Christian Bakers Who Lost their Business after Homosexual Attack Refuse to Pay $135K

Sexual orientation is linked to genetic information, which is specified under the code. The DOJ and EEOC has made some regulations stating that sexual orientation is valid discrimination under Title VII. It was tricky with the "don't ask, don't tell" policy that began in the Clinton Administration and progress under both the Bush and Obama administrations. It has now culminated with the recent Supreme Court ruling.

That being said, being a cop is not a illegal discrimination lawsuit. I personally think it is stupid since cops are doing a job just as much as flipping burgers.

 

Weird how you had to even explain such basic details like that.

 

Not as far as you would have to drive to a wedding supply store.

 

You might find it interesting to actually read the Bill Of Rights sometime, not that his has any legal affect anymore, but as reading of past American history:

"In Suits at common law, where the value in controversy shall exceed twenty dollars, the right of trial by jury shall be preserved, and no fact tried by a jury, shall be otherwise re-examined in any Court of the United States, than according to the rules of the common law."

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No, that is false.

 

Well if we were talking about systematic denial of service, than you'd have a point.

But this rule really cuts the other way. What if a Jew owned a bakery and a Nazi wanted a cake with a swastika in frosting on it? Should the Jewish baker be allowed to deny service? What if it was a Christian bakery and a couple wanted a wedding cake for their satanic wedding and on it they requested the baker put "hail Satan" on it?

There has to be a line somewhere.

 

I don't think you are pointing out facts. The couple attempted to use the same argument you were using. The court rejected that argument. It even noted that the couple knew the person, including the Husband. The husband then stated, under oath, some time later in the trial, that he would do it again.

What the family did was stupid. More so, acting with extreme stubborn pride. They are now trying to blame everyone else for their mistakes whether one agrees with gay marriage or not.

Personally, they have no clue what it actually means to be in business. If you are serving the public, you hold your religious beliefs in check. That does not mean you ignore them or not use them, but you make sure that your beliefs do not interfere with conducting business in public. Baking a cake for a gay couple in no way states that you are supporting gay marriage or that you are going against your religious beliefs. And that is the mistake they made and are now paying dearly for it based on human pride.

 

It wasn't a lawsuit. Ketchup.

 

That is true, but there is a difference between legal discrimination and illegal discrimination. If you are petite, the big and tall store will discriminate against you. If you are dirt poor, Saks 5th Avenue will discriminate against you. Both cases are not against the law. But discriminate based on race, ethnicity, nationality, gender, and a few others, then you will have legal problems.

 

The right to a jury trial also is in the State of Oregon's Constitution:

"Section 11. Rights of Accused in Criminal Prosecution. In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall have the right to public trial by an impartial jury in the county in which the offense shall have been committed."

"Section 17. Jury trial in civil cases. In all civil cases the right of Trial by Jury shall remain inviolate."

http://bluebook.state.or.us/state/constitution/constitution01.htm

Once again, progressive fascists including holding public office spit on the Constitution and Bill Of Rights - national or their own states.

 

Freedom isn't free and freedom is not unlimited.

 

aaarrgghhhh.

For the ten thousand time -----> *messages* on a cake is not what the issue is. People are not required to put *messages* or words on a cake that violate their conscious.

It was about just simply *producing a ****ing cake.*

 

There would be no penalty. This is left wing tyranny. We have the proof in the gay hairdresser that refused service the Gov. of New Mexico's hair.

Zero penalty.

 

The mistake in your logic is that it is logical. This is singularly about the power of individuals within all powerful government agencies for which the REAL law is whatever the person in charge of that department says it is or isn't. That director then declares how much anyone doesn't like has to pay. If the person disputed this, the sum is massively increased and an "administrative judge" who works for the same government imposes the greater amount.

In your example, the Jew could refuse to make the cake with a swastika, but the Christian could not refuse to make a cake with "hail Satan" on it, because that would be the "law" according to the agency. There is essentially no law, just a million all-poweful government demigods.

 

So it looks like this was a matter of administrative law. A wholly pernicious form of "law" that is basically just orders issued by bureaucrats.

It'll be great to see if this goes to appeal. What would be more lovely is to see the fascist pig Brad Avakian lose face. Not that he'd care. The morally righteous inquisitors for the state are never aware of their faults, only their infallibility.

 

You don't have the right to someone's business.

It's really about your ability to deny service to people.

If it's your time your work your ingredients, your property and your business, nobody has the right to it.

 

The first love of my life dumped me for another guy. I'm sure I was hurt more than these women were. It took me 9 years to get over it. When I finally met a woman who I thought could make me forget my first love she dumped me after 2 months because she didn't think I'd ever get over her. While all that sucked, had it not happened I wouldn't be with my the wife I have now. Life ain't easy.

 

I view crybaby victimhood as pathetic weak minded and derivative.

There are far more Christians in this country than anybody else, so there are more Christian lawyers than any other lawyers. If you can't afford a lawsuit, Christian charity should be able to help.

I agree Christians are being persecuted, but it's by ourselves. We are the ones who can't live and let live, we are the ones who lack solidarity. We are the ones that injure or brothers and sisters more than any other faction.

 

Well I was talking about a bigger scale, but yes, I agree.

Further to live in defiance if tradition leads to people you will never know hating you. If you live such a way you must develop thick skin. The founders of our country did it.

 

As a nation, we're pretty much not excited about the idea of being able to refuse to serve blacks or whatever.

I know there are those who really like this sort of thing - which is why it went into our constitution.

 

I thought you could pick up that I am comparing gays and Christians as both being groups that are purely a choice yet protected by equal protection laws

 

There are at least a couple of similar cases, so I might have gotten this wrong.

BUT, I thought these folks chose not to have a jury trial, and that they then wanted one related to subsequent action after they lost the ruling in that first case.

They've been to court more than once on this case, and not all of the times they have gone to court carry a right to a jury.

For example, didn't they end up back in court when there were statements by the baker that she intended to continue breaking the law?

 

The problem is you quoted me from a different discussion. I said orein is in the mind and race wasn't and then you start throwing side attacks abe defensive shouting about christians and the 14th amendment which i never brought up. I havent said anything other than that in this thread you acted like I was a hyocrite but you must have me mixed up because i never mentioned christians.

 

Sure they are.

 

The gay couple even offered to get that cake topping from another place. So your picture is a straw man.

 

Those who hate gays are a dumb lot. But that is what they've been taught all their lives and it is what they listen to on radio and tv.