Mara Zebest: Top Computer Graphic Expert In The Nation Going After Obama.

Illegal Alien or not, eligible or not, Obama's still the lousiest president, ever to be elected. Not surprising though - with Obama's teleprompter reading abilities, selling his message of hope and free mortgage and gas to the swelling crowds or food stamps recipients was easy...

As for where we all went, take heart, we're around. I'm for one, enjoying beautiful Coloradoan summer, taking a short vacations here'n there... life's good

 

I claimed that Fukino was the only person who claimed to have seen Obama's long form BC. Obviously I was speaking of before it was released and before the few days during the process of releasing it. Before this no one but Fukino had claimed to have seen it. This is obvious to any clear thinking reasonable person. If you continue in this bizarre, illogical manner, this conversation will not continue.

Also, you seem intent on labeling me as some other person so that you can use your only tool, ridicule. This is obviously how you deal with losing a debate; you claim that a person is actually someone else and then ridicule this person. You do this because you know that I cannot even begin to defend myself against it because there is no evidence and it makes no sense.

I've warned you before and I'll warn you one last time. If you refer to me again as 'Darryl', we're done talking.

When did Onaka say that he saw it in Oct 2008? The certification on Obama's COLB did not claim that he had seen Obama's long form BC it just simply says, "I certify that this is a true copy or abstract of the record on file...". If Obama had a long form BC the data from that BC would have been stored in a computer and this COLB would have simply taken that data and added it to the COLB. There's no reason at all to believe that he saw the original long form BC.

Other thank Fukino, of course. I already said that she had seen it and that she was the only one. You claimed that this was a statement by Onaka or about Onaka. It wasn't. Why did you post that link and lie?

 

Which has been proven to be false.

A care not one whit about your warnings. Nothing you say can be taken at face value.

Why did you lie about being a black Army vet?

The Official State of Hawaii press release issued on October 31, 2008 declares that he did. His certification on both the documents constitutes his statement. Why do you keep running away from that?

I refer you again to the Official State of Hawaii press release issued on October 31, 2008 which declares that he did.

Why do you keep pretending it does not?

 

Goodbye Wong. You exhibit the typical liberal characteristic of being extremely illogical and unreasonable which means there can be absolutely no progress made in this conversation. You also employ the typical liberal tactic of ridicule as a way of distracting from the topic which also makes any progress in this conversation impossible therefore I have no choice but to end this conversation.

 

Run away, Darryl. Run away.

But before you do... why did you lie that were a black Army veteran?

 

What does interest me is the mystery of the .pdf
If you are so interested, why have you not watched the videos or read the written explanations in this thread that solve it? I've watched your videos and read the various "explanations". They are as biased as you claim mine is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronmatt
They make a copy and emboss it with a raised seal (that certifies it) and they mail it back to you. (or) they go through the trouble of copying as a .PDF. on a scanner, instead of just using the office copy machine.
Nope. They will only send the paper copy. If you want a PDF of the document, you have to make it yourself. Like the Whitehouse did. Why, they could have posted the copy from Hawaii as a .jpg

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronmatt
So then, why would a clerk in the vital statistics department take the scanned copy of your birth certificate and imports it into some some publishing program like, In Design, Quark, Publisher or whatever, save it as a .pdf then import that .pdf into Acrobat and optimize it?
They wouldn't and they didn't. I agree, why would they. It wouldn't make sense to do that

Instead, an administrative assistant at the Whitehouse scanned the document using their Mac, and saved it as an optimized PDF right from Mac's native viewing application and operating system. Adobe never touched the PDF.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronmatt
The original pdf is 376 kb, the optimized pdf is 336 kb,
What has caused you to hallucinate that you have any idea what size the original PDF was? AT this point you are just making stuff up.You seemed smarter. Document size is attainable by right clicking the document. and in windows explorer...jeez. The same place it is in Photoshop and Illustrator. besides, you stated that there was no original .pdf other than the one the whitehouse assistant made.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronmatt
But the .pdf available DOES have 'magic hidden information'. Where does it come from? It had to be put there 'after' the original document was scanned and before it was placed on the internet.
Exactly. That was when the PDF was optimized. No reason to make a .pdf and then optimize it

