Gun Registration. Why should gun owners be opposed?

Gentlemen, and/or ladies, as the case may be:
Worrying about what may happen and what is going on behind the scenes and what the motives of others might be/are is not paranoia. It is merely what free people must do to ensure the perpetuity of their freedom. A client once remarked to me that I didn't have a nerve in my whole body, to which I replied that she doesn't have the benefit of seeing me the night before, unable to sleep for worrying about what I may have overlooked or what someone else may have thought of that I might be unprepared to respond to (yes, that is a dangling participle). My point is that remaining prepared to defend your liberties and the balance achieved by our system of government is not paranoia. It is something that many of us do so that the remainder of you can afford your delusions.

 

I have no dog in this fight, but here is what is disturbing (beside "Logician"'s apparently jaundiced view of what the evidence shows):

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/201...rayvon-martin-george-zimmerman-deceptive?lite

 

An interesting article >

For two weeks, bullets pierced two dozen cars driven through Detroit’s suburbs as police puzzled over who was firing. Unlike most states, Michigan has a tool that helped lead to an arrest: a pistol registry.

Without that database of buyers and sellers, police said the investigation would have taken longer, more people might have been injured or someone might have been killed, before they arrested an unemployed geologist in connection with the crimes on Nov. 5.

The story of what worked in Michigan -- one of six states that require registration of at least some types of firearms -- is also the story of what isn’t happening elsewhere. Gun-rights advocates, led by the National Rifle Association, have successfully campaigned against firearm registries across the U.S. They narrowly lost a bid last year to eliminate Michigan’s.

“The NRA has been extremely effective at guarding their patrons, the firearms industry, from having to provide data by consistently ginning up a fear that the federal government is going to come for your guns,” said Mark D. Jones, a former U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives special agent who is a senior law-enforcement adviser at the University of Chicago Crime Lab. “It slows down investigations in a profound way.”

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-02-13/gun-lobby-helps-block-data-collection-by-crimefighters.html

 

This is the way I understand it in my state……
Now tell me… What more could we do????
Tracking A Firearm
1. Firearm made and stamped with serial number.
2. Firearm stored or shipped.
3. Firearm shipped to distributer or FFL holder for resale.
- Information recorded who firearm was shipped to. (model and Serial #)
4. Distributor ships firearm to FFL Holder for resale.
5. FFL holder sells gun to Citizen Joe.
- Citizen Joe has to fill out forms and provide ID to FFL holder who then is required to check background of Citizen Joe.
- If Citizen Joe has “permit to buy” or “permit to carry” he is good to go. (these permits are obtained from local sheriff’s office, background check done.)
- All information for that firearm is recorded with paperwork filled out by Citizen Joe. Citizen Joe is now cleared to take firearm home. Firearm is registered at this point.
6. There should be a clear paper trail up until this point for BATF to follow if need be.
7. Firearm is taken home and put away. Citizen Joe will probably be the first person the police talk to if that firearm is found at a crime scene just because he was original owner. He has to answer if he sold or lent firearm to someone not legal to possess.
8. Now provided that some newspaper doesn’t print names of gun owners/permit holders for everyone to see!!!
Now, let’s say the firearm gets stolen from Citizen Joe.
Citizen Joe reports the theft along with Serial # of the firearm to the Sheriff’s office.
At this point it doesn’t matter if the firearm was registered or not because now nobody knows who has it anyway. Whoever stole it isn't going to register it...
If Citizen Joe lives on east coast, that firearm could end up anywhere between there and the west coast.
Serial number may or may not be removed.

Maybe none of us should own anything for fear it might be stolen from us.

 

News flash - not every gun owner is an NRA member nor does every gun owner follow and back the NRA.
I despise them personely for the lack of support for Massachussetts gun owners mainly due to political reasons. Once you ban a certain weapon, the pre ban models are far more expensive. You buy a gun for 800 dollars, it gets banned, you can sell it for 1,600 dollars. A lot of people see it as an investment. For most, it has nothing to do with the NRA.
This article is mainly opinionated and lacks statistical backup, and seeming that Detroit is one of the most violent city with toughest gun control while boasting a large gun murder rate, its pretty safe to say that gun control there is quite innafective. Maybe if they took a different approach, like taking down the gangs that plauge the area, you would see some change.

 

Not only that, the legislature in Washington state is overreaching. We are getting to the point where the true agenda is coming around because they want the local Sheriff to search your house once per year to comply with storage stipulations. No warrant. Just come in and do a compliance check.

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/documents/billdocs/2013-14/Pdf/Bills/Senate Bills/5737.pdf

Oh look, they changed it.

http://www.examiner.com/article/washington-awb-language-changed-but-too-late-to-avoid-exposure

They want to ensure that "assault weapons" are secured properly. How are they going to do this? Registration. If the anti-gun people had their way, the fourth amendment no longer applies if you own an "assault weapon" if bills like this pass muster. There are also bills that can be slipped through with provisions like this because the makers of this bill and other big promoters, like N. Pelosi had been saying, “We have to pass the bill so that you can find out what is in it.” The writer of this bill didn't even know that it was in there supposedly.

This mentality is just under the surface, waiting for the right conditions to rid the world of evil black assault rifle guns. I don't fear for myself, but for my kids.

