just another sat night full of violence

great post, I am a little ashamed of myself for not thinking of it

http://www.awm.gov.au/encyclopedia/aborigines/indigenous.asp

 

And what has that got to do with them beating and raping their kids while on the goon?

The only way to move forward for "them" is to let go of the victim mentality, get off the goon, and get their lazy asses into jobs.

 

It looks like they did you a favour. That car is a wreck. I don't think anyone would feel safe in a deathtrap like that.

 

You are correct, but your attitude is detrimental to the cause.

 

That was so true! I colleague of mine - when she started dating her now husband he had to seek permission to date her by applying under the flora and fauna act

She can joke about it now but it HURT

 

He is correct, this attitude however is not the theme of his thread. We all know that they need jobs, that they need to get off the grog and drugs, their own community agrees totally.

For someone to GET A JOB, someone has to be willing to give them one. We are seeing now what some people call discrimination, but it is known as affirmative action also where opportunities are offered to those in society that we have traditionally ignored or treated as second class citizens, or even as is the case of the Australian Aboriginals as non-human. It also covers, woman and the disabled among others.

That poster has also replied when I said "Mistreated OVER THE PAST 200 years" that we should not hang on to what happened 200 years ago, he neglected to see that the PAST 200 years includes yesterday.

I have seen with my own eyes what good Affirmative Action does, but I would not be so arrogant to say it is not abused. Humans, black and white, red and yellow, pink and blue all will try to corrupt anything.

Look at churches, governments, the legal system, business, um I have to name everything here so I'll stop. This does not mean that the pros do not outweigh the cons.

Vilification will only make every one bitter and angry, this is not the way to go.

 

I have been arguing to abolish the department of Aboriginal Affairs for a long time, no argument from me there. The difference is, you believe they are getting 'more' than everyone else. When the reality is that they have been neglected, segregated and misstreated by successive governments throughout the history of modern Australia.

I agree, unfortunately it's not that simple. It's not a couple of lazy 'good for nothing' kids. It's a community wide culture of multi-generational welfare dependency. As though living in squalor, with a life expectancy 20 years less than the average Australia, is something we should be resentful of. They need help not spite.

You have it back-to-front. When you start treating them like civilized human beings is when things will start change.

Don't get me started on government welfare, or government subsidies.

What do you want to do, forcibly relocate people? Because that has worked -so- well in the past. Breaking up communities and families is -not- the way to encourage people back into the workforce. The government needs to CREATE jobs in and around these communities. The most important step is getting people back into the workforce. Once that has happened the rest will follow relatively easily imo.

 

No i believe its setting up a racist system.

If they truly WANT help first they need to help themselves a little.
It really IS that simple. If there is no work in the area you live in you move to an area where you can get a job. The only way to combat the problem is to.
A/ make welfare harder to get
B/ make welfare time limited.

We have been there and been doing that but as yet nothing has changed. Might be best to agree to dis agree on this one i think.

Why should the goverment create jobs in the middle of nowhere for a small section of the community? There are PLENTY of jobs all over aust that go unfilled. Moving the aboriginal community into work has be be the main focus BUT by pandering to them by spending a lot of money on failed work schemes that have in that past been rorted and scammed is NOT the way to do it.

 

So, if we gave you money would you employ 5 Aboriginal people or 5 White people??

To move many away from their traditional lands is the equivalent of you moving to a different country. The norms of the society are different, cultural expectations are different, inter family relationships are different and even the language is often different as many of our indigenous people still speak "language" as the primary language

 

I wouldnt confine myself to that...i would employ the BEST PERSON FOR THE JOB. And that is the way it should be done.

As MANY around the world have done before them.... To sit there and say that they shouldnt have to work until the work comes to them is ludicrous, its NOT the way the world works.
To put this into focus for you, i have moved my family all over aust for work and have only in the past 12 months settled to a town. But we are now thinking about going on the move again because the work opportunities are better elsewhere. I believe everyone should do the same. A man isnt a man unless he works for his family.

 

What's it like there in 1955?

 

So sitting down on welfare is doing the best you can for your family???

It might be an old fashioned ideal but it is one that is true..

 

Bludging always has been, and always will be, bludging.

 

Is the sky blue in your world?

 

I never mentioned welfare.

You're seeing things again.

 

You complain about it as though you believe they are getting -more- from government than everyone else. Racist, yes, but in the opposite direction.

Who says they do 'want help'? It's not really a question of them 'wanting' it. Children who have grow up in this cycle don't know any different. It's just the way things are. You can only recognize you need help if you have actually experienced the other side of things, which many of them haven't.

I agree with both of those suggestions, but I don't think they will solve the problem. Probably just increase the prison population and have more people living on the streets. Once you have been unemployed for a long time, your chances of getting work are statistically very small, true for all Australians. There are lots of unemployed people simply living on the streets, quite a few are outside the government system altogether anyway. Government has jobs/housing programs for unemployed/poor 'white people' too remember.

You said:

So you at least have not been doing that, and nor have many other people. You can disagree if you wish, but I don't agree with you at all on this, sorry.

Again, are you proposing forced resettlement? Because that is just never going to happen. It's also not necessarily going to solve anything, just relocate the problem. Moving is not enough, they actually need to be hired. And as demostrated here:

That is not necessarily going to happen. Given many will not have a good work history, or have any training, possible criminal records etc. The market is not going to solve this problem.

In the long term the solution is to dissemble these isolated and pointless rural communities and relocate people to active job centres, yes. But how do you get them into a position that they can actually afford, and are willing to move in the first place? They need jobs first, they need to re-enter into the national economy first. Then over generations, as is happening all over the world, they will gradually urbanize.

As to 'why' the government should do it. Because this 'small section of the community' has an average life expectancy 20 years lower than the rest of Australia. They live in conditions on par with some of the worst areas of third world Africa. It's completely unacceptable that this situation exists in our country. The market will not solve this problem, government must, and imo they must do it with job creation and education. The government employs a huge amount of people to do all sorts of things. I think they should focus their employment on disadvantaged people even if it costs more. The market can deal with the rest.