What do you think will happen in North Korea?

Unfortunately the only way to ever KNOW these things is to try it.

And it is oh so human to err.

 

Great post but I think China has shown they have imagination despite detractors look at their faux island plays.. I think Kim is rapidly approaching the he's more trouble than he's worth point and if China removes him... Nothing but win for them. On military and economic fronts.

 

Exactly. So why the **** would China attack the USA? And why would Russia attack us? They have nothing to gain and a lot to lose.

If the USA attacks North Korea, China and Russia have much more to gain by letting Kim be ousted. The USA doesn't want a drawn out war. Decapitate their leadership and get out.

 

While putting the "Insane Orange Billionarie" in charge of us is better?

Just about everyone knows by now that EVERYTHING Un does is nothing but sabre rattling and has no purpose whatsoever but to brainwash his people more and so tighten his hold on power. And we go along with it, because our own conservatives are so brainwashed themselves they think Un means what he says and so immediately rush to divert another Trillion or so to our Republican Congresscritter's offshore accounts....er...."defense contractors". If we were to just ignore him he'd be overthrown by his own people in a year.

(It's the same thing with the Iranians btw, but that's another thread.)

The scary thing is that Trump may not be playing the game. He may be as stupid as his followers, many of whom seem to think an atomic war is a winnable one.

 

So you support Trump secretly taking unilateral actions that he know will be unpopular with a large portion of the US population?

I care very much, and so do the neighbors of North Korea. Let's say you take out the government there, okay? You would be starting a massive power struggle and refugee crisis.

Guess where those refugees are going? China. South Korea. Japan. US allies which will be damaged by the massive influx of refugees.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_War

• Total civilians killed/wounded: 2.5 million (est.)[17]
• South Korea: 990,968
  373,599 killed[17]
  229,625 wounded[17]
  387,744 abducted/missing[17]
• North Korea: 1,550,000 (est.)[1"

Two to four million seems to be the consensus.

http://www.counterpunch.org/2002/12/31/a-pop-quiz-on-korea/

"DECEMBER 31, 2002
A Pop Quiz on Korea..."

"11. How many people, military plus civilians, died in the Korean War?

a. 500,000-1 million

b. 1 million-2 million

c. about 4 million"

 

25 million North Koreans and you believe none are innocent?
During the 1950-'53 conflict NK had a population of about 9 million.
It's widely believed one in three were killed by US/UN armed forces.
Would a similar ratio be acceptable today?

 

Can you suggest an alternative?

 

What would you call the kidnapping and forced compliance of Japanese citizens from Japanese beaches? How about the destruction of a south korean naval vessel murdering some 50+ sailors? Can those actions be considered "provocative"?

 

More personal attacks from a poster with no debating ability, not surprising at all.

Because I like to.

I referred to the regimes, but you can continue to huff and puff.

Personal attacks and post reported.

 

What "democratic" government was that?

The rendering of mossadegh was 7 decades ago; can the US attack the British for burning down the White house in 1812? How come people like you are silent on the horrendous actions of russia, murdering tens of millions since the 1930s both inside their country and externally, yet continue to harp on a relatively tiny event the US engaged in? Next will you claim that the Kent shootings in the early 70s "prove" the US is a "fascist" country?

Yes, I did. I can do so again, if you failed to hear it the first time.

 

or a decent missile defense system. Why the leap to war? Profit or lack of imagination?

 

Because Kim Jong-Un is a psycho and needs to be killed. His regime needs to be replaced.

 

Because I'd prefer not to wait until little fat boy has the means to deliver a nuclear payload onto Boston, New York, or Wash DC. Given their history of sharing such tech / selling it to terrorist groups / illegitimate actors like the pakistani intelligence services and iran who are equally heinous, I'd again prefer not to wait.

 

North Korea is a buffer in Asia, and is in a similar relationship to its major powers that Turkey has often been to the West.

 

That was 7 decades ago, when the US installed their puppet. That sparked the counter coup of 1979, where the Iranians kicked out the CIA. That sparked the US to support Saddam Hussein and aided that maniac to rage a WMD war against Iran. That ended in 1988. That's just 3 decades ago, and the US is still completely upset their fascistic dictatorship is still not ruling over Iran through oppressing, torturing and murdering around.... while Iranian hospitals still are dealing with patients from that war.

Scum of humanity.... you don't say

 

That's what everyone said about Saddam...and that ended so well...

In any case, IMO we need to respect the reactions of both China nd Russia, which have not been supportive. Perhaps they had planned to use NK as a cat's paw. If they are solidly behind NK, anything rash that we did would bring all three down on us, IMO, and that would be very, very bad.

Hence, my stance is, let China worry about what NK will do with its nukes. Although the Chinese vastly outnumber the N Koreans, they also have a lot more land mass that could be desirable to an overcrowded population...and Korea's army is a lot closer to China than to us.

http://www.indexmundi.com/factbook/compare/china.north-korea/demographics

Why should we seek to solve a problem the Chinese helped to create? IMO we would be stepping into a trap.

 

I would respectively suggest the many authentic and deliberate provocations/retaliations from both sides could be resolved more quickly by direct negotiations between the US and North Korea, as Jimmy Carter proved in 1994 when another US President was threatening millions of innocent civilians nuclear destruction.

 

I'd guess that Don might surgically take out Jong-uns two missile launch sites with cruise/ drone strikes, in effect "drawing Jong-uns nuclear teeth"-

 

Possibly, GW Bush could perform the same role today that Carter played in '94? The solution requires the reunification of the Korean peninsula, and only direct bilateral talks between the US and DPRK can initiate that process.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/asiapcf/08/24/north.korea.carter.backstory/

"Carter's 1994 trip to Pyongyang was successful in defusing the first North Korean nuclear crisis, paving the way for the 1994 Agreed Framework in which North Korea pledged to give up its nuclear weapons in return for aid. But it was also controversial because Carter reached a deal with Kim Il Sung and announced it without checking with the Clinton administration.

 

I would not be surprised if your view is accurate.
I am completely convinced the Big Problem from Korea to Syria is the US and its permanent war economy:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permanent_war_economy

"The concept of permanent war economy originated in 1944 with an article by Ed Sard (alias Frank Demby, Walter S. Oakes and T.N. Vance), a Third Camp Socialist, who predicted a post-war arms race. He argued at the time that the United States would retain the character of a war economy; even in peacetime, US military expenditure would remain large, reducing the percentage of unemployed compared to the 1930s. He extended this analysis in 1950 and 1951"

 

The problem is Washington, not North Korea.

"And let’s be honest, the only reason Kim Jong Un hasn’t joined Saddam and Gadhafi in the great hereafter, is because (a)– The North does not sit on an ocean of oil, and (b)– The North has the capacity to reduce Seoul, Okinawa and Tokyo into smoldering debris-fields. Absent Kim’s WMDs, Pyongyang would have faced a preemptive attack long ago and Kim would have faced a fate similar to Gadhafi’s. Nuclear weapons are the only known antidote to US adventurism.

The American people –whose grasp of history does not extend beyond the events of 9-11 — have no idea of the way the US fights its wars or the horrific carnage and destruction it unleashed on the North. "

http://www.counterpunch.org/2017/04/17/the-problem-is-washington-not-north-korea/

 

I'm an American. I know more about history than you.

 

How well did Jimmy's "Agreed Framework" hold up? Did NK follow it, or did they break the agreement like every other one they've signed? There is no point to negotiating with such countries, they will break every treaty they sign.

 

Are you quoting from that site with the ludicrous expectation the forum at large will respect it or anything that comes from it?