How Many Bombs Did the United States Drop in 2015?

Collateral damage? You mean killing innocent women and children, right? Let's not hide behind euphemisms. Call it what it is.

 

You mean the military, who signed up voluntarily? We already do that.

 

Sorry, didn't know you ARE a Marine. I edited my next quote for ya. And I agree, we do need a better strategy. Tell me your thoughts on post #24 and whether you feel that would be a good plan or what would be better.

 

The last thing I want is for someone to kiss my ass. And I wouldn't have mentioned it if you hadn't impugned my honor by suggesting that I support terrorists. I don't support ISIS, they are pure scum.

I'm pretty sure 99.99% of Americans support the end of ISIS, myself included. But the question is how do we achieve that objective? I'm of the opinion that a purely military solution will not work and that US government meddling in foreign countries is doing more harm than good. And I'm getting pretty sick of being accused of supporting terrorists and hating America just because I don't go around sucking US government dick all day.

 

Who says pro-war anything.... There is an issue that needs to be dealt with - that is no more being pro-war than a parent hates their child for grounding them or showing some discipline...

War sucks, it's the last thing anyone wants, but at the same time when you're dealing with this level of conflict - it has to happen.... I mean you don't bring a knife to a gun fight and these radicals don't want a knife fight - they want a gun fight - we just have bigger guns and they're not afraid to be martyrs, because in their religion dying for Islam is an honor - death is an honor and life is temporary...

It's such a difficult situation...

No one want's to see innocent people hurt, but at the same time the psychos use the innocents as human shields... They don't care because they believe death for Islam or Allah is honor - a sacrifice of honor, so in their minds they're doing these people a favor by using them as human shields...

 

I'm talking about the pro-war people who remain on their sofas, not the people who put their money where their mouth is. Would have thought that was obvious.

 

Yes and we wouldn't want to hurt their feelings now would we?

 

I was a Marine. I got out in 2008. And my thoughts are that we need to return to the non-interventionist foreign policies of the founding fathers. According to some, that makes me a supporter of terrorists and a hater of America.

 

Good, because I never kiss anyones ass lol.

You can mention it all you want too, but that is a different thread and we could have taken the argument there. We can discuss this issue in the other thread about Iran and why I feel support for Iran is nothing short of support for terrorist regimes such as Hamas, Hezbollah and even ISIS.

Ew, I dont want you to suck the governments dick, I am opposed to most of what our government does because its usually ass backwards anyways. And again I do agree we need to approach this differently, because this is a much different enemy all together. my question to someone that has been there, seen it and lived it is.....what would you like to see done?

 

You still are a marine, that never goes away.

And do you think that will stop ISIS? That we just leave?

Id like to see us be gone too, in my opinion they are not worth american blood. But what of the oil, how do we do business with them?

 

I'd say that accusation has more to do with the constant portrayal of Middle Eastern Muslims as victims of the West. Apologizing for Islam certainly doesn't help, either.

 

I clearly did not miss any of the issues... in my very first paragraph I said, first, we ask the country if they want us there... and if they say no, we leave...

I guess that ruins all the other assumptions you thrust upon me... I clearly stated if they don't want us there we leave...

and the rest of your statement are just assumptions my statements won't work... you've not provided any facts why it won't work, you just assume it won't... you keep saying "we" can't beat them... if you bothered to read my solution you would realize I never said "we" would... I said the country of origin would be responsible for that, and all we would do is play a support role in providing security to their borders... we wouldn't be doing ANY of the work you seem to think we should be doing... thats why its not working now, because we think we need to do it... and clearly I say we should not be doing any of that... it should be their army doing it, it should be their people doing it, it should be their government making the progress and getting the victories... not us...

you seriously didn't read anything I said did you? its starting to look like that the more I read your entire posting and reply to it... everything you keep attmepting to throw in my face... in fact now you're saying I didn't address the flexible nature of ISIL... in fact I did... I in fact dedicated an entire paragraph to what would happen when we eventually have a city that was cleaned up, revert back with some incidents... and I clearly said it would be up to the local police, and if they can't handle it, the countries military would be tasked with going back in to handle it once again... wash rinse repeat... you seriously didn't read or comprehend anything I said did you...

just be honest, which is it, did you not read what I typed, or did you not comprehend it... I'm just personally curious...

