"Raising Children Without the Concept of Sin"

..right.. like raising children is a 'science!'

..only in Progresso World...

 

I'm glad what you have done has worked for you and your child.
But arrogantly condemning parents who also have raised successful children using methods proven to work for them is wrong. Period.

 

Let's see... for thousands of years, parents have used corporal punishment. Now, in Progresso World, it is redefined as 'child abuse!'

So results..

Are children, young adults, and adolescents better adjusted? More socialized? (in the psychological sense, not political indoctrination!) Moral? Productive?

I think those who have seen the cultural shifts brought about by progressive child rearing techniques are better equipped to comment, rather than those indoctrinated into the progressive family cult..

 

I have not condemned anyone.

I have just pointed out that using physical abuse is a FAILURE on the part of the parents IMO.

Since when am I not allowed to express my opinion?

 

Why does scientific KNOWLEDGE cause such anxiety for fundamentalist theists?

Is it because it is too difficult to comprehend?

 

I never said you should not be allowed your opinion. And I'm confused...who doesn't agree that a child shouldn't be abused?

. Do you think parents who would swat the hand of a two year old grabbing something they shouldn't have after hearing and understanding the word "no" is abusive?

 

Oh yes.. good false narrative!

No, the bizarre, irrational displays are from progressive indoctrinees, who think their EVERY BELIEF AND OPINION, is somehow, 'settled science!'

No room for tolerance there! Just mandated Truth from the ruling elite, drilled into gullible dupes for decades, until their natural skepticism surrenders to the propaganda. Now, they are bobbleheads for progressive ideology, not criticality thinking people.

 

What was the mindset of the parent doing the "swatting" at the time?

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/...201409/here-s-how-break-the-cycle-child-abuse

 

Ironic PROJECTION duly noted and ignored for derogatory reasons.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/...201409/here-s-how-break-the-cycle-child-abuse

Obviously that is a "truth" that theists refuse to deal with since it would require actually taking responsibility for their own actions when failing to "spare the rod" in fits of anger.

 

Sorry if the shoe fit. I was merely pointing out the intolerance of progressive indoctrinees, and their insistence that all of their opinions and beliefs are 'settled science!'

You did not notice anything 'derogatory!' in your first reply to me? (or most all your replies to me!)

Is it because my beliefs and opinions are 'religion!', while yours are 'science!'? Facts by decree?

..funny, too, that you immediately trump up the 'Religion!' narrative, when the topic was child rearing..

 

Not my problem if the factual scientific KNOWLEDGE exposes the fallacies of your superstitious dogma!

 

One notes that the system of punishing parents for daring to BE parents was devised by leftists. Children are individuals and some respond to physical punishment to the extent that he or she will stop committing offenses whereas others do just the opposite when physically disciplined. Parents have to learn about their children.

 

..this from the OP is just too much..

Injustice and inequality? Really? In a completely atheistic naturalism worldview? Morality does not exist, in a godless universe, so why be concerned about 'Injustice and Inequality!'? Embrace it, and make the best of your life. Fighting 'Injustice and Inequality!' is a fools errand, in a godless universe.

This is just another bobbleheaded progressive indoctrinee, parroting the propaganda she was steeped in her whole life. .. a sad commentary on the decline of reason and freedom, in American culture.

 

There are very effective parenting methods using cognitive-behavioral incentives. Praising positive/ pro-social conduct and using non-physical consequences to address negative behavior. When the child learns that acting in a manner that pleases the parent or teacher results in rewards then the lesson is learned. Self-control/ accepting delayed gratification with the expectation of praise/ rewards can greatly help the child's regulation of behavior. Instead of spanking a kid when oppositional, it is more effective to set limits and withdraw privileges [ie. removing toys that the child can recover when achieving positive expectations]. Demonstrating parental love by devoting more attention to the emotional needs of the child can produce very good results.

 

If only people were formulaic... but what 'works' with one kid, does the opposite with another. If there was a singular, fool proof method of child rearing, everyone would be doing it. But child raising opinions are like religious beliefs. People feel very strongly that 'their' way is best! Then, when adolescence comes around, all theories are destroyed, and the hapless, discouraged parent realizes that it is mostly a crap shoot.

Oh, affirmation, love, and encouragement is good.. as well as discipline and negative reinforcement. But to claim some 'one size fits all!' for parenting will only bring a chuckle to the old folks..

I wish you well. Enjoy your kids, and follow your instincts. They are usually more trustworthy than 'expert!' opinion, anyway!

 

The article isn't science, it's bias btw.

A toddler like any child needs clear boundries and opportunities to learn to respect her parents and to grow her self control.

A toddler wandering around the room starts to reach for the cord plugged into the outlet. You tell the child "no". She pulls her hand back...as she knows the meaning of that word... but testing her boundaries she reaches back toward it....probably while looking at you. You slap her hand. She stops and moves on. Then she sees the glass full of water on the table. She reaches for it. You say "no". She moves on.

She's had the opportunity to learn to respect her parent who has established a clear boundry. Children thrive if they respect their parents. She's had the opportunity to learn self control. She's learning what she can touch and what she shouldn't.

The mindset of a parent is to disapline in a loving way with her best interests in mind.

 

IMO the use of therm 'blind' faith ass a short form way of disparaging theists beliefs without having to further justify their position. Firstly it implies that an atheistic position is one based solely on clear sighted logic while their opponents position is, by default always based on the opposite i.e. emotive ignorance and a willful failure to observe what the atheist regards as uncontroversial fact. Atheists see things clearly - theists do not. Having said that, in my time I have seen just as many atheists get emotional/ hot under the collar when their beliefs are challenged in a debate as theists.