Again... go watch the posted videos. All of it is not merely explained... it is demonstrated. No it wasn't. If you take a .pdf that doesn't contain meta-data..optimizing it doesn't invent meta-data.
his explanation is inadequate. Try it yourself. If you scan a paper document and convert it to a .pdf...it does not 'invent' meta-data. It is not possible.

 

And your rant has nothing to do with where he was born. In short, your just a sore loser who cry becose his horse finished second place...

 

Biased?

They prove through a direct demonstration that optimization creates all the features you consider mysterious. How can a straightforward demonstration be "biased?"

Who cares what they could have done or might have done? They posted a PDF... and it has proven to be a completely ordinary PDF in every respect.

And yet that's what you suggest they did. Nobody else in this thread has.

The only PDF that anybody has access to is the one that is already optimized. You claimed that you had access to the "original PDF" before optimization and another PDF after optimization. Am I to take this new comment as a confession that you were not being truthful?

Wrong. The intention to post it online is an obvious reason to do so. That's why optimization was invented.

You don't think there was any reason for posting the certificate to the web? Really? You really want to take that position?

You have no idea what you are talking about. In fact... I don't even think you understand what metadata is.

Any and all electronic files have metadata. The simple act of creating such a file creates metadata. The explanation is not only adequate, it eviscerates the Birther claim of forgery.

 

Well Wong already addressed this and you tried to weasel out, but just because I came in late, doesn't mean I shouldn't miss out on the fun- does it?

a) Dr. Fukino of course said she saw it- and mentioned the presence of Alvin Onaka
b) Director Fuddy of course has said that he has seen it- and also cites Alvin Onaka.
c) And Alvin Onaka says he has seen it right on the certificate itself- where he personally certifies that it is a true copy of the original.

3 people who have all clearly stated that they have seen the original.

I won't await your apology- Birthers never admit they have made mistake- you will just change your story.

 

Yes, we know Fukino had seen the BC. Director Fuddy only claimed to have seen it during the process of releasing it. Ever since members of the public have been asking to see the long form BC back in 2007 Obama had refused to show it and only one person, Fukino, saw it during this time. Obviously during the process of supposedly copying the long form BC and distributing it to the public, other people would have seen it which includes Fuddy. But before this no one, except Fukino, had claimed to have seen the long form BC. Fuddy did not claim to have seen the BC until it was time to copy and distribute it.

Since you and Wong are apparently unable to understand why I said that Fukino was the only person to have seen the long form BC, I'll have to go back to my original words and explain it to you. When all of these statements were made by Hawaiian officials verifying that Obama was eligible and that his long form BC (LFBC) existed, Fukino was the only person who had actually claimed to have seen it. The others were all basing their claims upon Fukino. Here's your comment from page 13:

I responded with this:

My comments were in relation to the statements made by all of these people you mentioned and these statements were made before the process of releasing the LFBC began. When they made these statements, Fukino had been the only person who had seen the LFBC and they were all basing their statements on what Fukino had said. I provided these comments to show you that only one person, Fukino, needed to actually lie here meaning that the conspiracy you mentioned did not have to be nearly as large as you suggested, meaning that it would've been a lot easier to get away with.

Obviously, whether others saw the LFBC during the process of releasing it had nothing to do with my comments because my comments had everything to do with the statements that were made before the release and before the process of releasing the LFBC. This should be fairly simple for any reasonable person to understand even without me explaining it further like I have now. If you're unable to understand this then we're going to have serious problems going forward.

Like I said earlier, Fukino is the only person who had seen the LFBC. Onaka did not and Fuddy did not until the process of releasing the LFBC began. Fuddy and Onaka did not claim to have seen the LFBC before the process of releasing it began, correct?

