Justice ready to charge Google with monopoly search practices

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by Lil Mike, Oct 17, 2020.

  1. peacelate

    peacelate Banned

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    In this case it wouldn't have done anything because net neutrality is targeted towards service providers. My point is that this whole notion that the GOP supports equal access to information on the web and the supposed anti-conservative stance of big tech giants is laughable considering Trump and his cronies voted to repeal laws protecting those very rights.
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2020
  2. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    yeah, heard they would do this to Microsoft before too, then republicans took breakup off the table, so I doubt it will happen

    that and the government has very close ties to google, they get a lot of information from them, so there is that - once google collects your information, it's theirs, not yours, making it much easier for the government to get that data

    what I think republican are doing is gonna make a deal to make it even easier to get out information, and to end this, google will agree

    remember, republican are the ones that created the patriot act - republicans are about giving the government more power, not less
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2020
  3. Grey Matter

    Grey Matter Well-Known Member Donor

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    Ah, the R's, so dominated by the D's search engine of choice.

    Yep, still crazy after all these years.... the infamous Santorum Google Result.

    I suspect this post will be deleted given the puritanical US style leaning of this site, but, I'll give it a go anyway, since it does actually support the OP's claim of bias.

    Then again, maybe it's just that the engine has somehow been built with input from a comedian.

    Santorum Google Results.jpg
     
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  4. GrayMan

    GrayMan Well-Known Member

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    Small government isn't, no government. There is a time and place for government and regulating big business and monopolies is one of them.
     
  5. Yulee

    Yulee Well-Known Member

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    There are greater than 15 other search engines. No barriers to enter the market, no price fixing.

    They aren't a monopoly. This is big government intruding on a companies business. This could have catastrophic consequences!
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2020
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  6. clovisIII

    clovisIII Well-Known Member

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    This is ridiculous. I have no problem with antitrust laws, so indeed if google is proven to be an insurmountable monopoly, by all mean break it up. Though there used to be a day when republicans hated the idea of punishing a company because it was succesful.
    However, the fact that you would want a company to be disbanded because you do not like it's product and would want to damage them by looking into it's proprietary rights using antitrust laws to do so is as unamerican as you can get.
    That is really as shameless as one can be
     
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  7. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    Well "your point" seems factually incorrect since you've just clarified that "it wouldn't have done anything." So...OK.
     
  8. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    Heh, a lot of people making non points in this thread!
     
  9. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    You know, I had forgotten about that! It was from a more innocent time...

    It sounds as if you think it was great that a massive international corporation rigged their search algorithm for the sole purpose of personally attacking one person.

    Your values intrigue me.
     
  10. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    I don't think I've expressed an opinion on the righteousness or correctness of the charge. I am interested in the discovery process however. I'm curious about what will turn up.
     
  11. mdrobster

    mdrobster Well-Known Member

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    I got the same images from a google search.
     
  12. Nightmare515

    Nightmare515 Ragin' Cajun Staff Member Past Donor

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    While it's a slightly different subject the point seems valid. It was the Republicans who were mostly in favor of getting rid of net neutrality which gives more power to internet companies. Conservatives always tout free market capitalism and touted the same thing regarding net neutrality, "let the market handle it and push competition". Well many folks from all over the internet screamed about how ISPs are already too big and there is no starting up a new ISP in your area if you don't like the one you have because the logistics are astronomical. Trying to start up a new ISP in an area dominated by Comcast is like trying to start a new department store chain expecting to compete with Wal-Mart. You simply can't do it in real life, on paper sure, but in real life you aren't competing with Wal-Mart, you will lose, they are simply too big and well known already.

    The hypocrisy is what is being highlighted with the comparison to net neutrality. Republican voters are who gave the power to ISPs by repealing net neutrality expecting "competition" to drive that market. They gave ISPs like Comcast the legal authority to throttle your internet connection if you are watching Amazon Prime instead of Netflix because they want you to watch Netflix instead (hypothetical). So why are Republicans upset by what Google and Twitter and Facebook are doing? If it's ok for Comcast to throttle my internet if they so desire to push me in a specific direction then why is it not ok for Google to alter their search algorithm to push me in a specific direction?

    I don't like the power that Google has either but Republicans need to stop picking and choosing when to apply their own morals based on convenience. Either the internet is a free open source of information not subject to any sort of tampering or it's not. If we don't like what Google is doing then "let the market drive competition", that's the Conservative way. The problem is that we all know reality, Google is simply too big to ever be competed with effectively. In the eyes of hundreds of millions of people Google is the "internet" and I don't care how much money you have you aren't competing with Google they are simply too big and well known already. Sure there are other search engines out there but Google will always be the number 1 source of information online and since they are intentionally messing with their search algorithm to push a narrative now all of a sudden we have a problem with it.
     
  13. GrayMan

    GrayMan Well-Known Member

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    The Republicans are doing it to protect American values by priority. Free speech is essential to the success of a democracy and is the highest priority.

