fantasy was shattered. The truth is that if TM were just a normal kid getting candy and a drink, he would have walked home and GZ would never have called.

exotix · Jul 8, 2013

DonGlock26 said: ↑

How did the State's case come to this?
Click to expand...

Zimmys whereabouts and what he was doing are unknown for 2 minutes and 28 seconds ... this was the prelude to a killing ..

DonGlock26 · Jul 8, 2013

RosePop said: ↑

I would skip all the forensics and just put that lying, scumbag crip stepping father of his on the stand and then point out every one of his lies. Grieving parent my ass. Nasty ass spreading his seed all over, already replaced Trayvon with a new kid. I hope he rots in a jail cell when this is all said and done. Oh, and he will because he has the impulse control his son had, except for some unfortunate reason hes lived this long.
Click to expand...

Tracy's womanizing removed TM from the mother figure in his life. He seemed to spiral out of control after that. He seems to be another middle aged black male "player".
This is one example of why the black community is in such a sorry state. Illegitimacy and loser fathers has caused a self-imposed genocide ranging from abortion to gang warfare.

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exotix said: ↑

Zimmys whereabouts and what he was doing are unknown for 2 minutes and 28 seconds ... this was the prelude to a killing ..
Click to expand...

Source please.

Foolardi · Jul 8, 2013

DonGlock26 said: ↑

How did the State's case come to this?
Click to expand...

Simple.Really easy breezie.Huge public pressure was put to bear.
Plus crafted Lie after lie.Painting Zimmerman a certain way.As this
overweight,over-bearing Failed Cop Wanabee who liked to profile
blacks and had a criminal past.
Trayvon as some innocent sweet,choir boy just merrily going home with
skittles.When in Fact,he was by virtue of his school suspensions and Tweets
consumed with interest in banging chicks,lookin' for booty and Talkin trash to appear
the gangsta wannabe.Plus fights and fighting.

TomFitz · Jul 8, 2013

Changing font sizes and bolding everything don't make you smart.

They just make you look rude, ignorant and annoying.

I gave up on the post about three graphs, after about the third or forth blatantly false statement.

superbadbrutha · Jul 8, 2013

Foolardi said: ↑

Stop it already You wannabe racist.Finding it suitable to declare yourself Judge
Jury and God himself.
Click to expand...

Please point out the racism in my post.

Making the case for murder when clearly there was no
premeditation.
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It doesn't have to be premediatated to be murder, but I am pretty sure you know that.

If there was than prove it.
Click to expand...

A dead 17yr old who didn't die from natural causes.

I suppose if Zimmerman walks your are gonna
further smear him.
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Yea because I find it hard when grown men murder unarmed teenagers for no other reason than WWB.

I hope Zimmerman does walk.
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I am pretty sure you do, would be like days of old.

But I am very leery that will happen.
But if Zimmy does walk,then we'll see firsthand if what Al Sharpton insisted holds
water.Sharpton insisted all along he only wants Zimmerman to be charged.If that
warrants a Trial than we must respect that.And that we must respect whatever result
a Trial bears.
We'll see.I'm not holding by breath.
Click to expand...

Whatelse can we do but respect. You don't need the bullet when you have the ballot.

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DonGlock26 said: ↑

His texts and cell phone photos tell the tale.
Click to expand...

What tale do they tell?

I'm sorry that your Trayvon the angel fantasy was shattered.
Click to expand...

That is something that racist cooked up and don't recall ever saying that he was an angel.

The truth is that if TM were just a normal kid getting candy and a drink, he would have walked home and GZ would never have called.
Click to expand...

Wow that says alot about you. Thxs.

exotix · Jul 8, 2013

DonGlock26 said: ↑

Source please.
Click to expand...

http://www.hlntv.com/video/2013/07/01/george-zimmerman-trial-full-non-emergency-call

LivingNDixie · Jul 8, 2013

It is all going to come down to two things:
1. Do the jurors feel he should have stayed in the vehicle.
2. Did he pursue Martin when he got out of the vehicle.

Everything else is just show.

Eighty Deuce · Jul 8, 2013

superbadbrutha said: ↑

............. Now had Trayvon been white the same folks on this forum who attacked this kid and claims he got what he deserved would be screaming for Zimmerman's head on a platter. It just shows we still have a long way to go in this country. Hopefully this is a case we can all learn something from ......... .
Click to expand...

Create your racist strawman, then slay your racist strawman.

TomFitz · Jul 8, 2013

I agree it looks like this cat is basically going to get away with murder. I have found it amazing listening to the Zimmerman defenders on this forum pretty much attack this kid and claim that he was a thug, gangsta, etc. Now had Trayvon been white the same folks on this forum who attacked this kid and claims he got what he deserved would be screaming for Zimmerman's head on a platter. It just shows we still have a long way to go in this country. Hopefully this is a case we can all learn something from.
Click to expand...

Well put.

But I doubt that much will be learned from this case, other than the fact that bigotry is alive and well in the US and on vicious and blatant display right here on this thread.

It's no surprise that Daryll Issa chose to suspend his witchunt while the trial was on. The target audience wouldn't have paid any attention to him.,

There is no doubt in my mind that had George Zimmerman shot a white kid, all the bigots on this thread who are talking about the "thug" would be calling for Zimmerman's head. Of course, Zimmerman would be in jail by now if that were the case, anyway.

George Zimmerman is coward and a liar. From what we've seen of him, he's not the sort of person that anyone with any character would even want to be associated with. He practically has LOSER tatooed on his forehead.

But he has fans. The same rubes who fall for every right wing noise scheme, rushed to pay Zimmerman's bills.

I guess even losers need to feel wanted.

Alwayssa · Jul 8, 2013

superbadbrutha said: ↑

I agree it looks like this cat is basically going to get away with murder. I have found it amazing listening to the Zimmerman defenders on this forum pretty much attack this kid and claim that he was a thug, gangsta, etc. Now had Trayvon been white the same folks on this forum who attacked this kid and claims he got what he deserved would be screaming for Zimmerman's head on a platter. It just shows we still have a long way to go in this country. Hopefully this is a case we can all learn something from.

- - - Updated - - -

Here is a prime example of what I am speaking of.
Click to expand...

I would disagree. I think Zimmerman is going to get negligent homicide, not 2nd degree or voluntary manslaughter. If you look at how O'Mara is presenting his case, he is deliginetly trying to imply that the psoecution's case does not meet the more serious charges while at the same time saying that ther version, which hasn't been explained satisfactorily, is what actually happened.

On the Prosecution's side, I belive Witness #8 was solid during cross examination. O'Mara was clearly trying to get her to say something to incriminate TM's past life, but she held her ground during cross examination. In fact all, with the exception of the ME, technical experts gave good acciunting that GZ killed TM and that self defense was not justified. This was pointed out in GZ;s testimoy that he got out of his car.

What this trial is, is basically a he said/he said circumstantial case and the jury is going to decide which side is more credible in general rather than the nit picking that the media has been doing for the past 2 weeks.

jackdog · Jul 8, 2013

after friday I will go on record as 60% acquittal, 20%manslaughter, 20% hung jury. He's is innocent of course but no telling what jury will do sometimes

TomFitz · Jul 8, 2013

Eighty Deuce said: ↑

Create your racist strawman, then slay your racist strawman.
Click to expand...

Try and learn what a straw man argument actually is.

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