The debt is proof of our wealth

Discussion in 'Economics & Trade' started by GodTom, Dec 8, 2017.

  1. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    I was referring to large corporations with shareholders.
     
  2. Longshot

    Longshot Well-Known Member

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    So do the owners of a WSDE face being out-done by competition as well?
     
  3. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    You have NO PROOF of that. ZERO! It's not about "hate". It's about facts. You doubt me? Then recall how many times I have said capitalism is exactly what China needs, and that capitalism provided the US with unprecedented growth and technological advancement. It was once strong and positive, and then it degenerated but FDR brought it back to good times for most all.

    So capitalism has its place and time, but when it exceeds its time, it starts to turn predatorial and creates more problems than it can solve, and that is where we are today.
     
  4. james M

    james M Banned

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    of course the local plumber is vulnerable to national or international companies. In America we are switching to plastic pipe made in China. It's about 3 times faster to install and about 5 times cheaper than copper thus rendering maybe 30% of the plumbers not needed.
     
  5. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    By effective competition? Sure, as long as there is capitalist businesses too. But not by hostile takeovers or stock buy-outs.
     
  6. Longshot

    Longshot Well-Known Member

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    So a WSDE isn't any less capitalist than any other business.
     
  7. james M

    james M Banned

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    capitalism is love, the more you care about your customers the more you please them and drive away less loving or caring companies. If capitalism has changed then we must change it back to capitalism not to communism which slowly starved 120 million to death and is the absolute deadliest most genocidal idea in human history.
     
  8. james M

    james M Banned

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    a liberal won't know that the Great Depression was not a good time. Hard to believe but 100% true.
     
  9. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    You are really having difficulty grasping this stuff. Must I tell you how it is significantly different in one critical way again, or can you redeem yourself by telling me?
     
  10. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    Sure. They have to stay competitive with capitalist businesses as long as there is capitalism. But Rutgers found WSDEs are 4% more productive and 14% more profitable than equivalent capitalist businesses. So it isn't a very desperate situation for them.
     
  11. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    I'm not interested in replying to such asinine trolling.
     
  12. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    In which case Darwin's law suggests that they are the dominant business model.
    Only they aren't so perhaps you and Rugers have missed something in your appraisals.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2017
  13. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    Why limit your understanding of capitalism to them?
    The bulk of all businesses in my country are privately owned.

    Public ownership is quite normal. If you want to invest in it, you can. If you don't. You don't have to.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2017
  14. Longshot

    Longshot Well-Known Member

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    A WSDE is a private business owned and run by private individuals with the goal of earning a profit for those individuals. How is such an organization not capitalistic?
     
  15. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    Ok. One last time.
    WSDEs are collectives, owned and run collectively by the workers. As such they do not exploit anyone. Their main goal is not profits.
     
  16. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    And there is the proof of your lack of knowledge about worker-owned co-ops. The only people who can invest in them are the workers of the business, and they are limited to one share each.
     
  17. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    Who cares?

    I work for a publicly traded company I can buy as many shares in it as I can afford.
    I also own my own private company and don't share it at all.
    And indeed I will work for any kind of business that is willing and able to pay.

    Whatever floats your boat mate.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2017
  18. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    Fair enough. You aren't interested in solving any problems other than your own. We have sociopathic individuals here in the US who are much like that and they won't stop the wheels of progress.
     
  19. Longshot

    Longshot Well-Known Member

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    The workers in a WSDE need to pay their rent and buy groceries. Hence, it's imperative that the WSDE make a profit and compete against other privately owned firms.
     
  20. Kode

    Kode Well-Known Member

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    True. So? Why don't you research actual case histories and examples of WSDEs and their ways?
     
  21. Longshot

    Longshot Well-Known Member

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    I never said that WSDEs exploit anyone, so you can quit it with that.

    I did say that WSDEs, being a privately owned business, must make a profit in order to continue operating and in order to allow their owners to pay their rent, groceries, utilities, etc.

    They are a private company, just like any other private company.
     
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  22. Longshot

    Longshot Well-Known Member

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    To what end?
     
  23. bringiton

    bringiton Well-Known Member

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    It's a debt money system. The greenbacks were fiat money, issued without debt.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2017
  24. bringiton

    bringiton Well-Known Member

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    It has everything to do with the money system, because debt money is inherently destabilizing.
     
  25. Reiver

    Reiver Well-Known Member

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    Could you go through the economics in support of this statement? Please remember to reference core research
     

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