 

I don't "support Iran". I support the truth, and if the truth happens to favor Iran in a particular situation, then so be it.

I think our number one priority ought to be making America more defensible by strengthening our country economically, morally, culturally, etc. An important aspect of that would be encouraging a robust militia system, somewhat similar to what they have in Switzerland, but with less government involvement.

We should also interfere less in the internal affairs of foreign countries, as this creates resentment towards America and has a destabilizing effect on the region in question.

Generally speaking, we should return to a domestic and foreign policy stance more in line with the founding fathers. They were not afraid of war, but they made a sincere effort to avoid it whenever possible, and they didn't make it their business to interfere in everyone else's internal business. They had proper priorities.

This isn't comprehensive or in depth by any means, but it's a general outline of what should be done.

 

I think I get to decide what I am.

It's a combination of factors. But I think putting more pressure on regional actors to stop them will go a long way in containing them. It would also be nice if we could stop Turkey and Saudi Arabia, nominal US allies, from supporting AQ and ISIS.

Chances are you've already filled your gas tank up with oil from ISIS territory. They extract it in Iraq/Syria and then smuggle it through Turkey.

 

When you consider the total number of dead and the total number launched, it comes to just about one dead muslim a bomb. That's TERRIBLE efficiency for war. So already we can identify at least one problem, there's a logistics operational meltdown. If I read this report, that's the first thing I'd address as commander in chief.

 

Some are victims. For example, when innocent women and children are killed or maimed. And if taking a nuanced, individualist view of Islam, instead of lumping 1.5 billion people into a faceless blob, is "apologizing for Islam", then guilty as charged.

 

I am certainly not in support of unfettered intervention, but would also rate Vietnam as a disaster many times greater than anything since. Further, I see more long-term misery from such as our intervention in Libya, and toppling of Gaddaffi, as opposed to Iraq, where we left a 100% vacuum in Libya.

However, the Founders were the good old days. Where attacks against our homeland were exceedingly few, and telegraphed months, if not years, in advance. Where our enemies could have been our uncles. Those day are gone forever. As it is often said, and which is unwaveringly true, in this era of terrorism and ICBM's, and everything in between, "we fight them there, or we fight them here".

One or the other is assured.

 

But let's assume that were the case, how is that supporting terrorism and hating America? Is every Muslim a terrorist? Can one only love America if they hate Islam? I don't see the connection.

I'm pretty sure transnational terrorist organizations are more than capable of fighting in two places at once. They don't have to choose one or the other.

 

Well we can agree to disagree on the Iran issue, we will just have to see how it plays out a few years from now. But, I truly hope you are right because I don't want to be right in that situation.

Anyways we pretty much agree on the rest, I too wish we would meddle less in other peoples business and getting ourselves stuck in a situation we can't, or shouldnt be trying to fix. And that includes just needlessly giving billions of dollars away when we need to be fixing things on our own turf.

But it seems these days we are damned if we do, and damned if we dont. But i, like you, feel its time we go back to doing what is best for us for the time being.

 

Turkey seems to try and do their part, but the Saudis are something else. They have all the money and power, but they watch as their own people are maimed on a daily basis. Then again , that is to be expected from muslim controlled countries. They are all with the (*)(*)(*)(*).

 

When have innocent women and children not been killed or maimed ? On that account, how much less do we kill such now, with guided ordinance, than we did just 50-70 yeas ago ? Meanwhile, our enemies play us like a cheap fiddle, seeking cover behind innocent women and children, and then watching the noodle-spined politicians amongst us retreat in horror. Rules of engagement ring a bell ? I served too, btw, as did one of my sons, so we can get all that out of the way if looking for a feather in our caps.

 

Based on my readings, Turkey is just as culpable in supporting terrorists as Saudi Arabia is. They are both trying to topple the government in Syria by using ISIS as a proxy.

 

Turkey is still the two-faced riff-raff that they have always been. They were buying the ISIS oil until Russia decided to blow that (*)(*)(*)(*) up. Obama refused to do so.

 

probably true if you count the firecrackers that we dropped as bombs

 

It's hard to know how many innocents are being killed because the US government is not trustworthy. Evidence suggests they tend to downplay civilian deaths and exaggerate enemy deaths, which is to be expected.

And I don't bring up my service unless someone talks trash about me. If people can just debate the issues instead of the person, then I wouldn't mention it.