Do you have an entitlement to Health Care? (USA)

You have been so indoctrinated by the propaganda affecting your own mind, you can't even put real situations into the mix. What, you don't know anyone who doesn't have healthcare? I do. They may get cared for in an emergency room... but they aren't covered otherwise.

There are MILLIONS of Americans like that. That's simple, well-known fact; don't your realize this?

And yes, America needs UHC NOW!!

 

That shows how the healthcare system inflates their prices. It is not just insurance it is the whole healthcare system and Obamacare will make it worse

 

More stories and BS and no proof. They still can get healthcare. My son has medicaid and I have to foot the bill for his dental because it is not covered by medicaid

 

It might bother you to think what I've related is true... but I know they are. There are other example out here, and in the coming years we'll all hear more.

Even so, I realise this is an internet forum/debate; the efficacy of arguing this further isn't so apparent.

We generally disagree, but in due time we'll see what comes of things both politically and legally. America has a LONG way to go in resolving the things we are speaking of here.

In the meantime, I wish you and yours the best of health; that's been my saving grace. I want UHC, but I know there is a grand debate that must take place to get there.

 

You refuse to show proof which tells me it is all opinion and no fact

I want choices not government control.

 

I am not entitled to someone's money.

 

Healthcare is not "free". Nothing is "free". Calling it "free" healthcare is just a trick politicians use to make you forget that you're going to pay for it through inflation when they print money or go into debt to make it "free".

So called "free" healthcare effectively turns medical professionals into slaves. You cannot turn a service provided by individuals into a right. It's pure tyranny.

True "free healthcare" is free-market healthcare, which has historically proven itself to provide the highest quality medical care to the most amount of people for the lowest cost. See US healthcare pre-1960. There's a reason it was the envy of the world, because government didn't (*)(*)(*)(*) it up.

It is truely alarming how close that poll is.

 

Yes but society entitles you to others services even though you may not have paid for them. Police, fire, FDA, EPA, USDA, on and on, even if you're someone without any tax burden or a very small one you get the benefits the people that preform the services provide.

 

Me too. Sometimes I just wish there was a country that existed with a very limited central government, with no handouts and a strong currency for those in the world who wish to live with independence and self-reliance.

Oh, wait ...

 

Yeah, Police and Fire are all managed and paid for at the local level. Why can't we do that with health care? Some states may provide Universal Health Care, others wouldn't, and the weak states would learn from the small ones.

10th Amendment of the Constitution: The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people

In other words: "If I don't say the Federal Gov't can do it, then it's up to the states".

Why can't we have this discussion at the state level?

 

Why aren't American citizens offered a PUBLIC option? That is, they purchase their medical coverage from a Federal Plan of their choosing (much as Federal employees do)?

If insurance companies aren't running monopolies, I'd be shocked. But even parts of my Federal coverage with the military is through private corporations.

Personally, I just want people to have reasonable coverage; that no one be left out.

 

Because it's not the Federal Government's job to sell services to people. It's only their job to protect rights, liberties, and properties.

I will not even argue with you anymore -- it's like trying to talk about quantum physics with a pre-schooler. Just because you can speak does not make you intelligent. You feel emotions and you push them out into the internet. There is a wide and significant gap between emotions and reason.

All I see is a gut feeling that escapes out of your mouth. It is not a thought. It is not rational.

 

We don’t need “coverage” what we need is a whole lot less scarcity of providers.

Government mandated educational requirements are creating such scarcity of providers that many consumers can no longer afford such services. This artificial scarcity means fat paychecks for the privileged providers…but it is making our healthcare system unaffordable.

The solution is simple and affordable, the government should either drop the educational requirements for becoming a provider OR pay the cost of complying with those requirements. If you train enough doctors then the market will make doctors less expensive. Train enough doctors and it will be cheaper to have a doctor come to your house than it will be to have a plumber come to your house. When a doctor is as common as a plumber or auto mechanic then you will no longer need insurance to pay for such services. With enough doctors the health insurance industry -- with all its wastefulness -- would all but disappear. With doctors making ordinary wages the ambulance chasing lawyers would have to find something more productive to do with their time.

 

Interesting points. I hope we pick the best solutions for our nation.

 

You could have a point. But it's a theoretical point. I've spent a lot of time trying to dream up a way to make the courts fair regardless of how much money you have, but I haven't thought of one yet, nor have I heard anyone offer a realistic suggestion. Consumer unions could work, but only if consumers have practical options, and they don't as long as the government is on the side of the wealthy.

I'm worried about statism, too. I know that everything I'm complaining about, the government had a hand in. But basically I figure that if we can have government that works for all people, rather than just working for a few of the people at the expense of the rest, then we should have that good government. And if we can't have that -- if the closest we can get is a government that props up the few on the backs of the many -- then I say, screw it, we don't need a government.

But I think democracy is a better thing than people are giving it credit for lately. The will of the people may be idiotic at times, but that's also true of the will of the wealthy. The will of the people should at least be more benign toward the people, shouldn't it?

 

No you are not entitled to such, you are free to obtain such.

Note the difference between the two.

 

I was gonna say that you'd have a big problem with unqualified doctors, but maybe you could get around that these days, with the internet and some kind of consumer rating? I don't know.

 

Its not "unavailable to most people due to cost".

Its only unavailable to a select few million people who I'm perfectly willing to write off because they are statistically negligible.

 

You may be willing to write them off, but that's 'cause you're Silicon. Most of the rest of us are carbon. Organic. We don't write each other off.

People need health care to live. The OP's question, in my mind, comes down to this: do your fellow citizens deserve to live?

I have absolutely no moral problem with spending taxpayer money on things that people need to live. We spend taxpayer money on vastly more dubious causes. If we can do this -- and we can -- then I say we should.

And I'm happy to pay my part. I don't get what the rich people are so whiny about -- after they finish paying their part, which may be bigger than mine (but then they benefit more), they'll still have lots more money than I do. So what are they crying about?

"Oh, no -- Harold! We're contributing to the lives of the poor!"
"Monstrous!"

And why do you think they're statistically negligible, anyway? What does that mean in the context of human beings?

 

Tell me if you are actually serious about what you said above.

 

I'm waiting for him to answer my question.

 

Uh...sorry, but there are people that haven't worked a day {and some who are not even legal} and are on unemployment..all they gotta do is get in line and give their sob story on how they 'can't find a job' and they get a check cut every month....while I work my butt off and can't pay all my bills without extensions {basic necessities, not lavish living by any stretch of the means} and can't get any help from the so called 'good will' government that I PAY INTO for the lazy slobs..HELL no!

I got no beef with those who *can't* work...but lazy asses who refuse to even try and think they are entitled to someone else's hard earned money need to be put up against a wall and whipped.

 

Why do you keep saying the government would fund everything?? The government doesn't 'fund' anything....that money they toss around so willy nilly belongs to the working class...not the suits in big government.

Look, we want to solve this problem? Get rid of Big Pharma first with their 'pills for everything' that kills more than it helps...take the power away from them..let everyone go back to healthy living, growing their own food, working in the 'gasp' sunlight.. etc.. and you will see people's health improve..no need to be seeing a doctor all the time unless its something major...

Back in the day, doctors were only called in emergencies..and they didn't charge an arm, leg and a cow.....well maybe a cow..but still you get the point.

 

True..we all know the suits are well taken care of on our dime...but we're talking peasants here

My bubble is still unpopped. {ok that don't sound right ..but... whatever

 

You do know we're talking about working adults here.....right?