We Need Leadership, An Honest Conversation, Not a Verbal Hate Fest

That's what the GOP guys are saying. According to the Obama people, they just say the law was passed, upheld by the SCOTUS, and Obama was re-elected.

So it looks like we have two sides not willing to budge.

What it really comes down to...is the GOP is doing everything to stop Obamcare, and the DNC is doing everything to make is succeed. I've been burnt too many times with the notion that either side is right. They're usually both wrong

 

The Republicans shutdown the government because originally they wanted to defund Obamacare. It wasn't until after the government shutdown that they started talking about delaying it. There is no reason to delay it and Obama shouldn't agree to delay it just because the GOP wants it delayed. We can't given in to every demand a groups of 2 year olds make. They need to just get a diaper change and take a nap. Maybe they will feel more like acting adult like when nap time is over.

 

What negotiations? No, seriously. After Obamacare passed with a majority in both houses and the presidency, and republicans ran heavily on "repeal obamacare" in 2012 and lost, what possible influence should they have on it? Why is it at all reasonable at this point for them to be able to completely shut down all government actions until they get their way?

 

That's equivalent to saying, "Waaaaaaaah! We thought we won! We put all that effort into winning and now the nasty ol' GOP is making us fight some more. They are sooooooo mean!"

But the GOP leadership is simply following the Constitution which gives them the authority to do what they are doing . . . just as legislative tweaks allowed the DEMs -- when they dominated the Legislative Branch to use the Cloture Rule to totally cut Republicans out of the voting process to pass the initial Obamacare bill and then [after losing their total dominance of that branch of government] using another legislative trick called Reconciliation to AGAIN pass the final version without a single Republican voting for it.

Yet -- and here's the amazing thing -- Democrats thought that it was just peachy keen that twice Republicans were legally cut out of the legislative process. Yet here those same once exuberant Democrats are sobbing in their tofu pudding cups because the Republicans are -- gasp! -- using traditional means to . . . continue a perfectly legal battle.

 

No, you're just chipping away at your own credibility, that's all.

 

I can relate to that. That's the reason I cringe when I hear someone in DC mention "comprehensive reform" of any type. IMO, if a bill is more than two pages long, it's too long.

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again, they are simply asking to delay implementation for a year, just the same as Obama has already done to several provisions of the law. Does he hate the law too? Does he need a diaper change?

 

You just labeled our founding fathers as terrorists! Interesting perspective. I expect it is time to quote Thomas Jefferson:

 

You think there is any chance of an honest conversation is this atmosphere?

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/oct/2/doves-and-peaceniks-no-more-these-democrats-relish/

quote:
“…he party of George McGovern and Jimmy Carter has been mad as hell as of late, leading an offensive of bombastic insults and rhetorical bullying…”

“President Obama called Republicans “reckless and irresponsible…”

“Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, Nevada Democrat, referred to Republicans as “anarchists..”

“…House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, California Democrat, deemed Republicans “legislative arsonists.”

“Democrats have hurled every insult imaginable, such as ‘terrorist,’ ‘arsonist’ and ‘murderers’ against Americans who differ with President Obama. “

Taxcutter notes:
The media are a big part of the problem.

Quote:
“As long as the media encourages this behavior by covering it, the politicians will keep doing it.”

Taxcutter notes:
Most of the MSM are close allies of the Democrats, so I look for the DC atmosphere to become more toxic as time goes on.

 

Right now it appears the govt. will remain shutdown until conservatives now in rebellion against the tea party negotiate with Cruz to retract what he said about them ... and it looks like Norquist has emerged as the leadership of this faction ...

 

They're having a difficult time adjusting to reality. They were sold on "health care", as if that's some hugs and kisses and whispering "I love you" in their ears. They don't understand that an insurance policy isn't like that, it's a bank account, and so they're reacting to Republicans like extremely bi-polar mood swinging ex-girlfriends who can't quite handle the news when Republicans tell them, "But, I'm not in love with you, in fact I thought you were a prostitute and that this was a business transaction."

 

Can you tell me one other vote of Roberts that you disagreed with?

Hint: you should take a lesson from your statement.

 

You must believe that every law was railroaded. But it doesn't matter how you think about why ACA was passed. It is a done deal.

The current tactics of the GOP will not stop ACA but will hurt real people.

Whine all you want about ACA but stop hurting people.

 

Why? It is law and only one side wants to take their marbles and go home. That side is acting like children.

 

Excuse me!! You guys cannot separate Obama from Obama care. Really, step outside and really observe the bubble.

 

Leadership is not holding the country hostage and then inflicting harm unless you get legislative changes that you can't get through the normal legislative process.

In the history of the nation there have been shutdowns before, but over budget disputes. Never in the history of this nation has funding the government been held as a hostage to extort passage or repeal of non related legislation.

Leadership is exactly what the democrats are doing to ensure that blackmailing the country every time the congress needs to fund the government is not a new "strategy", for either party.

Blame the hostage taker. I don't think the ACA is perfect. I would like lots of changes. But this is no different than if democrats refused to fund the troops in Iraq because they demanded the repeal of the Bush tax cuts. It is UN-American to harm the country for personal political gain.

 

The right has their fantasy that, if they can delay it long enough pass the 2014 elections, they will then have the power to repeal it. Their tactics only ensure that they will never have that power.

 

Sorry that you only parrot the right wing talking points. You should try to think for yourself. There is no negotiating with the tealiban.

 

What part of that is not true?

So only one very small side is not willing to budge.

 

Groups get brainwashed

 

Sorry that you only parrot the left wing talking points. You should try to think for yourself. So forth and so on.

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Yes they do.

 

Physician, heal thyself.

 

Funny, but you almost never hear of that happening. Usually an ill physician seeks out advice and treatment from other physicians. That's a bit worrying when you stop to think about it. You treat others but do not trust your own self-diagnosis? Sheesh!

 

Such a thoughtful reply. It really added to the discussion. Only a fool would think that I parrot anyone. Oh, wait ....

 

Eh, not really troubling. I mean if an attorney needs a lawyer, generally they hire someone else. Mostly because of objectivity, not because they question their own ability.

 

I suppose so.