 

Yes. She did.

Yes. She did. That's two.

And as we know from the October 31, 2008 press release from the Hawaii Department of health, Alvin Onaka saw it too. That's three.

One sentence, three lies. You're outdoing yourself, Darryl.

1. Nobody ever asked to see the birth certificate until 2008.

2. Obama never refused to show anything to anybody. When asked to show it by Jim Geraghty he immediately released it. The State of Hawaii on the other hand simply followed the law.

3. Alvin Onaka saw it the same time Fukino did. Read the press release again.

Again, this is a lie. Onaka had also seen it.

Well... you have at least two problems with that. First off, Abercrombie did not depend on Fukino. He knew Obama was Hawaiian born from personal knowledge. And of course we know that Onaka saw it personally at the same time Fukino did. So... the only person who appears to have depended on Fukino was Governor Lingle. Of the four people you were whining about, three had first hand knowledge of either the certificate or the birth itself.

And now we know that Fukino didn't lie. So your pointless argument is back to square one.

 

No, you can't weasel out of your own words

Your words:
Like I said earlier, Fukino is the only person who had seen the LFBC. Onaka did not and Fuddy did not until the process of releasing the LFBC began. Fuddy and Onaka did not claim to have seen the LFBC before the process of releasing it began, correct?[/QUOTE]

Fukino is the only person who had claimed to have seen Obama's long forOnce again you show your lack of knowledge on this issue. m BC. Alvin Onaka, Gov Lingle, and Gov Abercrombie all made their statements based upon information given to them by Fukino. This gives them plausible deniability. I had pointed out the conspiracy that would have been necessary for the Birth Certificate to be fraudulant- and you said that everyone relied upon the word of Dr. Fukino. And that of course is clearly, and as I pointed out, wrong- and I speculated then whether your post was ignorance or a lie. At this point it borders on delusion or lie.

.........
Alvin Onaka certified both the COLB and the 2011 copy of the birth certificate as true copies- that is right there on the certificates- so Alvin Onaka stated himself that he had seen the original. And of course Dr. Fukino had said originally that the registrar of vital records had been with her.

Beyond that....why would Governor Abercrombie need 'plausible deniability' from Dr. Fukino? His own appointee Fuddy would have told him. Which shows once again what load of BS your statements are.

Let me lay it out for you.

Dr. Fukino, a Republican appointed by a Republican Governor stated officially that Barack Obama was born in Hawaii and that the birth certificate was on file.

Now try to keep up with this.....in order for your Conspiracy theory to work...

Alvin Onaka is a 20 year civil servant. Dr. Fukino, as a political appointee, knew that she would be out of office as soon as Gov. Lingle term ended- and that a new Director of Health would be appointed.

So not only would the conspiracy by necessity include Dr. Fukino and Alvin Onaka- they knew that Dr. Fukino would be removed and that some unknown person would be appointed to the position and would be in a position to expose the fraud.

So Alvin Onaka would be risking his entire career, Dr. Fukino her professional reputation- and both of them risking criminal prosecution- knowing that some unknown person would be in a position to expose them and would somehow have to be included later into the Conspiracy?

Of course in the real world- there is no stain at all on the reputations of Mr. Onaka or Dr. Fukino- except of course for the wild speculations of Birthers.

You- and the rest of the Birthers- would rather believe that these people are all corrupt....and that someone planted the story in the papers, and somehow planted the Birth Index data into public records, and that Governor Abercrombie is lieing about his personal recollections- oh and that a pregnant American woman flew to Kenya to give birth and smuggled her baby back to America and that her parents committed fraud in order to register his birth...

You would rather believe all of this wild Birther speculation than believe that this son of a Kenyan can possibly be our President.

Which is just one more reason why it really sucks to be a Birther.

 

No reason to "weasel" out of my words. I'll leave that to liberals like you.