    Unlike the Republicans, I don't see corporations as people. I am not against regulating corporations.
     
  14. struth

    struth Well-Known Member

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    net neutrality didn’t make it so that google can’t rank their searches in aw way to be bias for the left
     
  15. peacelate

    peacelate Banned

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    How is google being bias? Because they don't show the preferred searches you want?
     
  16. struth

    struth Well-Known Member

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    yes. they bury stories negative to the dems
     
  17. peacelate

    peacelate Banned

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    Well this type of behavior has been condoned by the GOP for years when they allowed ISPs to throttle your bandwidth to websites they don't favor.
     
  18. struth

    struth Well-Known Member

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    that has nothing to do with how google operates their search results
     
  19. peacelate

    peacelate Banned

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    If ISPs are allowed to restrict your access to information on the web, why isn't google?
     
  20. struth

    struth Well-Known Member

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    i didn’t say they were...they can and do, and in doing so show their political bias
     
  21. peacelate

    peacelate Banned

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    So if google does it and ISPs are allowed to do it, why are we pointing our fingers at google?
     
  22. struth

    struth Well-Known Member

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    name me an ISP that shows political bias like google and i will

    the issue with google though is two fold
    1) are they violating the anti trust laws? we will find out
    2) should their censoring, and bias behavior be considered a in-kind donation to the DNC or its campaigns?
     
  23. grapeape

    grapeape Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    WOW. This post is SPOT ON

    Great Post
     
  24. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    I guess I don't see the issues as even remotely similar. Net Neutrality activists were upset with tiered pricing and their beef against big tech revolved around not wanting companies like Google or Netflix to pay to provide servers adjoining ISP connections to speed up searches or streaming. Ultimately, the activists wanted to pay grandma checks her email occasionally prices for downloading 120 movies a month usage. That internet speed was an actual commodity seemed beyond their grasp.

    Altering the algorithms of a search engine to remove results that Google doesn't like and push results they favor, particularly in regards to politics, seems a bit more manipulative. Is it criminal or violates anti-trust laws? I don't know, but I'll probably know by the time we hit the discovery process.
     
  25. Nightmare515

    Nightmare515 Ragin' Cajun Staff Member Past Donor

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    It is absolutely manipulative, there is no arguing that, the problem is what to do about it. It's a double edged sword when trying to get big government involved in private businesses. Unchecked free market capitalism is a double edged sword in general. Here in America we allow corporations to grow infinitely pretty much unchecked to the point where they damn near become more powerful than the government in some cases. We've all heard the notion of "too big to fail", we saw it with our own eyes. I get it, this free market system does drive innovation and competition sometimes but part of me has a problem with allowing a company to become so big and intertwined with our society that we cannot let them collapse or WE collapse with them. That means in the best interest of the people the government has to take our tax dollars and bail out these massive corporations or else risk severely altering the life of Americans in society. That's dangerous. If a PRIVATE company is so large and integral to our way of life that we cannot let them fail then that means they themselves how the raw power to severely impact our way of life if they so desire.

    If American Airlines decided tomorrow that they were just not going to fly any aircraft on Monday then what is the answer to that? Can the government MAKE them? Can the government step in and say no you WILL fly we can't let you shut down you're the number 1 airline in America that would cripple our society?

    The problem with interfering with Google is the fact that by doing so we are now entrusting the government to be the arbiters of truth and morality. What exactly are they going to do? Say ok Google you WILL put Conservative media on the front pages of your search engine? Say Google you WILL show pictures of a man and woman when I type "happy couple" in images? You WILL show positive articles about the President on the front page?

    Forget Liberal or Conservative for a moment and think about that. Alright so Google openly has a bias against the current President and if you type Trump in Google most of what you see will be negative. However, in order to combat that you have to allow the government to say you can't do that, you WILL show positive articles about the President. The government telling the "press" they WILL show positive articles about the President....You are asking the government to tell the press to alter their algorithm to find positive articles about the President and put them on the front page...

    The problem is that 90% of overall media coverage of Trump IS negative, that's not a byproduct of Google that's the dishonestly of the mainstream media. Google isn't "news", they just direct you to the news for the most part. So now Google has to alter their algorithm to find the 10% positive stories about the President to put them on the front page in a "fair" 50/50 split between him and Biden.

    Everyone is mad about this due to the Hunter Biden email thing being suppressed by all the big internet outlets. I get it, it's dishonest as hell and it's blatant and they never do this sort of thing with Trump unverified damaging news. However, what folks are suggesting is that the government tell them they WILL allow that story to be posted on their private platforms. If you want to give the government the power to say that then you are also giving the government the power to tell them they CAN'T post something the government doesn't want them to either going forward. Regardless of who is President going forward, the next time a damning news story pops up do you really want to give the government the power to step in and put a gag order on Google, Facebook, or Twitter?

    This isn't a one way street. You give the government the power to tell Google what they will put on their search engines then you simultaneously give them the power to tell Google what they can't put on there as well. And I'm not sure I want that.
     

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