Netenyahu to define Israel as a Jewish state

Some ashkenazi and sefaradi jews lived in palestine for centuries and spoke arabic. Are they palestinian arabs? Of course not. Jews are jews (hebrews). Its simple to understand really. The only jews who identify as "arabs" are anti-zionist, and they aren't "plenty". They are a few socialist anti-zionist academics like Ella Shohat (even her own iraqi jewish parents don't follow her radical views), Sami Chetrit (who is from ironically from a berber country ((MOROCCO is even a berber word lol) where many jews spoke french and ladino), Yehuda Shenhav and a few others. Even in Rachel Shaabi's (another anti-zionist) book "we look like the enemy" she encountered many mizrahim who never identified as "arab jews". Ella Shohats essay is also very flawed and inaccurate. She says mizrahim died their hair blonde to 'look ashkenazi' which is a lie. Even Arafat's wife Suha has blond hair. And some mizrahim are naturally blond. And the majority of ashkenazi jews have dark hair and skin which is why Hitler and the nazis hated them among other reasons.

Rachel Shabi herself is lighter than many ashkenazi jews.

Rachel Shabi:



Ashkenazi Israeli:

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Zion is hebrew for Jerusalem. As I said, jews have longed to return to eretz yisrael/palestine for thousands of years, thats why jews always say 'next year in jerusalem' at the end of the passover seder. Many yemenite jews and some iraqi jews form kurdistan and baghdad were also zionist themselves and came to palestine before the farhud and other pogroms. And many mizrahim don't even come from arab countries, many come from Iran, Uzbekistan, and the caucasian countries like Georgia, Dagestan, Armenia, and Azerbaijan.

It was the pogroms in the arab world that were polarizing and racist.

 

Well, you seem like a fine scholar of the Zionist hafrada schooling. It believes it has filtered out all those proud jewish arabs and glories in its perception of a pure jewish residue.
However, I've just been watching the interviews with jewish arabs and they are fine and well. Like I said previously, al Jazeera provides a valuable public service.

That's the Zionist mantra. In fact, ' Zion ' has a deeply spiritual connotation- which I won't trouble you with. Knowledge of the true meaning of Zion makes any bearer closer to the heart of Judaism than you.

 

I just countered everything you said and you respond with this? By your logic ashkenazi jews are 'arab jews' because some lived in palestine for centuries and spoke arabic. I am of Iraqi Jewish descent, I am not arab either. Neither are Iraqi Chaldeans even though they speak arabic.

 

Wow, excellent rebuttal. You can't even debate, you just resort to personal attacks.

 

It isn't a ' personal attack ' to not believe you- and I don't.

 

Yeah you did make a personal attack. You haven't refuted any of the points I posted, instead you say I am lying about my ethnicity and am 'trying to be jewish' I don't know how on earth one does that and I can't think of any reason as to why a person would 'try to be jewish'. If they weren't jewish they certainly wouldn't have much interest in defending Israel. Why would they even care?? I'm half Israeli. When people attack my dad's country, I try to counter their attacks as much as possible. Somebody who wasn't jewish would never devote so much time and effort on a forum to this cause, it simply wouldn't matter to them. I am agnostic as I have said many times. But I am of jewish descent. There are athiest jews. Its not just a religion but an ethnicity and thats why jewish groups share common genetics even though they come from different countries.

 

Perhaps you are unfamiliar with jewish family names like my screen name, which is an extremely common israeli surname so you automatically assume I am making up my jewish ancestry because you are unfamiliar with israeli jewish culture. Maybe its a lack of familiarity, perhaps you assume that all jews have german surnames like 'goldfarb' or 'finkelstein' or something. Or you are just mad at the points I have been making in response to your claims, so you resort to character assassination.

My sn is a part of my family name (do you really think I would give out my full israeli jewish name on a website with hamas and hezbollah sympathizers??) But there is nothing wrong with being proud of your israeli ancestry.

And by your logic, I could say that 'I doubt you are palestinian because you are trying too hard to be palestinian' but I haven't said that statement because I don't resort to attacking (denying) my opponent's ancestry. I just debate the issues. And in your case I actually believe you are indeed palestinian or some other arab ethnicity because of your disdain for Israel and zionism.