When did Onaka state that he had seen the original? Certifying a copy of a COLB would not have required him to view the original LFBC as I stated earlier and that you conveniently ignored. Go back and read what I said and then try responding with an informed answer this time. Certifying a copy of the LFBC would not necessarily require him to have seen the LFBC. He could simply have just taken the word of Fuddy. Fact is, Onaka has never claimed to have actually viewed the LFBC and I challenge you to find where he's made this claim.

There's no reason to believe that Onaka has to be involved since he has never claimed to have seen the original LFBC, as I stated earlier and for which you cannot refute. Some unknown person would not have had to be appointed. Abercrombie, a close personal friend of Obama, became Governor and could appoint someone who he thought would do what he/she's told, namely, Loretta Fuddy.

Yes, I believe a few of these people are corrupt. No, I don't believe someone planted anything in the papers. That's unnecessary and a straw man argument. No, I don't believe that the Birth Index data was planted in public records. That's unnecessary and a straw man argument.

Yes, I believe Abercrombie is lying. Yes, I believe a pregnant American woman probably flew to Kenya to give birth and then came back with her baby to the US where her parents obtained a birth record for her son based upon their testimony alone which the law at the time allowed.

-------------------------------

Now... back to my question that you have still refused to answer:

MSNBC and Michael Isikoff claimed that Fukino said that Obama's long form BC was (quoting the article now), "half typed and half handwritten". Note that it does not have to be a direct quote in order for Isikoff to make the claim that she said this. He is making that claim. A direct quote would still require you to accept that Isikoff is telling you the truth. Isikoff is not a birther, he's on your side. He's on Fukino's side. He has no reason to lie here. So, is it likely that Fukino said this or is it more likely that Isikoff either misunderstood her or lied?

 

Here is something good to hear.

Court Subpoena For Obamas Original Long Form BC Served To Hawaii Heath Dept

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

And it has been signed by the Deputy Clerk of Court. It was served by a process server to Health Department Director Loretta Fuddy. Now we are going to get to the truth of this. Remember the former Director was quoted as saying the original was half typed and half handwritten and the governors office was on record stating that all they found was a handwritten notation. I don't see Obama having any problem defying this since he released the alleged long form on April 27th due to a special waiver granted by Loretta Fuddy in Hawaii. This goes for Hawaii's Dept of Health too. There is more to come so stay tuned since this is breaking. Finally we may get to see the original instead of the forged document Obama releaased. The attorney going after Obama's Connecticut SS number is making headway with the lawsuit.


Exclusive: Court Subpoena for Obama’s Original Birth Certificate Served to Hawaii Health Department

Story:
http://www.thepostemail.com/2011/07...rtificate-served-to-hawaii-health-department/

(Jul. 5, 2011) — A process server has delivered a Hawaii court-issued subpoena to Loretta J. Fuddy, Director of the Hawaii Department of Health, commanding her “to produce at the time, date, and place set forth below the following documents, electronically stored information, or objects, and permit their inspection, copying testing, or sampling of the material:”

original 1961 typewritten birth certificate #10641 for Barack Obama, III [sic] issued 08.08.1961, signed by Dr. David Sinclair, Stanley Ann Dunham Obama and registrar Lee, stored in the Health Department of the State of HI from 08081961 until now.

The subpoena allows Fuddy until August 8, 2011 at 10:00 a.m. to produce the document.

The designated place of production is noted as:

Health Department State of HI 1250 Punchbowl str. room 325 Honolulu, HI 96813


Subpoena:
http://www.thepostemail.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/scan0007.jpg

Proof of service:
http://www.thepostemail.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/scan0008.jpg

 

Yeah, this is great news, I was just reading about it earlier. Unfortunately, I think there's very little chance Obama would ever allow this forged LFBC that probably does not still exist in the archives to ever be examined. The thuggery of Obama will be too powerful for a district judge. Expect the district judge to suddenly dismiss the case before the subpoena deadline.

