Council Travel expenditure anybody

Discussion in 'Australia, NZ, Pacific' started by garry17, Oct 26, 2019.

  1. garry17

    garry17 Well-Known Member

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    https://www.smh.com.au/national/ang...y-attack-on-clover-moore-20191025-p534cd.html
    Has it become the normal around the world to make false claims of everybody and then try make it stick???


    I don’t like Clover Moore due to the fact she makes some very extraordinary claims and demands she attempts to impose on Sydney city. However, I don’t believe making false claims against anybody should be acceptable in any area.


    Laying claim that Moore’s council has spent 15m odd in transport when the actual was 6k leaves one asking where the figures came from and why they were not verified??? Taylor seems to have either flagrantly embellished details he gathered from a third party OR he is complicit in creating (or forging) documentation to support false and misleading claims.


    I have to admit, when I first heard the claims by the ALP, I had considered that it was just another slanders attack on government to try and score cheap points… I think this demonstrates there is something that does need addressing.


    Now clearly I dislike Trump (as a person) and this would appear to be something Trump does. Lay claims of other people and organisations completely without evidence and simply expect it to stick. BUT I would think in Australia there has to be some sort of support for your claims. As you see in the article, while Taylor does apologise for getting it wrong he still refuses to say where the article containing the data he used to make these false allegations originated.


    Admittedly, he still could have gotten the information of the council website as even Clover Moore states there is two copies of the same article. I have to point out that Moore stipulates that the figures are far outside of what appears on either copy suggesting that there is difference in figures…


    Either way, Taylor seems to have made huge error. Did he forge the articles??? Has the
    articles been falsified on council sight??? And even if he was supplied with false evidence, should he still be held accountable??? I say he should.


    Did he break the law??? What do you say???
     
  2. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yes, this is Soviet Era tactics, used by the communists "fake news" embraced by all.. which is why there is so much confusion.

    Not sure why you single out Trump, by now it should be obvious that the whole Russian collusion investigation was exactly the "fake news trying to make it stick" you are complaining about now.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2019
  3. garry17

    garry17 Well-Known Member

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    I single out Trump because it is his MO. HE did so during Obama presidency being the loudest calling for birth certificate. During his pre-selection for presidential candidate, now, throughout his presidency. Making claims of his opposition of criminal behaviour and ineligibility without ounce of evidence. I am not complaining about the Russian investigation, I simply point out the existence and the continued complaint shows just how serious Americans consider such matters. Nobody in the last few years personifies this political tactic than Trump.

    BUT, what is fake??? I hear it (fake) was the documentation presented by Taylor to support fervent claims of travel expenses rorts in a council proclaiming to be green minded. Perhaps I am wrong, here and happy to be corrected but at present it would appear that Taylor is completely wrong in this case. BE it criminal or just unethical, to me it would appear he needs tossing and bringing decent representation.

    However, I could agree about the soviet tactic of presenting fake news but more like propaganda. Communism doesn't need to convince the people their news is right or wrong, they feed the news that they want told. Slightly different and maybe splitting hairs, but I think this is slightly different as it is a Minister, possibly fabricating evidence, to influence other elected officials for their own personal purpose.
     
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  4. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Fake news tactics are in the Green Book Garry, communisms handbook The Green Book - Lessons from Vietnam published in August 1979.
    Although I dare say the British likely used it in WW1 and WW2...so would probably not suggest that is the origin
     
  5. garry17

    garry17 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, but not sure what you consider as being fake here. Taylor's acitvities???
     
  6. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    My comment is aimed at the widespread use of fake news, we are all bombarded with Fake news which is a communist strategy from Mae Zedong's People War, to demonise those we want to defeat and to praise those who support our policies. Migration Pact, Gun Reform, climate change LGBT etc issues are all Liberal media issues pushed positively. Conservatives like Trump are demonised... as well as white South Africans who are trying to escape the violence of open borders, Affirmative Action, Gun Control, Education sex reform, Health reforms that collapsed the Health system etc. Also European conservatives who oppose illegal migration are demonised... Brexit is demonised by the liberal press. It is very widespread and the majority of people have no idea how they are being manipulated.
     
  7. garry17

    garry17 Well-Known Member

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    Oh, but the issue here is not fake, Taylor used documentation which is clearly false to attack Moore over climate hypocrisy. He put it house as evidence as such and posted it as public ridicule. NOW it appears that information is not just mistaken but actually fraudulent. Several questions need to be answered such as where did the documents come from??? Why didn’t Taylor do the smallest amount of due diligence and why should Australian’s believe this person is capable enough to actually stand as elected official???

    I don’t see anything about fake media, socialism or communism in the issue. or are you posing that Taylor is the target of socialist agenda and ignore the fact he is admitting himself the failure he has created???
     
