So what are you doing on this thread? The discussion is not about whether or not he existed. I'm not sure you even exist. Your response could just be a computor generated thing.
Perhaps you did not read the part where I asked if I am misunderstanding you. I know you are fond of the "bearing false witness accusation" but hold on a minute. I gave you the opportunity to clarify why you designate Paul's teachings as either sub par or different than the teachings of Jesus. I pointed to the Book of Acts to show my justification that they are one in the same. I am not in a sect of Christianity. I am part of the Body of Christ. Do you understand Max that there are many wolves in sheeps clothing and a few have appeared here. They like to divide and seperate us. They divide the Body by declaring the teachings of Paul as "Pauline Doctrine", To them I submit that Paul "counted his own works as dung". He submitted totally to Jesus. Now I am not casting any judgement on you. It would be nice for you to clarify what you think about the many Letters that Paul wrote in the New Testament.
Fond? Dude, there you go again. Sorry, but I don't have any respect for someone who repeatedly lies about me.
He did submit to our pain, sorrow, and physical weaknesses. He taught us how to depend on the Father.
Philippians 3:8 King James Version (KJV) 8. Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ.
Muslims aren't the only ones who don't accept the notion of a triune god. There are also The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints ("Mormons"), Jehovah's Witnesses, La Luz del Mundo, Iglesia ni Cristo, Christadelphians, Christian Scientists, Dawn Bible Students, Living Church of God, Oneness Pentecostals, Assemblies of Yahweh, Israelite Church of God in Jesus Christ, Members Church of God International, Unitarian Universalist Christians, The Way International, The Church of God International and the United Church of God. Of course, there is also Judaism. These are mostly minor players, but you can't imply that all these people along with the billions of Islam got it so obviously wrong as to justify your comment. Besides, the more popular trinitarian view isn't directly stated in the Bible. It is an interpretation that was formalized a couple hundred years later at the Council of Nicaea. Why was this formalization necessary given the relative recency? Given that they were the ones to determine which writings would be included in the Bible, is it any surprise that they would favor writings consistent with their decision? And, there certainly are Biblical passages, including quotes attributed to Jesus, that seem to draw the trinity idea into question.
??? Hasn't that been stated as a popular tenet of Christianity for page after page after page? The interesting point is that there are a LOT of people who just don't agree with you. Aren't you curious about why?
You lie when you say that.....what are you some kind of rapper pajama boy calling everyone you can't deal with -dude?
Nope. The Bible is quite enough. Lots of people worship Stan Satan and sing and dance around Nakey Do.
I think you've made your point concerning what YOU believe. If all you have on this topic is your immutable belief to be parroted repeatedly, you really aren't in the right place.
I addressed this before, but I'll repeat it. Islam and Mormonism.. and Jehovah's witnesses, and Arianism.. and any other isms that deny Christ's deity.. are DEPARTURES from Christian orthodoxy. 'Jesus is God', and 'Jesus is NOT God', are not saying the same thing. They are diametrically opposed concepts. Here are the logical possibilities: Jesus is God. Historical Christianity is True, and sects, cults, or false prophets are departures and heretical. Jesus was NOT God. Islam (or Mormonism , Arianism, etc) was a correction, not a departure. The Nicene Creed was issued in large part to condemn the teachings of Arius as heretical. Irenaeus' writings addressed that as well. That is the function of an apologist, to correct false teachings, expose lies and errors, and defend the True Faith. In any quest for Truth and understanding, lies, distortions, and deceptions are always there, poised to lead the seeker of Truth astray. That is the situation here. Christianity has very specific principles and foundational doctrines, that if you take the opposite position, make that 'not Christianity.' I am not attempting to PROVE the truth of historical, biblical Christianity, but to define it, so departures and aberrations can be distinguished. What people believe about the man Jesus is up to them. I am only pointing out the original version, not the myriads of 'upgrades' or departures, since. So from the biblical, historical teachings from the Founder of Christianity, His early disciples, and continuing in an unbroken line throughout history, this is how other 'religions' are viewed. Judaism. Christianity is the fulfillment of the Mosaic Law, and Jesus was and is, the foretold Messiah. Islam, 7th century. A judeo-christian cult.. a departure from sound doctrine. Mormonism, 19th century. A judeo-christian cult.. a departure from sound doctrine. Arianism, 4th century. A judeo-christian cult.. a departure from sound