Johnson Intended To Stop Ukraine Aid, Not Pass An Immigration Bill

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by balancing act, Feb 27, 2024.

  1. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If you "exchange" something, you're doing a trade. I mean you can argue that if you want, but that would just be silly.

    "What Trump has done for Putin".

    Why don't you tell us? I mean democrats broke every law and illegally surveilled as many people as they could, created their own investigation into it for years.

    What did they find besides nothing? Are you going to talk about a hotel in Russia that was never built?
     
  2. hawgsalot

    hawgsalot Well-Known Member

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    And by four democrat senators, which killed the bill.
     
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  3. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I guess it was bi-partisanly hated then.
     
  4. Condor060

    Condor060 Banned Donor

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    Nope, I know you can't. But thanks for admitting you never read it.
     
  5. Condor060

    Condor060 Banned Donor

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    Tell us whats in the bill that goes a long way to protect the border
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2024
  6. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    you claim to have it, you tell us what's in it
     
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  7. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Trump said, don't fix immigrations, I need it for 2024... that was all Republicans needed, never even read the bill
     
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  8. Condor060

    Condor060 Banned Donor

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    Oh, I do have it and I know what it says.
    This is your claim
    So tell us what is in the bill that goes a long way to protect the border.
    Or can you not support your own claim?
     
  9. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Ask him to explain how illegal aliens commit less crime than US citizens. I always enjoy that one.
     
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  10. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    post the bill if you have it
     
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  11. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    ask him if illegals should go to prison and be punished or be deported without punishment
     
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  12. Chuck711

    Chuck711 Well-Known Member

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    Putin has to prop up Trump and not let him Fail to be of use to Russia

    Wonder what Putin has in store for the world after the Election

    Republican need to focus on helping Americans by helping Ukraine

    Rather sell weapons to Ukraine and have them decimate Russia then Loss of our soldiers

    So simple yet Trump is in the way. Move over Trump ..............

    Trump ,take a time out and think up some more names to call our Patriots

    President Biden is the one really making America Great Again after you Failed
     
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  13. Hey Now

    Hey Now Well-Known Member

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    The fact that you have to post this "context" is unbelievable. Since when does Putin and his ACTS EVER have a benefit to the USA? The lack of depth of thought exposed explains why Trump motivates these of his flock or worse, America's enemies. It's tragically stunning.
     
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  14. Hey Now

    Hey Now Well-Known Member

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    I'd give 4 choices, power, money, influence or any combo of...
     
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  15. Hey Now

    Hey Now Well-Known Member

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    Plain factual truth regardless of how it's denied.
    Thanks for fighting the BS spin bro, it's an endless task.
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2024
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  16. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Applying for Vice President? Getting Putin approved?
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2024
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  17. balancing act

    balancing act Well-Known Member

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    The first part: the "exchange" is the exchange of support for a bill or part of one.
    As in "I'll support your bill in exchange for your support for my bill".
    The second part: that's my opinion, or theory. Just seems that the house Republicans are doing some things that are awfully helpful to Putin at the behest of Trump. On my phone so I can't cite examples at the moment, but will later.
     
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  18. balancing act

    balancing act Well-Known Member

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    Off the top of my head, it said that anyone who crossed the border between legal entry points would automatically be eliminated from seeking asylum. Also, added border agents to catch more AND judges to speed up the court process that is way behind.
    There's three.
     
  19. LiveUninhibited

    LiveUninhibited Well-Known Member

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    Putin was KBG. You think he says what he really thinks rather than what he wants you to hear?
     
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  20. dharbert

    dharbert Well-Known Member

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    All three of you who replied to this are ignoring the first part of my statement. Hmmm, I wonder why that is....
     
  21. LiveUninhibited

    LiveUninhibited Well-Known Member

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    Putin expected Ukraine to fall before any American president could make a difference. Most likely, he was too many people around him telling him what he wants to hear rather than the truth.
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2024
  22. dharbert

    dharbert Well-Known Member

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    So why didn't he invade Ukraine during the four years that Trump was in office?
     