 

Sounds like you need 800 mg of Xanax.

 

The official Hawaii press release was issued on October 31, 2008.

You keep moving those goalposts, Darryl. Your furious pointlessness is a wonder to behold. The State of Hawaii formally said he saw it, and in the intervening 2 1/2 years he certainly could have denied it had he been so moved.

He hasn't.

It is certain that Isikoff paraphrased. Had those been her actual words, he would have used quotation marks.

The document as released is close enough.

So now... your turn to answer a direct question. Why did you claim to be a black Army vet when you are white IT guy who has never served?

 

Lol... now Darryl's sock puppets are "talking" to each other.

1. The subpoena is unenforceable. It requires Hawaii to violate the law, and they have already told Orly they will not do so.

2. The case will not be dismissed. There has been no motion to dismiss. Instead the defendants have requested a Summary Judgment on the merits. That request was made on July 1. Orly has plenty of time to respond, so it won't be ended before Hawaii has had another opportunity to tell her to stuff her silly subpoena.

 

Obviously, you could not answer this question or the other three questions I posed. Such an easy victory over a braindead liberal like you, SFJEFF. How does it feel to be beaten so badly by a birther?

 

Do YOU have a US passport?

Obama has had one since he was six..

If you don't get it... you don't have a passport.

 

Ah my reality challenged Birther, I am sorry I disappointed you by not replying. I was busy enjoying this lovely summer with my family rather than trying to keep track of dead threads. But since you resusitated this corpse, sure lets go:

I will let you know if a birther someday beats me. Your 'questions' have all been answered by others- I answered pretty clearly I wasn't going to respond to the bitmap stuff because I have no computer expertise- I don't think you do either and are just reposting Birther talking points, but like I said- I don't know, don't care. Since Hawaii has certified the copy as authentic, there is no reasonable doubt by any rational person that the copy posted is a true copy of what Hawaii has on file.

Originally Posted by jay559
No reason to "weasel" out of my words. I'll leave that to liberals like you.
[/QUOTE]

Au contraire- as a true Birther, you are quite good at moving the goal posts to suit the fantasy you have concocted in your mind- or in reality just absorbed from Birther blogs.

He could simply have just taken the word of Fuddy. Fact is, Onaka has never claimed to have actually viewed the LFBC and I challenge you to find where he's made this claim. [/QUOTE]

Well if Onaka had taken the word of Fuddy- or of Fukino, he would have been a liar- since he clearly certifies on the certificate that this is a true copy of the original on file in the Hawaiian Department of Health.

So the answer is yes- Alvin Onaka does certify that the copy released is a true copy of the original- and both Dr. Fukino and Fuddy stated officially that Alvin Onaka had seen the original- so regardless of your attempt to weasel out of the fact that the Conspiracy must have included at least(and in reality ore), Alvin Onaka would have been complicit in the Conspiracy both by certifying the certificate to be a true copy when it wasn't, and by not coming forward either when Fukino or Fuddy claimed officially- on the record- that Onaka had seen and participated in copying the original.

Now you apparently have had no experience with signing original documents, but I have. A good way to end up losing your license or going to jail is to sign something just because your boss tells you to. I don't sign anything official unless I have authenticated it myself.

So is Alvin Onaka a competant professional? Apparently his colleagues in the profession do:

Dr. Alvin T. Onaka is the Registrar of Vital Statistics for the State of Hawaii. Dr. Onaka was the 2008 recipient of the Halbert L. Dunn Award, the most prestigious award presented by the National Association for Public Health Statistics and Information Systems (NAPHSIS) and regarded as one of the most important honors in the field of biostatistics in the United States. He was elected President of NAPHSIS in 2002.

Now answer me this: is it more reasonable to assume that Dr. Alvin Onaka saw the original birth certificate, as per his certification and as reported by both Dr. Fukino and Muddy, or is it more reasonable to assume that he either is a) professionally incompetant or b) part of a Conspiracy that at a minimum involves himself and Dr. Fukino and Moody?