Secondly it assumes that theists cannot and do not engage in academic study or critical thinking about their beliefs, never re-access their viewpoints over time and/or cannot martial logical arguments to justify their beliefs. Again my experience is the opposite. I have listened to theists mount logical and clearheaded reasons for believing what they do and heard atheists spout misinformed drivel i.e. 'No Mam, Christ wasn't executed in Rome by Julius Caesar because the Romans objected to 10 commandments ' (And I did hear this.) I'm also fully aware there are fringe elements in most religions that do their bulk of believers no favors at all.

Lastly I have seen theists give up their beliefs over time and atheists change their minds and upon reflection accept a religious faith. Positions on such things are like most things in life, subject to change over time. So since both sides can and do martial arguments to support their I would suggest not using the word 'blind' in connection with faith because I've seen 'blindness' on both sides.

 

I was able to teach reason to my children without using corporal punishment or guilt induced religion to make them feel inferior.

 

It's been around for a long time. It's called "moral relativism". Now some Progressive is painting it as a "New Enlightenment". They are always so smart.....thinking up so-called "Revolutionary ideas". The book should be called, "How to usher in the new Hell on Earth". Many already live it.

 

You can watch Parents in the grocery store all the time trying to talk their child out of misbehavior. "Oh please be a good boy, so you don't make Mommy sad". Usually it is because Mommy has not "trained up the child" properly from the get go and she is a child herself.......but sometimes a quick swat on the bottom alerts the child to the seriousness of the infraction and lets them know the boundaries they have crossed. Not all children need it, but in some instances their attention span needs to be alerted. I've raised three to adulthood so I guess that gives me a little wisdom. They are all three very different. I'll take proper parenting over government raising families any day!

 

I had a parent like you Derideo. Not that he didn't use physical punishment when things got out of hand (and in my case, it did from time to time) but rather, like you he had all the answers. He told me right from wrong and his reason for doing so was, "because I am your father, I know all the answers." When I got into my teens, I began to observe his failures. I saw him compromise his own rules. My conclusion? My Dad is not all knowing. I won't do things just because he says so.

I found faith. I raised my kids to know I am not infallible. I know the One however who isn't. I try to connect with Him all the time in my decisions. He has given me the basics on paper, and I try my best to live by them. As long as you are in my charge, you will follow those concepts then you will learn by experience what it is like to follow God. Of course you can reject it when you are older and go your own way coming up with your own concept of right and wrong hoping that gels with everyone else who has their own concepts of right and wrong.

 

I'd like to add an anecdote from my personal life.

When I was in middle school I started drinking, smoking weed, dropping acid... primarily, but I'd try any substance put in front of me.

One morning after getting high and drinking the previous night, my Mom tried waking me up for school. I'd passed out on the couch. She tried being gentle several times. I was annoyed and had no intention of going to school. When she again tried waking me up, I sprung up and shouted "F off you F'n B".

Yeah...

The instant the last word left my mouth, there were fists pounding my face and head. Fists with rings.

Guess what... I got up and went to school. And after that incident, I learned to take Mom more seriously. That experience didn't 'fix' my problem, but it pushed me in the right direction.

There's the obvious question of why I was able (or interested even) in getting inebriated at such an early age, and how my Mom allowed it to happen. That's a different thread. The point is that I played a role in it, my Mom tried and tried to correct my behavior in gentle ways, to no avail.

Imagine she'd just gasped when I spoke to her in that manner, and walked away. Guess what I would've done? I can assure you that I wouldn't have felt guilty in retrospect. I would've continued on, AND push the boundaries as far as possible. That would've been detrimental to me, her son.

I have no animosity towards my parents for physically disciplining me. Considering the unique circumstances of their lives, I have no idea how I'd handle life any differently. In fact, I've let my Mom know that when she can no longer take care of herself, I'm here for her, absolutely.

Simply put; there are some situations where there's no other options, because everything else has been exhausted and then some.

"He who spares the rod hates his son" is a deeper truth/reality than some virtue signalling person who seems to believe that they have all the answers for all situations where parenting is concerned.

 

No, I do not assume that the atheistic position is inherently more rational than a rational evidence-based believe in a creator. Atheists being human can be irrational and have weak arguments too, and most atheists do have a lot of weak arguments, but that is just how people are in general.

There are some Christians who are very philosophical and are interested in the debate over the truth of Christianity. These people are definitely in the minority and the vast majority of Christians don't really know much about Christian theology and philosophy and mostly just read the bible, listen to their pastors, and have faith.

The arguments that many of these Christian philosophers bring up are really easy to refute. There are also some really strong arguments against Christianity that consist of horrible bible teachings, scriptural errors, and a philosophy that doesn't make any sense. They tend to have this built-in faith in Christianity, and then will find arguments to justify their faith, rather than starting with the evidence and using it to guide to the right conclusion. That is why their arguments are just so incredibly weak and they talk themselves out of the problems with the bible.

The arguments that try to prove that Jesus is God from the fact that his apostles claimed it in their books and are "witnesses" are especially weak and I don't understand how some of these smart Christian philosophers take them seriously.

 

Good for you. I have seen parents raise great human beings by instilling a religious foundation and an occasional and necessary swat on the rump. Not all human beings known as children respond the same way to the same things and some atheists who eschew all corporal punishment no matter what do manage to raise absolute monsters.

 

Are you even aware that over ninety percent of psychological and social study research do not return the same results every time they are re-enacted? That's a dirty little secret that was 'discovered' some time ago and then buried by the horrified scientific community. Before I'd accept any such 'proof' I'd want to know that the exact same scientific study had been run by independent research groups several other times and have returned the same results each and every freaking damn time.