Australia's economy grew by 4.3% in the last year

Remind me again why the sky is falling.

 

THE CARBON TAX.


Thats going to fark everything up.

 

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

What are they predicting? It'll raise an extra few billion in taxes, or in other words where we were a few years ago when the sky wasn't falling. We've had so many tax breaks over the last 10 years that people will still be paying less in taxes, and thus have more money in their pockets, than they did just a few years ago.

 

Hey Tank i dont know what planet your on.

The carbon tax will put energy prices up and then like a domino effect will increase the cost of all goods and services.

Meaning people will tighten their belts again.

Yeah tax cuts have been generous but its because they wont be enough when the carbon tax sets in.

Why do you think the tax free threshold hold went up by such an unprecedented amount?

 

Yeah, meat will go up to $500kg. We'll all be unemployed!

What (*)(*)(*)(*)ing planet do you live on?

If having that little money didn't send us all to the poor house just a few years ago it won't now.

 

You actually believe what that red headed bafoon has been saying about how little the carbon tax will impact us.

She has lied about everything else why should this be any different?

 

Did the economy crash during the drought when the price of food went through the roof? Or the floods last year?

Nope, but 1 little extra tax that makes us pay less than we did than apparently during the glory days of the rule of the Liberal Party will send us all broke.

That's asinine.

 

Well their saying that in the next 3 to 5 years energy prices will rise 40% due to the carbon tax.

Now when energy prices rise this affects all goods and services.

Therefore all goods and services will rise as well.

How can this be a little foolish tax, i ask you.

At $23/tonnes the most expensive carbon tax in the world it will also put us behind in our overseas competitiveness.

And with the whole world about to go down the dunny!!!!

I mean if Europe or the US crashes so will we.

 

Energy and water prices have been rising, and will continue to rise regardless of the carbon tax. The carbon tax will probably drop a bit after it's floated.

Trade exposed industries are subsidised with free permits of varying amounts, at least initially.

Of course if the biggest and second biggest economies crash now we will as well, there will be a global recession, everyone will crash, it's unavoidable so soon after the GFC.

 

0.7% increase is nowhere near the 30% Abbott claims. This is the nature of these big corporations who will be paying small change for the price on carbon, and still wanting to pass it on to the consumer. The government has covered any rising costs over sufficiently. Dumb, I got to give it to you, you are tenacious about taking up Abbott's rhetoric and fear campaign about costs. BHP profit = $24 billion, their max carbon costs would be around $540M. Still profiting $23.6 Billion. Who should we be attacking, not the government but these greedy corps who don't give a stuff about us as the consumer or the planet they pollute. Probably started on prototypes from the fortunes they have made to leave us behind in the mess they have left, to explore other planets.

 

This quote says it all actually....who is they. Ummmm, those on the left of the chamber!

 

Yeah right, BHP will absorb the added cost. No they will pass it on and it is expected to be. and next year 25+ in profit.

 

Hey vigilante sorry to break your bubble but the cost of the carbon tax will be passed onto you and me.

Do you think i would be screaming all this time if the corporations had to pay?

Hell i would be applauding Gillard for such a move.

Unfortunately its not the way of it and ALL of the CARBON TAX COST will be passed onto consumers!

Now will that change the tree that you are singing from?

Here are some quotes to consider.

Not only will energy prices go up because the companies will pass on the cost to you me and but all goods and services that you use will go up to because they also will be stung with an increase in their energy bill.

 

Its not Abbott i'm listening to (centre right).

