Parkland Middle School student hit, killed on Loop 375 after leaving campus during walkout

The bolded is not at issue. What's at issue was whether or not they WOULD"VE BEEN STOPPED had reasonable measures been taken. Like watching the ****ing sides.

 

Of course they weren't watching the sides of the school. I know that. I posted it.

Why would they waste manpower supervising areas where no kid was supposed to be? Why would they limit the amount of supervision in the large group? Just because they didn't have adults surrounding the entire campus, it doesn't prove negligence. Let's say a fight broke out in the large group. Justify putting supervision in places were no kid was supposed to be, and limiting the supervision of the large group to do so. You can't. It isn't reasonable to limit direct supervision of students in order to supervise places where no student had permission and where they weren't supposed to be. I seriously doubt this is the first time these students participated in an activity where they went, en masse, to the football field. They probably knew the drill, and thus knew the side doors wouldn't be supervised.

The kids that skipped made a stupid decision, and knew they were breaking school rules. It ended tragically. That doesn't mean the school is liable or negligent, when the kids deliberately evaded detection to skip the activity.

 

Get real. Put the onus on the parents who didn't teach this kid not to cross a busy freeway. Or maybe they did and he didn't listen choosing instead to cross that freeway listening to his friends instead. THAT is what got him killed. Wouldn't it be interesting to call up his cohorts who crossed that freeway and ask them if they have ever crossed it before. If they did, any lawsuit will be thrown out of court.

 

Maybe you can volunteer to watch the sides of the school next time? Maybe the PTA or some community group can do that? Or maybe kids can follow the rules… the ones intended to keep them safe.

 

Parents should have the final say in what, exactly? What assemblies the students have? So what, some vocal minority can demand a bunch of religious bullshit in an assembly?

I see a whole bunch of hand wringing over the death of this kid as evidence the walkouts were wrong.

You rightists make me ****ing sick with your political point scoring.

 

Proving negligence means proving mens rea. Tell me how you would prove the school intended to allow students to leave the campus, because they didn't supervise exits that were not supposed to be in use.

 

Kids weren't supposed to be out the front or the back either, why did they watch the front and the back?

Limit the amount of supervision by providing MORE supervision? You've a funny understanding of how the world functions sir. We're talking about 2 persons here, not a cordon. And nothing would prevent them from advancing on the group and aiding others should the need arise. Not to mention that if the decision is "have 2 people circulating in the crowd or have 2 people on the sides to watch for hooky" the decision is really "we can't have this assembly safely because we lack the manpower".

When the kids were only able to avoid detection because basic and reasonable measures were not taken on the part of the school to prevent a common activity (absconding) during a mass rally planned in advance (see fire drill or pep rally example discussions previous) on 4 ****ing 20? It sort of does or at least presents a legitimate question

 

Lol.... INTENDED to allow? That would be an intentional tort, negligence is not an intentional tort. The mens rea you prove is NEGLIGENCE, IE that a reasonable person should've known that by not supervising either the exits or the students more closely during this mass rally on 4/20 the students were likely to abscond and foreseeably could be injured crossing the streets and highways adjacent to the school while fleeing custody since they would likely be moving quickly to avoid detection and more worried about pursuit from authority than what is in the roadway.
One thing you can use is: They covered the FRONT and the BACK.
Why? Is it because its foreseeable that if you don't cover the exits kids might leave? Then why not the sides? Why not place the front and back watchers on opposite orientation corners so they can watch 2 separate angles a piece and thus cover both? What burden would that have placed on the school to either add 2 or move the existing 2 and use them more efficiently? What utility could be gained from that?

 

Micromanaging is what you call having a curriculum I expect? Precious.

 

Morally it is on the parents. They raised someone who made poor decisions.
Legally? The law says that the last entity to have a duty to the kid that was breached and resulted in injury is liable. But for the school's negligence in letting the kid abscond he would not have been on that highway. All they had to do was take the reasonable measure of watching the exits.

