Can we agree that feminism is poorly named?

Ok, I think what you describe is the exception. I realize you meant it as a generalization.

 

No, what I described was the apparent majority position in practice, even if it believes itself to be nobler in principle. I gauge by actions rather than words. And the actions are frequently at odds with the rhetoric. Pushing for favoritism rather than equality. But I'm fully aware that there are also people who do not fit that description. Perhaps you are one of them. I don't know. I haven't heard you speak enough on the subject yet.

 

Ok apparent to you, not to me. We will have to try harder to find a topic for argument!

Im for equality, for everyone. I wouldnt take affirmative action if offered. Im offended by it.

 

As far as feminism means equality under the law, and freedom for both sexes, and accepting that they are different, and that no unjust treatment is justified from those differences, and that men and women ought to be free to be what they are, I am the most die-hard feminist there is. But the problem is that my experience of feminism is that they believe in myths like the wage gap and a patriarchy, and that they pretend men and women are the same and thus believe every case of difference of outcome is due to discrimination. And worse of all, that they're supportive of discriminatory laws in order to 'correct' it.

And of course, feminism is a thing for women, which you continually make clear by talking about it as such. I just wish they'd either drop the pretense of representing men also, or if they insist on that, rename the movement.

And you must understand that I live in Sweden, where women are given higher priority for jobs and have lower requirements, where feminists complain about how letting men and women be free will make equality suffer (and I kid you not about that), and how the former leader of our biggest political party was a close friend with the leader of our radicical feminist party, and the latter argued for a man-tax and called straight women traitors to their gender. Is it any wonder that I wouldn't want to call myself a feminist?

 

Like I said, good for you. You appear to be the exception. Most people in general don't practice what they preach. So I'm not exclusively beating up on the feminists here.

 

We will assume you include yourself and Obama in the list of those who dont unerringly practice as they preach.

 

It's not about being unerring. Most people are hypocritical to some degree. Because none of us are perfect. But the degrees do vary. And sadly, very few people truly make an honest effort to live by what they talk about. Because most people are not honest with themselves. And as a result, they are walking contradictions. I make a daily effort not to bull(*)(*)(*)(*) myself. Am I perfect about it? Of course not. But the effort is there. Most feminists don't do this. In fact, most people on the left side of the political spectrum don't even bother to try. Because they are governed by their emotions. And as such, they just react constantly in the moment and cue up a new excuse every time they get busted on a double standard. And then they backward rationalize why they must be correct. Notice how they never actually admit to being wrong about anything. That displays a weakness of character. It displays a lack of integrity.

 

Most of that slim sector of those who label themselves as "feminist" is how I'd see it.

Something like that sector of those who drape themselves in the flag of "Christianity" or
"American Patriot" and then behave atrociously.

Im not a feminist of the sort you refer to, I dont mind being wrong. I know its a big part of learning
and growing.

I've never even heard of a fundamentalist who'd admit to any error in anything.

 

I just watched a video of men protecting a church while being sexually assaulted by feminists. The video shows one feminist performing oral sex on another feminist in front of the men protecting the church. It also shows feminists defacing the church, setting fires, a feminist forcing one of the men to touch her bare breasts ect.

I don't know how anyone could claim feminists aren't a supremacist hate movement after watching that video.

Appalling

 

I want to show you an example of what I'm talking about here in regards to special treatment vs. equality. Somebody just posted this thread in another section of the forum, and I thought it summed up the problem perfectly. Read this and tell me what you think.

http://www.politicalforum.com/showthread.php?t=337412

 

So, men are a supremacist hate group because all of them would want to do what three of them did to me..
It wasnt a video, either, staged or otherwise.

is there anything wrong with this picture?

 

No thanks, I dont need to be told that some people who badly represent their adopted ism and
are bad actors.

Do I need to give examples of people who badly represent Christianity, America, liberals, conservatives. men, etc?

My objection here is to the stereotyping of all, or a majority of who consider themselves feminists as bad actors.

One of our heros here says im not a feminist because in not a wild eyed radical. Kinda like those who'd say you are not a True Christian because (name your reason)

 

Why are you deflecting? I just wanted your input. Do you agree with what's being done here or not? And if "real feminists" really want to be equal, why don't they speak up about this? Shouldn't they be demanding to be held to the same standards as men?

 

"Deflection'? You spoke of those wanting special treatment. I said that there are plenty of people who badly represent their chosen -ism. No intent to "deflect', not sure why you even say it.

As for "speaking up', who speaks how much about what and why is something I cant address.

I spoke here to you of stereotyping, of those who dont represent the group they try to speak for.
What would you have me do?

Are you Christian? Why dont you speak up about those people or churches that want special treatment? Why dont you speak up more and why dont other Christians? (see how that goes?)*

Regarding same standards / equal treatment for men and women, its impossible. Where it is possible, but not practiced (examples...?) it should be examined carefully and changed if it needs changing. Who could object to that? Why should we give 'em the time of day if they do?



Its good of you to put "real feminists" in quotation marks. It is a nonsense term, something like "real Christians". But it makes the following question a bit nonsensical. Perhaps you'd have some other way of putting it?

*
Notice how they never actually admit to being wrong about anything. That displays a weakness of character. It displays a lack of integrity.

Do you ever notice this about fundamentalist christians, or ever speak up about it?

 

They don't want to go there, taikoo. They deflect away from the heinous violence 'some' men commit against women because it would make them uncomfortable to go there. Better for them to deflect and whine about women until the cows come home. I am really sorry about those three men.

 

I dont guess I know what is behind the stream of threads and posts on each, attacking
"feminism" as they imagine it to be.

I do know that on the average, men are bigger, stronger, more aggressive and are motivated to sexual and other violence in ways that women simply are not. There is no reasonable equivalency.

 

Then perhaps it IS deflection on their part.

Not to mention extraordinary 'irrationality'. Quite the phenomenon. Requires a sociological study for sure.

 

In this and other areas of the forum, I see a lot of very strong and kind of disturbing anti-women feelings expressed.

They all will be so oh I love women, and give examples, but it has to be women who behave to their
specifications.

Women who dont are a threat I suppose? Threat to their supposed manhood?


One of the particularly disturbing things is how readily some men will just decide on their own, who and what I am. Invent things that they project from their own ideas about women.
I suppose they do the same for other women, I cant be that special!

The guys who hurt me said a lot of things, calling me names not to repeat and like
"thats why" they were doing it to me.

If I were really the things they said or what men on this forum say about me, well, that would
justify just about anything they might want to do to me.