 

When "Citizen Joe" sells his firearm in a private sale, how is this recorded?
If the gun is found on a crime scene 11 years after being sold to "Citizen Joe", how many times is it likely to have changed hands?

If the firearm is located during a police investigation (eg: searching a suspect of a potentially unrelated crime, during execution of a search warrent, etc) how can the police determine the legal owner if "Citizen Joe" sold it some years ago and the weapon has not been reported stolen since?

 

So, in order to be as enlightened and responsible as you, we should prepare for any potential threat without regard for the likelihood of that threat coming to light?
Worrying about what is extremely unlikely is irrational. Irrational people are the ones most people are concerned about in relation to firearms...

 

How often does this happen? Is it often enough to justify the price of the program you want to create?

 

A quote from the below pro-gun site: "According to the ATF, the average "time to recovery" (the time span between the initial purchase of a firearm to the time that it is used in a crime) is more than 11 years. This tells us that criminals typically are using older, recycled firearms, not newer firearms recently purchased from licensed retailers."
http://www.dontlie.org/faq.cfm

So, to answer your question: yes, it is happening often.

 

No need to worry, just go back to sleep. Want me to sing you a lullaby? What, still awake? Then you must understand that the point is, that no one is any good at what he/she does unless he/she worries about it, and no one remains free and secure unless he/she worries about it. You and I have grown up in a very secure and stable society, but those qualities do not self-sustain. They erode over time with complacency and neglect, and must be, as the quotation goes, (and I am speaking figuratively here, I hope, so don't get your panties in a wad) they "must be refreshed with the blood of patriots."

 

I know in my state, Citizen Joe cannot legally sell a handgun to someone unless they have a permit to buy or permit to carry. Citizen Joe should have the record of sale if needed to protect himself. All other buyers/sellers should do the same just for legal reasons. As far as registration, I don’t think so. New York has already let it out that they were looking at possible confiscation after registration. I have a lot of money into what I have for recreation and hunting. I am not willing to take the chance, especially when I haven’t done anything wrong.
No matter how many laws/bans are put in place, the government cannot control the human mind and the thought process.
For some reason, all legal gun owners have been put on trial and convicted. We are now waiting for a sentence.
I have been around firearms/shooting since before I was a teenager and now all of the sudden it is bad…..



Maybe this suspect owns it legally. After all he is only a suspect. The police will check him out and if they find he is ok, he gets his gun back. If not then he has some questions to answer.

 

Nice try. There's a world of difference between showing concern for a viable possibility, and being irrationally paranoid about an impossibility.

 

Certain laws have contributed to keeping guns out of the hands of criminals. Background checks alone in 1999 stopped 200,000 potential gun sales to criminals.
But that isn't enough. A scary fact is that various mass shootings occurred in places that are gun-free zones such as elementary schools and colleges. That example goes to show another scary fact that our gun laws aren't affecting the criminals as they should be affecting but rather law abiding citizens. Because criminals don't follow the law, they don't care that they are not allowed to bring guns into a school. In fact, they see schools as perfect targets. There has to be a way to control gun misuse other than imposing laws that negatively affect the wrong people. A solution to this issue could involve imposing less gun control laws and making changes that could be highly beneficial.
Something we all know is that children learn through role models. Teaching children to respect authority could prevent tons of future crime. This is a lesson that society needs to work to instill in children. We could also impose better security. Sure it would be costly, but it's worth it.
Of course we can't stop everyone from misusing guns but we can do a lot and in the process without strict gun laws which hurt law-abiding gun owners.

 

http://www.texastribune.org/2010/06/02/school-district-cops-ticket-thousands-of-students/
"...“several districts ticketed a 6-year-old at least once in the last five years,” according to a recent presentation to the state Senate’s Criminal Justice Committee by Texas Appleseed. Such tickets, often given for “disorderly conduct” or “classroom disruption,” typically are handled in municipal courts or by county justices of the peace and can have fines of between $250 to $500, police and court officials say..."
Yep. sho 'nuff. What we'll do is turn them into criminals before the get out of 1st grade. Yep yep, that'll work. Let's go ahead and promote the GOD-ALMIGHTY FEAR in them. Once they've been branded as criminals, then what?
this'll show them kids:
[video=youtube;meWmt9obL9o]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpag e&v=meWmt9obL9o[/video]
Notice how this cops puts his hittin' gloves on:
[video=youtube;JPbu68OfGok]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpag e&v=JPbu68OfGok[/video]
and this is how your beloved police state functions:
[video=youtube;U0X1Acrty6E]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpag e&v=U0X1Acrty6E[/video]
Move to Australia..they got no worries over there with 550,000 to 6 million unregistered fire arms in a totally gun free society.

 

Well what did we recently see happen with the data gathered by govt for concealed carry permits? SOme nutsack reporter gathered that information and posted it in a newspaper story for all to see. Should our govt allow such? I say no! Setting people up to be targets of burglars (guns are a favorite theft item with those guys) and possible confrontations with gun control nut jobs is irresponsible. You should give the govt only the minimal info they need to govern about you. They have proven untrustworthy over and over again.

 

I don't disagree with the rest of your post, but where did this number come up? This is the first that I have heard of it.