Gulf states plan military response as Putin raises the stakes in Syria

Discussion in 'Latest US & World News' started by litwin, Nov 11, 2015.

  1. Ethereal

    Ethereal Well-Known Member

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    Even if everything you say about Russia is true, it still doesn't change the fact that the US government has invaded and destroyed numerous countries themselves, and was clearly involved in the illegal overthrow of the Ukraine's democratically elected President. The Russian involvement in Ukraine, which is right on their border and which has deep historical ties to Russia, is totally predictable and rational given the millions of ethnic Russians living in the eastern Ukraine who were disenfranchised and oppressed by the illegal regime in Kiev.
     
  2. litwin

    litwin Well-Known Member

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    did USA destroyed Ukraine too? or you have info which shows that Crimea and Lugandia were annexed by USA not by Muscovy

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    Syria doesn't exist anymore ...
     
  3. Talon

    Talon Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Tu quoque, and everything I said about Russia is well documented, most particularly the distribution of Vlad the Invader's calling cards in the countries where the Kremlin later committed its revanchist war crimes...

    That's clear only to the people who are willing to believe the Kremlin's war propaganda.

    I'm well aware of the Crimea's historical ties to Russia and I have no reason to respect the artificial internal borders that Nikita Khrushchev drew during the Soviet era. However, that doesn't change the fact that the Russian invasion and annexation of Ukrainian territory that it previously pledged to respect is totally illegal, as were the sham referendums it held in the territories it seized.

    Russia's neighbors are not Russia's servants, and the unwillingness of those countries and their people to serve Russia does not entitle the Kremlin to violate and destroy their sovereignty and territory. Nor do Vladimir Putin's revanchist dreams of re-establishing the Russian and Soviet empires.
     
  4. litwin

    litwin Well-Known Member

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    edition: economical borders that Nikita Khrushchev ....80% of Crimean economy were connected to USSR, so it was a pure practical decision, soviet have changed internal borders 100000 times , and no one questions them ...
     
  5. Ethereal

    Ethereal Well-Known Member

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    Why do you keep glossing over the fact that the millions of ethnic Russians living in eastern Ukraine have rights, too, and that they are resisting the illegal overthrow of their democratically elected President?

    And my willingness to believe in the CIA's involvement in the illegal coup in Ukraine (operating under the diplomatic cover provided to them by the State Department) is based on their record of overthrowing dozens of governments. As I said earlier, the only way it's not obvious is if we ignore the fact that they have done this in dozens of countries over many decades. It has absolutely nothing to do with "Kremlin propaganda" but well-established history.
     
  6. litwin

    litwin Well-Known Member

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    what has to do with GRU/Muscovite army annexation of Crimea?
     
  7. Ethereal

    Ethereal Well-Known Member

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    The majority of people living in Crimea favored secession from Ukraine, just like the Euromaiden protesters favored overthrowing the President of Ukraine before his term was up. What's good for the goose is good for the gander, no?
     
  8. litwin

    litwin Well-Known Member

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    bs the before occupation the separatists had only 4% in local parliament , that is why GRU first attacked Crimean Parliament. google goblin and his salem gang
     
  9. Ethereal

    Ethereal Well-Known Member

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    In the 2010 Presidential elections, more than 70% of the Crimean voters voted for Yanukovych, and over 60% of the people living in Crimea are ethnic Russians. It's pretty clear that the majority of people living there favored secession from Ukraine. But it's also pretty clear that anti-Russian extremists only care about democracy when they agree with the results.

    [​IMG]
     
  10. Talon

    Talon Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I've acknowledged Crimea's historical ties to Russia, dismissed the artificial borders that Khrushchev drew during the Soviet era and said that it's fair to describe the coup as illegal. What I haven't seen you acknowledge is that Ukraine is a sovereign nation, and Russia had absolutely no right to illegally violate what it previously pledged to respect.

    Anyone who thinks that the Russian invasion of Ukraine is a result of the propaganda that the Kremlin has been spewing about "illegal Western-orchestrated coups" hasn't been paying attention to what's been going on over there for the past decade. Putin started handing out Russian passports in that country the same year he invaded Georgia - 2008. As was the case concerning that victim of revanchist Russian aggression, the invasion was a Kremlin-orchestrated affair that was planned well in advance, and the pretexts for both invasions were carefully crafted by Putin to lend a phony air of legitimacy to his naked aggression.

    Permit me to turn the opening line in your post around on you: Why are you willing to gloss over the fact that the USSR, Russia and their security and intelligence services have overthrown dozens of governments and enslaved half of Europe in the past century? What about that well-established history of which Ukraine and Georgia have been repeatedly victimized by the USSR/Russia, and in the case of Ukraine, subjected to one of the most heinous democides/genocides of the 20th Century, the Holodomor?
     
  11. litwin

    litwin Well-Known Member

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    Goebbels said give me mass media for a month and i´ll turn people into the pigs , so Kiselev has partly succeed with his propaganda.
    ps in order to get back to reality

    [​IMG]
     

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