 

You're free to believe whatever you decide to be true- so am I.......and I have.

'The lady doth protest too much, methinks '

Hamlet act III, scene II
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamlet

Now it's time to look at ' the elephant in the room ' with regard to Netanyahu's apartheid venture- the Palestinians' Right of Return which is enshrined not only in the hearts and minds of every Palestinian but also in international law;

Some elements of support;

There are approximately six million Palestinian refugees in the diaspora , comprising the original victims of the Nakba and their descendants - all of whom are classified as refugees under international law.
Clearly, the neoZionists' flimsy claim to a ' jewish ' State on the grounds that there is a ' jewish ' majority in Israel would be dashed by the rightful inclusion of the refugees back into the territory from which the Zionist terror gangs drove them. As it is inconceivable that the Palestinians would ever give up their homeland and equally inconceivable that international and humanitarian law would ever change in order to reward Zionism for its illegal activities there is but one area left wherein change is not only justified by law but supported by a massive majority of the world community, and that involves the dissolution of the apartheid Zionist regime.

Sooner, rather than later, there has to be regime change in Israel. It's the next step to world peace and the furtherment of the brotherhood of Man.

 

You are free to believe whatever you want, that I'm not Jewish, or that Khomeini was a humanitarian philanthropist or that Dubya is a martian.

The same palestinians demanding 'right of return' care nothing for the displacement of my people from the islamic world. The arab nations stole from jews, never viewed us as arabs (obviously), the only thing they got right, and displaced thousands upon thousands of my ancestors. They supported arafat who was friends with Saddam Hussein, the butcher of baghdad. They tried to overthrow the jordanian government resulting in black september. They cheered when Saddam fired scuds into Israel, and yes, many of them cheered when 9/11 happened despite others trying to sweep that under the rug as 'myth'. Its truth. Hamas has labeled Bin Laden a martyr, and has condemned his killing as an extra judicial execution. Sounds familiar.

 

We're done with that, thank you- and I won't be commenting on any further role-playing .

Attempted distortions of the historic record are a Zionist stock-in-trade and futile in terms of existing international law. It's been evident for many years that Zionism poses a threat to the rule of law and the lines are pretty much drawn up as to who will support the rule of law now and in the future and who will collaborate with Zionists who seek to tear it down . That appears to be a black v. white issue because that's precisely what it is.

 

You just said 'role playing' insinuating that I am pretending to be jewish, so you sort of contradicted yourself there. Again, you haven't refuted any of my earlier points, you just engage in character assassination. But I can't expect a supporter of Hamas and Hezbollah (and Hezbollah's hero Khomeini) to say rational things, so moving on...

I've got news for you. Israel isn't going anywhere. But if you keep supporting terrorists, it will only hurt the palestinians, the people you say you support, even though your goal is the destruction of Israel evidenced by your blind support for terrorists like Nasrallah and the late Sheikh Ahmad Yassin.

 

Out of curiosity ...
What do Zionists distort in history? [I know this question risks to derail the topic ...]

A part this curiosity,

there is something I don't grasp regarding some readings of the recent history of Middle East.

Zionism is a nationalism, like the Palestinian one or like any other nationalism.

Now, what I don't understand is where was "Palestinism", that is to say, before of Zionism, Arab powers were thinking to Palestine as a possible province of their domains, once expelled the European colonial powers from the area, they were not thinking to an independent Palestine.

At the end, it's just Zionism and the existence of the State of Israel to grant to Palestinians the opportunity to have a state on their own.

No Israel?

Palestine would be a province of Jordan, a piece of it would be a province of Syria and Gaza I guess would be a province of Egypt.

 

This is true.