doctrine. Etc... Any teachings that deny the deity of Christ are heretical departures from orthodoxy. They are not the 'same thing!', or just a different interpretation. Now, like i said, you don't have to believe in Christ's deity, but it is the foundation of orthodoxy. All the heresies and apostasies are departures and contrary to the original. It is Orwellian obfuscation and illogical madness to say that 'Christianity', and 'not Christianity,' are the same thing. Worldviews/Theistic/Abrahamic/Christianity. Worldviews/Theistic/Abrahamic/Islam They may come from similar roots, and share similar classifications or even terminology, but they are polar opposites, on the Central Tenet of Christian Orthodoxy: The Deity of Jesus. The confusion over this has been constantly fomented by the enemies of Christianity, over the millennia, so it is understandable that clarity is lacking. And, this was part of my intent, here, to provide clarity, and correct any faulty or flawed perceptions of what constitutes Christianity. There IS.. an historical, exact definition of Christianity, that can be discovered by studying the facts of history. Unfortunately, there are also lies and distortions in abundance, to bewilder any seeker of Truth. If one is careful with facts, and employs skepticism and scrutiny in their quest for understanding, i believe they will be sucessful, and discover the Truth, in whatever domain of knowledge they pursue. But, if they are careless with facts, and only look for corroboration for their own prejudice, they will likely find that, instead. Be careful what you search for. You might find it. “To love truth for truth's sake is the principal part of human perfection in this world, and the seed-plot of all other virtues.” ~John Locke
I pretty much have a handle on the 'Why.' It was in the OP, but is usually poo-pooed in naturalistic society. Deception This world is under the influence of a great deceiver. His goal is to kill and destroy, and to bring confusion to man so he cannot understand the redemption process, and be reconciled to God. But this explains to me the irrational hatred of Christianity, and the flood of lies and distortions that surround this ideological worldview. Few philosophical worldviews are surrounded by distortions, contradictions, and overt lies, as Christianity is. That is why careful, rational, and systematic inquiry is needed, to dredge the tailings of deception, to mine a nugget of truth.
participating in a debate. You made a positive assertion that requires evidence to support that assertion if called on it. I called you on it. So..........what did he accomplish? can you even show he existed? you need to do that, before you can assert he was not a mere man.
You accuse me of lying when I say I don't have any respect for someone who repeatedly lies about me? Interesting form of Christianity you practice. What other non-mainstream things doe your church advocate? Plural marriages to 13 year olds? Celibacy? Snakes?
Several early versions of Christianity also didn't accept the divinity of Jesus nor the Trinity....until they were wiped out by those that did. As for saving, IIRC, that's primarily based on comments of Jesus stating he was a path to God. As another wise man once stated, there are many paths to the mountain top. I do not believe an all powerful, all merciful, all knowing God would send billions of children to suffer in Hell because they never heard of Jesus.
Several years ago there was some heartburn at my gym about the fad among some Christians that yoga was evil. This problem became a bit more inflamed because the yoga instructor was the sister/sister-in-law of the gym owners. I discussed the issue with the male half of the owners and used my belief that God is all knowing, all powerful and all merciful. Therefore, God would not allow Satan to take people against their will. If a person was Christian and loved God, then just because they chose yoga as a form of exercise was not wrong. An example was someone handing out free t-shirts to kids at a Justin Bieber concert that had his picture on it but underneath in tiny letters and in a foreign language it said "by wearing this t-shirt I give my soul to Satan". Would the child's soul be harmed or would God prevent that from happening because the child did not give their soul freely and knowingly? Add to this redemption; if God is truly all merciful then wouldn't all will be forgiven to those who truly seek to be in God's grace? Yes, including Lucifer himself?
I can't really say, with certainty, what happens with individual souls. That is the Judge's domain, and i am not involved. Beliefs about The Judgement abound as well. My purpose here was to provide a historical , biblical summary of the Christian position (as opposed to the missionary position!). I don't see any dire warnings from apologists and scholars about yoga, or meditation techniques , or exercise and healthy living. I figure that obscure or ambiguous things in life that have no clear directive or pattern are optional. And if there are things i cannot reconcile or understand, why worry about them? I have enough problems with the things i DO understand, without worrying about the things i don't.