Many a commenator on the radio are predicting hefty price rises.

http://electricitywizard.com.au/electricity/electricity-cost

 

I was actually trying to say that the increase predicted is 0.7% as opposed to the 30% you parrot Abbott with. Of course the consumer is going to pay, but as I was also alluding to was that these corporation could very easily absorb this cost, based on the huge profits they make. It would be price gouging if prices rose beyond this. It simply won't happen, it is scaremongering to lowest degree regarding consumer confidence, and you and others who were drowned out by Abbott's mantra fell for it.
The CSIRO-AECOM research shows impacts on households are likely to be smaller than anticipated. It calculates Australia’s carbon pollution price will add 0.6% to inflation in 2012-13. This is less of an impact on the economy than estimated by Treasury modelling, and may be even smaller as the modelling assumes a 100% pass-through of costs by businesses to consumers.

The CSIRO-AECOM research underpins the figures used in the new online savings calculator at yourcarbonprice.com.au, as well as a national information program available to councils, schools, faith groups, business groups and other organisations.

“Communities are looking for real information about their day-to-day costs and savings. For example, the carbon pollution price initially translates into 2 cents extra for bread and a litre of milk, 11 cents for a leg of lamb and 14 cents for a weekly spend on fruit and vegetables but once you factor in ongoing government assistance, those weekly costs are largely covered and most people end up with money in their pocket,“ said ACOSS CEO Dr Cassandra Goldie.#

“Energy efficiency can put households even further ahead. The latest estimates* show most people could be another $12.75 better off per week ($663 per year) by making just 4 small changes in the home,” said Climate Institute CEO John Connor.

The CSIRO-AECOM study also compares the effect of the carbon pollution price with other inflationary events such as the introduction of the GST, Cyclone Yasi and the mining boom. It finds that the impact on prices of the 2001 GST was more than 4 times bigger (2.5%) than the carbon price, while fruit prices, led by bananas, spiked by a massive 70% after the damage of Cyclone Yasi.

The study reports that without domestic and global action to slow down climate change, the impact on basic food prices is likely be 20 times greater than the carbon price impact by 2050 because of extreme weather events.

“Potentially, Australia can cut up to 1 billion tonnes of pollution by 2020 with a carbon price and limits on pollution. This report demonstrates that the nation will continue to prosper while achieving an environmentally strong outcome to help manage the risks of climate change,” said Mr Connor.

 

I have a mate that is high up the tree in a major energy provider. I won't devulge too much more. He was telling me and a few others that we can expect rises from 30 to 50 percent over the next two to five years. This is partly due to the carbon tax but also it is to add more profit to the shareholders, much like the banks.

There is a lot of misinformation out in the media these days and it pays to read or watch a cross section of media and maybe you can find the truth somewhere in the middle. The media has a lot to do with the negative attitude we are enduring at the moment.

Warm and fuzzy doesn't sell as much as dark and gloomy. My personal belief is that the media is about as ethical as the pollies.

Another source of info that is widely used in this forum is Wikipedia. This source can be added to by anyone...you,me, a chimpanzee ! I found out the hard embarrassing way about researching info gained on Wikipedia.

 

Have you read this article thorougly Dumb. Please see the following snippet from this site:

Including the impact of the Carbon Price, the rising electricity cost can be attributed to two sources:

Rising cost of wholesale electricity 40% nationally
Rising cost of distribution 33.6% nationally
On a smaller scale, the electricity cost for transmission has also increased to meet a growing demand nationwide. Additionally, electricity retail prices are anticipated to rise in order to supply more power to residential customers for the same reason - to meet increasing needs for power throughout Australia.

You and the others opposing the carbon pollution price are being hoodwinked by Abbott and these greedy companies. It's funny how they use the carbon price but not it's actual costs, but go on to mention the real reason for the massive increases. You have to stop yourself from being disorientated by Abbott and his mantra. Media outlets have a vested interest in political parties. Who do you think they back. The party of the working man or the party of the corporate world?

 

Some of the cost from the carbon price will be passed on to us, but not all of it, some will be absorbed by business and some will be passed through exports. And the cost that does get passed through to us is means tested, the lowest incomes get compensated the most, not to mention raising the tax free threshold, pensions and all the other lower middle class welfare that already exists.

 

You are joking aren't you. Prey tell, how is the government going to stop the full cost and more being passed on?