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  8. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I thought you were also complaining about fake news and false accusations... my bad... carry on
     
  9. garry17

    garry17 Well-Known Member

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    No not fake news, but false accusations made with false and misleading information. Sure on socialist level these things fly, but in Australia it is expected not to fabricate facts and evidence to support fabricated accusations.

    Media have their own slant on the story, but the fact that Taylor (who only sent the apology last couple days) makes the premise of my complaint justified, I do believe. The question is, if Morrison will actually do anything about this??? I think he should step down, because I don't believe there is a plausible explanation as to using falsified documentation and where did it come from. And the very least it shows ineptitude of Taylor’s leadership.
     
  10. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Ha ok what't the difference between false and leading information and fake news :lol: same thing Gary

    And regarding Australia having reporting standards... let me show you how subtle they lie

    example.

    From this Australian article https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2019...stralia-fight-for-political-survival/11611962

    What bullshit, if Climate Change was the top issue in Australia, then Scomo would not have won at all and Adani protests would have won Queensland for Labor and the Greens, not the Conservatives

    Why do you think the polls got Trump's and Scomo's election wins so wrong. Because it doesn't follow the Liberal agenda.

    The news reports the liberal agenda...they are told what the issues are and that is what they report.

    This is manipulation... straight out of the green book... multiply these voices...add in the funding for protest groups and you're making the issue you want to be number 1 important.

    Australia is under Open Societies attack, protest funding and media manipulation, indoctrinating our children and you people just don't see it.
     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2019
  11. garry17

    garry17 Well-Known Member

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    There is a difference. You point to the reporting of information, Such as the article I posted to support my premise. That was a report by a third party something that had happened. IT did contain a falsehood. That was Taylor had written an apology for his actions. BUT his actions are as stated. As pointed out that apology was simply reported until two days ago, not at the time of report.


    I am discussing the actions of Taylor with his attack of Moore. And the fact he is fabrication facts to support his claim. Very different from reporting fake news to actually creating the facts.

    Yes, it is manipulation and Australian political machine acts on such fake news.


    They drape themselves from the slant of polls, which is also misleading. I maintain, opinion polls are slanted by the content, location and the fact of who wants to give their opinion. The fact is they are reporting their selected findings which while is clearly not factual, is to what they are reporting. Take these morning shows, everybody is convinced they report current affairs. The truth is it is an $18b industry. You see, all the way from Fiji the morning crew presents good morning Australia. Or the weather brought to you from Canada. ALL being paid for by the tourism industries. Canada couldn’t afford the whole dog and pony show they could only afford the weather man. Cash for comment, extraordinaire.



    Just as reporting is slanted by the type of people introduced as “experts” on subjects. For example, North Korea taunts US to talks and we hear from some university stalwart who proclaims expertise on North Korean relations, who has not even been to Korea, trying to convince they are the consummate intelligence on policy, because they read it in a book.


    A huge rort in taxi charges see the ABC talk to a so called expert on mass transit trying to depict why Uber is devaluing the taxi industry.

    Oh and the scene of a horrendous murder suicide event finds the friend of a neighbour who lives in the NT who is related to the person who lives six miles from the location is distraught enough to tell the story of how it happened that they heard about this sensational incident.


    BUT in this case, the reporting is about Taylor who publically vilified Moore over this so-called information. That was not fake news and should any media group present something as some sort of fact, without some plausible support, they too face slander. Something that Taylor is guilty himself of, without explanation.


    I can see your point, but it is far from the issue.
     
  12. garry17

    garry17 Well-Known Member

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    I don’t care who you are, a phone call questioning the investigation of a minister and then going public stating the support of that minister…
    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-27/albanese-turnbull-criticise-morrison-over-fuller-taylor-call/11740174

    Then I would suggest you would clearly understand the outcome of the investigation. I would also suggest the if it was the PM who called, you would be far more receptive to the intention not verbalised as to what is expected…

    Quite clearly, we are not only discussing inept acts of a government minister but the corrupt actions of a Prime Minister to head off any investigation of the minister. One can quite clearly see, this ministers actions have seriously damaged the credibility not only of this the minister but the government he resides.

    Morrison has to now seriously consider his position as his actions to desperately defend this minister has (IMHO) demonstrated the most serious corruption of influencing an independent investigation. This act alone blurs the powers of separation so much so that now this minister will always be considered corrupt even after an investigation (which is now clearly going to go nowhere) will be completed.

    I do not see how this PM can clear his own actions let alone continue to support another. He has corrupted an investigation while trying his best to suggest it is a political motivated investigation. He has to go… this is corruption at its basic form…
     

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