Any logic hounds out there? Is this a true statement?

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by Patricio Da Silva, Jun 15, 2022.

  1. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2020
    Messages:
    32,108
    Likes Received:
    17,340
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Given infinity, all that is possible, is inevitable.

    True, or false?

    If false, why?
     
  2. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    23,726
    Likes Received:
    1,790
    Trophy Points:
    113
    for that statement to be true as stated it would require a static universe.

    The universe is fluid, what is possible one day may get sucked into a black hole the next, therefore a given possibility that exists prior to being sucked into a black hole no longer exists, therefore its not inevitable. On a more grand scale we could argue that the same thing exists elsewhere, but now we see the argument in favor of yes getting increasingly weaker.

    You would need to add several qualifiers to that statement to make it a yes.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2022
  3. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    51,696
    Likes Received:
    22,990
    Trophy Points:
    113
    False.

    An infinite universe, playing by the same set of rules like the law of physics, will not have the option of infinite outcomes; only those outcomes allowed by the rules.
     
    Dirty Rotten Imbecile likes this.
  4. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    23,726
    Likes Received:
    1,790
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Mike thats not what the statement says.
    It says anything that is 'possible', a limitation on infinite outcomes, rules are observations that are set in place after the fact

    PS, I like that feynman quote
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2022
    Lil Mike likes this.
  5. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    51,696
    Likes Received:
    22,990
    Trophy Points:
    113
    We call them rules and we observe them after the fact, but the rules existed before that. The grass was green and the sky blue before we came along and assigned names to colors.
     
    Jolly Penguin likes this.
  6. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    23,726
    Likes Received:
    1,790
    Trophy Points:
    113
    thatd be a post hoc fallacy unless you have some cosmic physics book that man did not articulate. IOW the events/objects et al are there but not the rules, you said rules. Rules which are the abstract construction/models are 'created' by man
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2022
  7. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    51,696
    Likes Received:
    22,990
    Trophy Points:
    113

    The Mankind Congress did not pass the law of gravity and imposed it on an unforgiving universe. It was already there. We just named it.
     
  8. Moonglow

    Moonglow Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2013
    Messages:
    20,754
    Likes Received:
    8,047
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    The universe is a radical variable.
     
  9. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    23,726
    Likes Received:
    1,790
    Trophy Points:
    113
    thats 1/2 truth
    I agree we named it
    then we studied and modeled it
    all your so called 'laws' of physics are models designed by generations past.
    there is no magic cosmic physics book that had all the rules prewritten and all we had to do is copy paste them. The rules you speak about are physics models.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2022
  10. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2010
    Messages:
    57,414
    Likes Received:
    31,486
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Depends on what you mean by "infinity." Infinite time, infinite space, both? If you mean infinite universes, then I'd say that likely, yes.
     
    Lucifer likes this.
  11. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2013
    Messages:
    60,029
    Likes Received:
    16,493
    Trophy Points:
    113
    That was covered:

    "All that is possible, is inevitable."
     
    Patricio Da Silva likes this.
  12. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    51,696
    Likes Received:
    22,990
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Define "possible."
     
  13. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2013
    Messages:
    60,029
    Likes Received:
    16,493
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Since it's infinite, it really doesn't matter if something gets sucked into a black hole.

    Infinity would provide many more.

    And, yes, the black hole would grow in influence, but hey - infinity!
     
    ToughTalk likes this.
  14. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2013
    Messages:
    60,029
    Likes Received:
    16,493
    Trophy Points:
    113
    It would include everything that conforms to the ultimate physics of the universe.

    That is, it can't be restricted by the limits of our current understanding of physics, since what is possible is not limited by what we know.
     
    Patricio Da Silva and Kokomojojo like this.
  15. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2011
    Messages:
    51,696
    Likes Received:
    22,990
    Trophy Points:
    113

    So only those outcomes allowed by the rules, or "our current understanding of physics" is possible.

    Hmmm
     
  16. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2013
    Messages:
    60,029
    Likes Received:
    16,493
    Trophy Points:
    113
    LOL - that is absolutely NOT what I said.

    I made it very clear that our knowledge today is NOT a limit. It is only the knowledge we have today.

    What is possible in the universe is based on the universe that exists, which includes things that we do not know.

    Again, what is possible is NOT limited by human understanding.
     
  17. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    23,726
    Likes Received:
    1,790
    Trophy Points:
    113
    future physics, but that physics has not been invented yet otherwise wed be taking pleasure cruises to alpha centauri
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2022
  18. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    23,726
    Likes Received:
    1,790
    Trophy Points:
    113
    true but not 'that' one!
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2022
  19. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2009
    Messages:
    23,726
    Likes Received:
    1,790
    Trophy Points:
    113
    lost your webster again? :roflol:
     
  20. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2010
    Messages:
    57,414
    Likes Received:
    31,486
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Ah, more intellectually dishonest semantic games are on the way, folks. Buckle in. I assure everyone except you on this thread understood my sentence.
     
    dairyair and Jolly Penguin like this.
  21. Lucifer

    Lucifer Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2014
    Messages:
    13,824
    Likes Received:
    9,575
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    If we include the many-worlds theory occupying that infinite space, absolutely.
     
  22. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2017
    Messages:
    27,989
    Likes Received:
    21,288
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    I spent about 10 minutes testing it and I couldn't find any falsehoods.

    thumbs up.png
     
  23. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2013
    Messages:
    60,029
    Likes Received:
    16,493
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Yes. To be clear, "that one" did exactly what it did.

    One can't predefine what it "should have done" or "would have done had there been no black hole in the way", or what we would have preferred that it might do.

    The termination in the black hole is one of the possibles.

    Since the assumption is infinity, we would believe that there are other Kokomojojo's out there posting away. Some of them may have some Willreadmore answering such posts. Maybe one or both of us live on some other planet somewhere.
     
  24. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2010
    Messages:
    57,414
    Likes Received:
    31,486
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Which would be covered if you read the word "possible" in the OP. By the way, since you brought up MW, you should check up definition 1b.
     
  25. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2013
    Messages:
    60,029
    Likes Received:
    16,493
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I think we wouldn't even have to resort to Everett interpretation of QM or any other.

    Even just this straight up universe would have plenty of space if it is infinite. Even if we figure the incredibly small odds of having another Lucifer and another Willreadmore on a planet they call Earth, it certainly doesn't approach infinity.
     

Share This Page