How is it going to passed on through exports when the compensation package actually exempts the exports, in turn not raising the costs of production to the export market, thus supposedly not effecting the demand for the resources of Australia?

 

The mining industry is primarily an export industry. If you're saying they're going to lose money through the carbon tax, then you're saying they're going to absorb costs. If you're saying that they aren't going to lose money, since they're not going to be 100% compensated, you're saying that at least some of the costs will be passed through exports. Export industries making obscene profits obviously aren't going to be compensated as much as ones that are struggling, like the car industry or other manufacturers. Mining companies will have to pay the MRRT too, and even with all of that, they'll still be making record profits and expanding mining operations rapidly. Mining companies have to deal with fluctuating commodity prices, fluctuating currencies, all of which can hurt profit margins, and they wear it because that's all they can do. If carbon pricing and the MRRT weren't going to affect their profits, then they wouldn't have invested tens of millions in ad campaigns trying to stop it.

 

how much of that was due to mining do you think.... its the ONLY sector that is growing...

 

When we moved to our small town in the mid 90s, the primary school had 101 students. Today there are around 70. At that time all shops had been rented, today we have 6 empty, with another 2 closing soon. Today its harder then ever, to pull through winter. There are less tourists coming, both Australian and overseas.
I think the onliest reason why our economy is growing is because some people earn 1 million dollars in 30 minutes, tendency growing, despite carbon tax....
We have become a nation with 2 faces. The one face is struggling harder then ever, while the other face is earning almost too much money. Its not fair.
But I have to shut up here, before being called a communist...............................................................................................................................................................

 

http://www.petermartin.com.au/ - to sum up Peter Martin's argument - it will cost bugger-all.

 

Yes we have a two-speed economy. For years we've sat on our hands - well our government has, the Howard government that is - and taken the income and handed it out as bribes come election time. In another thread referencing our economy there are complaints about how it hasn't benefited our society. True enough, Howard and Costello created the Future Fund which was designed to pay for the superannuation liabilities of the Commonwealth Public Service and did sod-all else to develop our nation, particularly the infrastructure. Now Labor is using the boom money and we're still moaning. If Howard had appreciated what was happening and actually developed some policies to constructively use the money from the boom we wouldn't have the two-speed economy we have now. Anyway get rid of the bloody states and we have a national economy, not a bunch of them.

 

Good one. No matter whether we have a CTS or not, the greedy corporates will put up the prices, they always have. For decades we have been amazed at the amount of destruction to our rivers, oceans, atmosphere and land. We have seen hundreds of greedy capitalists dumping chemicals into streams and rivers to save a few bucks, to hell with the damage it causes.

I come from a town which is riddled with open cut mining, with the mines being about 20% of the towns employment. It was for hundreds of years an agricultural town. My father, now 96 and one of the many that helped to build the town into what it is, cannot even get a nursing home spot in the town, for, even with a population of 10,500 (2011) yet has no nursing home for it's pioneers. The miners also earn big money which has caused a dramatic increase of the cost of living within the town.

This article states .....

(One of these towns is the subject I am discussing)
http://wag.org.au/documents/doc-119-dvs-coaldust-rev.pdf

My worry, is what happens when the coal runs out. Up to about 30 years ago, mines could just leave the giant holes and move on. Changes in legislation made it so they had to refill the open cuts.

Open pit rehabilitation was going to spell the end of mining in Australia. It was going to cost millions of dollars and cause massive unemployment. Um it didn't.
other mythical problems....
The introduction of medicare would destroy the health system. It didn't
The GST would spell the end of small business in Australia. It didn't.

When I take my family on a picnic I pick up my rubbish when I leave.
My household refuse, if it cannot be recycled is placed within council bins.
If I no longer have use for something, I list it on Freecycle, Gumtree etc so someone else may be able to use it.

I clean up my mess, I expect big business to do the same ..... at least