If the school knew it was habitual to do this, that makes it WORSE not better. If it was habitual for the kid to skip school and the school didn't know that, that also makes it WORSE not better.
Kids having a propensity to skip school and cross the highway doesn't make the case easier for the school genius

 

The PTA can certainly participate in assemblies and it would be a cheap alternative if somewhat unreliable. Perhaps instead some, and by some I mean 2, of the existing staff members endorsing this riot can be bothered to do their ******ned jobs and take reasonable measures to prevent their charges from absconding on Friday 4/20 out a side door with a 3-5ft high stone wall next to it next to the ****ing highway.
Again: What great burden is having 2 staff members watching the sight lines? Explain how and why that is a great burden.

 

How were the kids supposed to get to the football field if they weren't using the front and back entrances?

I've seen something reported differently about what the kids did…

The students left class during a walkout on the 19th anniversary of the Columbine school shootings to protest gun violence in schools.

During the walkout at Parkland Middle School, students said that they gathered on the school's football field.

But Johnathan and other students jumped a fence and left campus.

Johnathan and the other students left the school without permission, Ysleta Independent School District officials said.

https://www.elpasotimes.com/story/n...ol-student-killed-walkout-loop-375/547960002/


He and several other students left the designated area set up at the school for students participating in the walkout to go to a park, officials said.

Police said witnesses saw a group of children cross Loop 375 West, from south to north near the Bomarc Street off-ramp.

A memorial was erected where Parkland Middle School sixth-grader Jonathan Benko jumped the fence and was killed by a passing vehicle Friday. Benko left a national anti-gun walkout with other students.


On the way back, the students attempted to again cross the highway, from north to south. Police said Jonathan, 11, was the last student to attempt to cross the highway.

"I think what’s being irresponsibly promoted is the idea that this district and Parkland Middle School endorsed or promoted a walkout. Nothing could be further from the truth," De La Torre said.

Pati Nava, a parent of a Parkland student, said she's saddened at Friday's incident but feels the school personnel did everything they could.

"I'm very heartbroken for the family and for the kids who were friends with the boy," Nava said. "Unfortunately, they decided to go and ditch. They're kids; sometimes they don't really think things through."

The superintendent said he's communicated with law enforcement and that no teachers, staff or other school personnel will face consequences.

"I’ve been privy to sit with the officers who have interviewed witnesses, including witnesses at the scene, and there isn’t anything even remotely close to warranting any form of discipline to any of the administrative staff, teachers or any support staff," De La Torre said.

De La Torre said the group of students who left the walkout will likely face disciplinary action.

"As with any other student who is truant, there are consequences," De La Torre said. "We’re trying to be sensitive to the situation and not moving forward aggressively until the investigation is closed, at which time we will determine if consequences are appropriate and what they should look like."

https://www.elpasotimes.com/story/n...lled-student-during-school-walkout/542410002/

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Not a tort- criminality. A death is involved.

However, see another of my responses to you. The Superintendent sat with police during interviews and has said there is no reason to punish any teachers or administrators in this instance.

 

Just because there is enough for a civil case does not mean there is enough for a criminal case. Preponderance vs BARD standards make for different results.

A criminal negligence case would STILL turn on NEGLIGENCE not INTENTIONAL conduct. Though I doubt this rises to the level of criminally negligent homicide, that has no bearing on whether or not a civil suit can be won.


O well if the ultimate administrator for the district says his entity's ass should be covered then that's the last word!!

 

The football field is on the back side of the school. Why would you go out the front door? Exactly, you wouldn't. So why did the front need watching? Could it be because its reasonably foreseeable that kids would LEAVE school if given the opportunity!?!?!? Perish the thought!

1) Student was IN the designated area AND THEN LEFT IT BY THE FENCE WITH A LARGE GROUP. You have been claiming he never WENT to the football field. I assume you are willing to lay that down now? Admit to same if so.
2) Student was WITNESSED leaving. WHO witnessed? WHERE were the supervisors you say were circulating through the crowd? Why did they not notice a group of children climbing a fence and walking off?
3) The school implicitly endorsed the assembly by a) designating space for it b) not punishing those attending c) apparently allowing the children to simply announce they intended to attend and wander off without supervision.
4) All this bold and caps attack about what the ultimate result of the investigation is and you missed this little gem, I'm sure not on purpose or anything : ""As with any other student who is truant, there are consequences," De La Torre said. "We’re trying to be sensitive to the situation and not moving forward aggressively until the investigation is closed, at which time we will determine if consequences are appropriate and what they should look like.""
You're proudly touting an ultimate decision that isn't ultimate yet

 

What was the duty of the school in a non-sanctioned event?
How did the school breach their legal duty in the non-sanctioned event?
How did the school's actions, in the non-sanctioned event, cause the death of the student?