  23. dharbert

    dharbert Well-Known Member

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    If Trump is "in bed" with the Russians and there is so much "Russian collusion" in our elections, then why did Trump lose the election in 2020?
     
  24. Pro_Line_FL

    Pro_Line_FL Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Everyone knows Trump is the de facto Speaker of the House.
     
  25. LiveUninhibited

    LiveUninhibited Well-Known Member

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    Many reasons, most unrelated to Biden, but had he known what the Ukraine war would be like, Trump would have been a better choice. The overarching theme is that Putin hoped to do it without an overt war because wars have many costs. The goal for many, many years has been to take Ukraine, though.

    "
    Moscow had probably given up on any prospect of working with Kyiv. During the 2019 presidential election campaign, Ukraine’s Volodymyr Zelenskyy had pledged to resolve the standoff with Moscow. But in office, he’d taken a tougher line, resisting any compromise with Moscow.

    Meanwhile, the 2015 Minsk diplomatic process on the status of the separatist regions of Donetsk and Luhansk was going nowhere, and unlikely to deliver the enhanced influence in Ukraine that the Kremlin sought. Kyiv, correctly perceiving Minsk as loaded in Moscow’s favour, was unwilling to devolve political authority to the regions – without which Russia refused to return control of Ukraine’s borders to Kyiv. France and Germany, the key external parties involved, were unable to exert effective influence on the process.

    Moreover, Zelenskyy’s administration was seen as weak and unpopular, and the Ukrainian public preoccupied with economic difficulties. The Kremlin fretted Russia’s influence in Ukraine was ebbing, especially amid deepening cooperation between Kyiv and the United States and its NATO partners. Indeed, the Kremlin suggested that deepening military ties between Kyiv and the United States and European NATO partners might cross a red line for Moscow.

    Putin judged too that external circumstances were propitious.

    He saw Europe as weak and divided. Its major states were internally preoccupied, notably Germany managing the power transition from long-time leader Angela Merkel, while post-Brexit UK remained mired in domestic political chaos. Europe was also coping with a renewed Covid wave and managing another influx of migrants (notably from Belarus). Putin calculated, moreover, that Europe’s high dependence on Russian gas gave Moscow leverage as winter approached.

    Meanwhile, he saw Washington as focused on its growing rivalry with China, while America’s international standing had been diminished by the chaotic withdrawal from Afghanistan. The Biden administration also seemed preoccupied and weakened at home by partisan politics.

    Finally, Putin would have been buoyed by Russia’s growing strategic partnership with China, giving him political and economic cover.

    All this must have made Putin pretty confident.

    From autumn 2021, Putin engaged in coercive diplomacy. This involved amassing large numbers of forces in menacing offensive formations around Ukraine’s borders, accompanied by bellicose demands. It seemed to be working: Putin certainly got the West’s attention, with the leaders of Germany and France beating a path to Moscow seeking a de-escalation of tensions.

    But with hindsight, it’s doubtful Putin was ever serious in pursuing a diplomatic outcome, and was instead resolved anyway on taking military action.

    As a calculated risk-taker, Putin must have drawn encouragement from the weak Western reaction to Russia’s illegal annexation of Crimea in 2014. He likely assessed that a distracted and divided United States and Europe were unlikely to do much more than fulminate at what he reckoned would be a quick and decisive Russian military victory in Ukraine.

    It is clear now his hubris was fuelled by misplaced confidence in both Russian military prowess and intelligence assessments. In truth, Putin was not alone: many observers (including in the West) thought the Zelenskyy government was weak and would quickly collapse. And that Ukrainian forces would be no match for Russian military might.

    Both assumptions proved fatal miscalculations.
    "

    Russia’s invasion of Ukraine: Why and why now? | Lowy Institute
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2024

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