American soldiers should disobey and refuse to fight in case of battles

Shouldn't they just not join in the first place? What would be the point in them joining if they're not willing to do the thing that the military exists for?

 

If they are not willing to fight, then they should not join the military. If drafted and they refuse to serve, they will go to prison. It will be their choice. When they join, they take an oath to defend the constitution and to obey the superiors appointed over them.

 

Absolutly not. I'm not at the left first. I don't have any specific hostilty toward Trump, and among euros I speak with, I'm clearly one of the less hostile to Trump. I wouln't go as far as saying I appreciate him, far from it. I have a deep distrust of any politician. From my point of view, politician are globally a class of narcissic and sociopathic people with few morale.
I don't wish America to loose or to suffer. For me american politicians, are politicians. They're not worse than the one of my own countries, but not better. I have toward them the same scorn that I have for the politicians of my country.
I wish however for american ordinary citizens the best.

I like reading about history. I have seen that in many wars, such as the french revolution war, the napoleonic wars, the french colonization war, the WW1 war, politician have send countless men into death for their own selfish interest. I lived in many french cities, and I had hundred of opportunities to see the long list of names that are written on the monuments for WW1 french soldiers, and I just kept from that a deep disgust of war.
To that, we could had the numerous times that war were justified in french in name of "democracy", "human rights" and end finally to be to secure the interest of some big corporations. Recently, some french soldiers died in Sahel, for what ? There is many interests in Sahel.
Sarkozy manipulated the opinion in making the war in Lybia approved. For what ? Now that Ghaddafi is gone, the country is a mess. It's likely that Sarkozy had some dirty interests with Ghaddafi, furthermore, some french companies like Dassault had some interest in this war, Dassault that own one of the biggest newspaper.
I had the occasion to discuss with some african, knowing that my own country have been dirtied into messing with some african countries for a few corrupted politicians.
Globally, the same thoughts could be shared on the ways american politician use the lives of american soldiers.
I told you, I think the same for french soldiers. I don't have any bad feeling about american soldiers or normal citizens, I have a global disgust about how politicians with the collusion of medias use the soldiers, use war for their interests.

My deep disgust for politicians and the medias is the biggest source of my disgust for wars.

Another more anecdotic element played : the all recent war of the left on "white males" didn't improved the whole thing. Why should some males, even more if the are white sacrifice themselves for that society that scorn them ? I think we share the same distrust of the left. I also admire a lot of things about the army and some soldiers. I truly think them as admirable. It sadden me to see in France, or US, the best dying to protect the worst.

Was I specifically speaking of the war in Iran ? No. That's a more general thought on wars and by the way that specific war triggered the thread, but my aim wasn't speaking of only a possible conflict with Iran.

 

So it was just a coincidence you posted this thread at about the same time the world was in irrational hysterics about a war with Iran? OK.

 

Yes. Make that a law and war would become a last resort instead of a political tool

 

They could work in our field hospitals, mopping the blood up off the floor.

 

Yes. That's best idea yet! Make it a requirement to hold office

 

No. I said that my thought was more general, and it's something I had before the tensions with Iran. It's effectively all the memes/jokes about WW3 that was posted after the assassination of that iranian general that decided me to post that.

 

OK so your posting was related to this fake WW III nonsense.

 

Bingo!

 

The solution is- don't join our army. Move to some country where nobody gives a damn.

 

Local, state, and federal laws to start. International laws is a good bookmarker also.


And I dont care about our enemies laws. We are supposed to be better than that. The shining light on a hill and all that.

 

Why? That is a ridiculous idea.

 

Yes, this is the quandary faced by Israel - it is held to a higher moral standard than
the enemies trying to eliminate it.
Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

 

This reminds me of one of the many false allegations made by Michael Moore,
that Congress sends others to die in battle. Statistics show that members of
Congress have a higher number of their own sons and daughters in the military
than the general public.

 

It may take more courage not to fight.... however it is an all volunteer force. If you wish not to fight don't sign up and fight for your conviction outside of the military. When you join the military you follow orders.

 

As I understand it, people used to sign up for the military to be a mechanic or a firefighter or something, miss a qualification and get transferred to the infantry, then shipped off to combat zone. That is not voluntary.

I'm hearing from folks now that this doesn't happen anymore. If not, then I have no problem with it

 

Oh for pity sake. The military is a fighting force. Or they could even be trained to drive a truck and then be expected to drive on in a war zone.

 

I'd like to see that formula. Do you have a link?

 

I still call that voluntary.

 

No sorry. Moore did this mockumentary called Fahrenheit 11/9. Someone did a counter
documentary of Moore's work but couldn't get it screened. So much for the Capitalist
press. This man documented the lies of Moore - they came in about one every 90 seconds.
Amongst them was that claim about Congressmen.

 

Even if the recruiter told them 'you won't be sent into combat'?

 

If that expectation is made clear before they sign, then fine.

Im talking about when enlistees are led to believe they will not be sent to fight, and then are anyway, if that even happens anymore (I hear now it doesnt).

 

Of course. These recruits are adults. They should be expected to think like adults.

 

So, adults should expect the military to lie to them to get them to join.

Thats pretty shitty. Why can't we expect better than that of our military?