 

And btw, a more appropriate term for us prior to Israel would have been 'ottoman jews' since we were subjects and inhabitants of the ottoman empire. That would be a good designation which I have no problem with whatsoever because it actually makes sense. Modern day Iraq used to be ottoman, same with palestine, so my ancestors were 'otttoman jews' who spoke a variety of languages including hebrew and neo-aramaic. In most cases 'arab jew' is self contradictory, excluding arabian tribes in arabia that converted to judaism in antiquity. Even yemenite jews are more hebrew than arab, although they do cluster with some sub-saharan africans and arabians, but also still have the most ancient form of hebrew and they still speak and read the torah in this ancient hebrew accent.

Btw, even the robes worn by the rabbi in my avatar are ottoman turkish, not arabic. His title is hebrew not even arabic, Maran HaGaon HaRav Ovadia Yosef Zatzal ( I am so used to saying Shilta, thats weird, still can't believe he passed on). He had the largest funeral in the history of Israel, the largest funeral in thousands of years. If one was defining people by linguistics, then he would be a 'hebrew jew'. Of course he is "Israeli Jewish", just of ottoman origin, specifically born in Ottoman baghdad, like the other minorities like the kurds, assyrians/chaldeans, turkmen, and others.

 

So why attempt it then ? You've an opportunity to remain with the topic now by commenting on the Palestinians' right of return under internatioinal law. #783

 

Its actually on topic because as he said if there was no israel, Palestine would be a province of Jordan, a piece of it would be a province of Syria and Gaza I guess would be a province of Egypt.. Palestine wasn't ever a country, but a region, an ottoman province, later the british mandate, the arabs always referred to it as part of greater syria. It was never a nation or state though, just a region or province. Even after 48, Jordan (formerly part of the british mandate of palestine aka transjordan) occupied the west bank (aD-Diffa-l-gharbiyya) and Egypt occupied the gaza strip (QiTaa3 ghazza). These were jordanian and egyptian territories after 48.

 

I can understand why pro-Zionists would not want to discuss the elephant in the room- but let's see if we can't eliminate all their other options- distractions included, naturally.

Again then- the absolutely imperative consideration of the six million refugees;

What else could the ' jewish ' State gambit be but an attempt to erect a citadel of apartheid ?

 

Palestine was an ottoman province before the british mandate. It was never a country. It was a province or region that belonged to the Ottoman Turks and again, as I said, the arabs referred to it as part of greater syria or ash-shams. Thats what everyone forgets or chooses to ignore. Now palestine is made up of two states, Israel and Jordan. The territories are disputed. What I don't understand is if they really cared, why the arab countries won't take in the refugees, they have plenty of land, 22 countries. Afterall, Israel took in the jews who were expelled from arab countries and their land is the size of NJ.

 

Regurgitated Zionist canards. Follow the topic, please. We're here at present;

 

And again I say Palestine was an ottoman province before the british mandate. It was never a country. It was a province or region that belonged to the Ottoman Turks and again, as I said, the arabs referred to it as part of greater syria or ash-shams. Thats what everyone forgets or chooses to ignore. Now palestine is made up of two states, Israel and Jordan. The territories are disputed. What I don't understand is if they really cared, why the arab countries won't take in the refugees, they have plenty of land, 22 countries. Afterall, Israel took in the jews who were expelled from arab countries and their land is the size of NJ.

 

This requires discernment ...

What if there is a certain suspicion that a part of these refugees are not that ready to live at peace with their neighbors? I wonder ...

 

Then, there is the little detail that, despite UN resolutions recognizing Israel as independent state, as for I know, I'm not aware of an official act of recognition of the State of Israel by Palestinians.

So we are at the usual point:

UN are right when support your vision,
UN are wrong when they say something which sounds wrong to your hears ...

 

Well, if you want to play semantic two-stepping then all they have to do is ' wish ' it. Of course, in the inadmissibility of testimony by neoZionist mind-readers each refugee's right remains.

 

Well, your awareness can now be fulfilled. Palestine recognises the Israeli State on the pre-1967 borders. It does not- nor will it ever- recognise a ' jewish ' State. Such a recognition would adversely affect the refugees right of return- which is under discussion.

Incidentally, your colours are showing.

 

If you are saying the 14 million living Jews today are decendants of converts, Im asking what happened to the original exiles, did they all vanish one day and only a few converts remained ? were aliens involved ?