 

Take the case, counselor, if you're so sure of a win. I do not share your confidence that the school was negligent or liable for the tragic death of this child.

 

The students were going to walk out, with or without the school's permission. As I said, the school administration appears to have made the best of the situation. Teachers were circulating among the students, the organizers were convinced to hold the activity on school grounds, and the admin was manning the exits. That the sudents who left scaled a fence should tell you a lot about the supervision.

There are many activities where the supervision on school grounds is essentially teachers circulating among students, and that begins with recess, lunch, and before and after school.

We have too many people functioning at a "BARE MINIMUM level," IMO. Why? Because schools have failed to motivate students to learn. We have classes in how our government functions, yet few students are motivated to remember the curriculum. We teach them how to calculate percentages, but less than half of adults have bothered to remember how.

How about learned, not just taught?

We can see that approach has too many shortcomings.

It's not about having more options, but about motivating students to learn and retain basic skills.

How about weeding out incompetents?

Alleged neligent supervision. As I said: "There are many activities where the supervision on school grounds is essentially teachers circulating among students, and that begins with recess, lunch, and before and after school."

Consider yourself better educated on schools and schooling. Good luck to you, counselor, on getting the court to conclude the school administration was negligent.

 

If the liberal teachers have a release signed by the parents for the anti Bill of Rights protest lets see it

Someone just said that the libs didnt need no stinkin’ permisdion from the parents

So which is it?

 

The kid was in school for an education not rpolitical radicalization

This was not a field trip to the Museum of Natural Science

 

What do non sanctioned events have to do with anything in this case? The event was sanctioned it had a DESIGNATED AREA, the administration simply allowed students to attend, and did not punish any who did.

 

Don't be salty because your own link helps my argument and not your own

 

What proof do you have on circulation? We've links in this thread that state they covered SOME of the gates in and out and that's it. What's your link that says they circulated?

Yes the facts along with the Streetviews, positioning of the fence, and the clear sight lines DO tell me a whole lot about the quality of the supervision IE that it was unreasonably lax
"Admin manning the exits" you mean only SOME of the exits. Not the sides. Right next to the highway. Where the death occurred.

Yes and those are scheduled events which happen with certain amounts of students at one time. They don't involve most of the school population like this cluster ****. Those events which DO involve all or most tend to REQUIRE more supervision see the fire drill and pep rally discussions previously.

Yes that would be lovely, but they'll still need the rote learning as it is the MINIMUM. Such is also NOT the topic of THIS discussion now STOP your childish attempts at deflection. You think you're slick son, but you ain't slick.

On incompetents: Yes you can add that to the list of things not really the basis of this discussion. Unless you're admitting incompetence was the root of this clusterfuck in which case I don't know why we're arguing about whether the school was negligent or not. Ergo I assume you're simply attempting deflection again. Stop it. It's ****ing annoying.

Yes that's right I'm making an argument that someone has committed a tort (also known in this context as an allegation). Good for you, you're learning! It's like watching an infant work the baby einstein! Magical!

Students at my high school (a 5a that at that time needed to be 2 separate schools but the football program didn't like that idea so they were holding off. It was later split into 2 5a schools) back in the aughts ('00's) raised a big damn stink about immigration. Were going to walk out. Most of HOUSTON and its surrounding areas DID. Want to know what happened at my school? They simply informed them that walking out would bear the consequences of truancy, and numerous other punishments and then had the resource officers, coaches, and some teachers simply enforce order. What they did not do was designate an area for the walkout to occur or fail to supervise the students on the appointed day or roll over to ****ing children and not do ****ing dick.

 

There's nothing radical about wanting kids to stop being the target of mass shootings.

If you think that is radical you don't belong in a civilization.