Okay, so you agree that your Conspiracy must include Governor Abercrombie also- so we are up to 4 now.

But let us examine exactly how idiotic your statement is? Dr. Fukino declared in 2008 and 2009 that Barack Obama was born in Hawaii and the BC was on file.

How would she have known who was going to be Governor of Hawaii in 2010?

Or do you think this Conspiracy is so large that the Governor's race in Hawaii was rigged too? I really have no answer to you if you subscribe to the whole 'everything everywhere is part of the Conspiracy' rationale.

So assuming your are not quite that psychotic- how would Dr. Fukino- in your fantasy conspiracy theory- been able to have known for certain in 2009 that whoever would be appointed when Governor Lingle left office would be certain to be relied upon to commit criminal fraud, and not report her or Dr. Onaka?

Okay so you agree the Birth Index data is not planted. And of course the Birth Index data shows that Barack Obama was born in Hawaii. And the newspaper announcements of his birth were not faked either- so we have two sources of secondary evidence that corroborates the Birth certificate that you agree were not planted but were officially put into place.

That you believe that 'a few of these people are corrupt' is mildly amusing but completely immaterial since you have absolutely no hint of evidence that this is true. At this point, your 'belief' is just another Birther fantasy.

Okay again with your beliefs...Abercrombie is lieing- and apparently part of the Conspiracy.

And you believe in the laughably improbable- that a teenage American flew from nice safe Hawaii in 1961 to Kenya, a year after the Mau-Mau revolt 'ended", to give birth in a 3d world hospital- and then somehow smuggled her infant back to the U.S.

So tell me which would have been more likely to have happened? That a pregnant teenager would have chosen to have given birth in a good American hospital, near her parents as all the evidence shows, or is it more likely that she flew thousands of miles while pregnant, to a 3d world country still recovering from a horribly vicious civil war to give birth under uknown conditions with no family or friends for support- and that no evidence of such event happening exists? Just which is more likely please.
-------------------------------

I dont' think Isikoff lied- after all he reported clearly and accurately her quotes about viewing the original birth certificate. I think the most likely answer is that Dr. Fukino was referring to the additional statistical information that is on the rest of the form and kept by the state and not normally released, and that Dr. Fukino may have clarified that in her actual statement but that Isikoff may have paraphrased her statement incorrectly. Pure speculation on my part since I wasn't there.

Of course Birthers live for speculation. Me? I will go with the actual quotes from persons in authority- Dr. Fukino, Muddy, Governor Abercrombie, and of course the certification by Dr. Onaka.

I would ask how it feels to get beaten by an anti-Birther, but frankly, you seem a little too excited about the whole beating thing so let me just leave you with.....

It really sucks to be a Birther.

 

hahahahahahhahah

The thuggery of Obama?

How completely comical and totally conspiracy theory fodder.....

 

i think obama qualifies as a sort of passive political thug. he's not chavez, yet. once people tear his books apart and compare those stories to what we know, things will unravel. i guess ten weeks isn't such a long time to have had with the forgery. he's got so many things going. did lambert really issue a subpoena ?? they can just ignore it right ? what about executive priviledge, can't obama just say no ? nobody can tell him what to do, he is the law, what ever he says goes right ???

 

Have you ever seen a birth certificate with all of that statistical information you're speaking of? Do you have any idea if that statistical information was even required in 1961? Does this mean that Obama did not release his full long form birth certificate?

Sounds like you're trying a little too hard in your speculation in order to cover for Fukino. There's no reason to believe that she was talking about statistical information that might have been filled out by Obama's momma and there's no reason to believe that a full birth certificate would include all of that.

Fukino is reported to have said that Obama's LFBC was half typed and half handwritten. That statement is inconsistent with the LFBC released by the White House, isn't it?

 

not one of you birthers has ever been able to provide a quote from fukino saying that. why is that?