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So obsolete, i think it's safe to call them pussycats.

You know what the Iranian radar sees when an f-22 flies by?

Nothing at all.

 

The same radar that detected a "stealth" UAV like the Global Hawk, flying at an altitude they thought made the UAV safe? And that was an older model Iranian radar and air defense system, used for the 3 Khordad air defense missiles. Iran claims its Khordad 15 air defense system can identify any US warplane, including the F-22. I can't be sure as neither side has had any opportunity to put the issue to test, but maybe we will get a verified answer one of these days!


https://www.armyrecognition.com/jun...ew_khordad_15_air_defense_missile_system.html
Iran unveils new Khordad 15 air defense missile system
June 2019 Global Defense Security army news industry

 

Iran's most advanced Iran defense system, including compared to the Russian S-300 which Iran also has, and specifically developed to counter F-22 and F-35 stealth planes, is the Bavar 373. Before I post this video about the Bavar 373, here is something I do know. Several years ago, after the Russians refused to deliver the S-300 to Iran under US/Israeli pressure, Iran initiated international arbitration proceedings under the arbitration clause in its contract for the delivery of the systems. In the course of those proceedings, the Russians offered to deliver the S-300 to Iran to settle the matter. Iran initially refused the Russian offer; it said it wanted monetary damages paid for the delay and said it didn't need the S-300 anymore since its own Bavar 373 system was superior to it. The case was eventually settled and the S-300 was delivered to Iran, but Iran could have had the S-400 as well as part of the negotiations in the course of the S-300 arbitration. Iran wasn't interested.

 

It should be noted that Russia's tanks (and likely other equipment) is far outdated. Most of their tanks are T-70s. They started mounting hyperbarric dumbfire rockets on them which while devastating to 'soft' targets and infantry, don't have the penetration necessary to effect armor. Dont get me wrong, its a great (cheap) use for a tank that can't fight other tanks anymore, but then its not really a 'tank' anymore either...

 

As shown in the Israel-Hezbollah war, tanks are pretty much obsolete these days in any modern warfare. Unless Saddam is your top general, and decides to put T-72 tanks against American Abrams tanks in open desert tank warfare, where the T-72 can be taken out before it even sees the Abrams due to the superior weapons on the Abrams, what use are these tanks when the best of them can merely serve as a prison for soldiers whose tanks can now days be destroyed by modern anti-tank weapons?

To be sure, Iran has been developing its own modern tanks, which are pretty good. But tactically, I don't see much use for them in the most likely battles we are going to see. We aren't living in the 1940s anymore and those countries who are putting a lot of money on tanks, and developing planes for their "dog fight" capabilities, are simply fighting yesterdays wars not the ones they will face.

That said, I do like to advertise the products of Iran's defense industries. Mostly because I am proud of what Iran's youngsters are doing despite all the sanctions and efforts to make sure no one can sell anything to Iran.

https://www.armyrecognition.com/wea...dern_main_battle_tanks_mbts_in_the_world.html
Analysis: Top 15 most modern main battle tanks MBTs in the world

The video below shows the Karrar in detail, showing its maneuverability, its ability to go uphill and underwater, its armor, its armaments, etc.

 

judging from the reaction of most of europe in recent weeks i would say its very unlikely that you wil find many allies if you attack Iran

and its very unlikely that iran wil attack the west in general with F14 its stil a waste of money

 

Where did I attack anybody or say we should attack Iran? I just pointed out the logic of limiting the parts pool for a jet that our adversaries use. Sorry, I didn't mean to trigger him.

 

Yes, but that "logic" is what feeds into America's misguided policies viz a viz Iran for 40 years, not just on this issue, but more broadly. Instead of looking for trade and commerce with the West, which many of the so-called "hardliners" in Iran would fear more than of your sanctions (in part because it would then seriously undermine Iran's ability to develop its domestic industries, but also for obvious political reasons), the US has basically turned Iran into one of the most self-sufficient countries on earth. A country that has learned to do pretty much everything on its own. Some in Iran will probably wish to thank you for it, but there is no denying that there are huge costs for Iran in this whole exercise as well.

 

But if you turn on that radar thecwild weasles are gonna get you.

 

I think that will be hard to find. The Putin regime long ago forced the Russian media landscape to follow the Kremlin doctrine. Critical media has been banned and critical journalists were imprisoned or murdered.

 

These aren't fixed radar sites and have their own protections against what you mention. Besides being mobile, they can be turned on within 5 minutes and off, making them difficult to detect and take out, particularly when you haven't established air superiority. Even with air superiority, if there was relevant lesson from Desert Storm, it is how difficult it is to take mobile missile launchers.

 

Over 100,000 sorties the Iraqi air defences brought down 39 fixed wing aircraft.

 

I was referring to the difficulty of taking out mobile missile launchers, the ones launching Saddam's Scuds, and not about Iraqi air defenses.

 

So who would you launch them at?

 

You are confusing things. In the context of our discussion, I was just reminding you that mobile anti aircraft missile launchers using passive radar which can be turned off and on quickly aren't easy to take out. So, in this context, my comment was in response to how vulnerable Iran would be to US stealth aircraft such as the F-22 you mentioned. That said, in the broader context of a war in the region, Iran has indicated that Israel would be a target as their hand and footprints are seen all over the efforts that would start such a war in the first place. But it won't be just Israel; all of America's side kicks in the region, certainly the Saudis and the UAE, as well as every where else the US maintains bases, will find themselves under attack.

 

So you'd attack other countries for the Actions of America

Thanks.
That however is evil.

 

There's that paranoia again. You would do Stalin well.
No-one "threatens Russia."
Just ask the Ukrainians, Fins or the Poles for instance.

 

@Jeannette Chinese has many strength, like the fact they're important in the world economy. America economy is absolutly co dependant of chinese one and would collapse without chinese factories. Furthermore, this post is considering only traditionnal military strength. If a country wanted to attack any modern country, an army of hacker would be one of the most efficient thing because it could absolutly destabilize quickly all the economy of the country.
It is suspected that china has the ability to massively take off the USA by a gigantic informatic attack with a lot of parasite softwares already ready in the american computer system.

 

All China has to do is feed the MSM the anti American hatred they so dearly love.

 

I have difficulties with acronyms. What's MSM ?

For me the west is already destroyed. It's just a matter of years before it fall.

The easiest way to take down the USA and western europe is simply to cause or wait for a financial crisis. Considering the debt levels of the west, it would completely destroy it. Furthermore, both USA and western europe lost a big part of their industry and are more and more dependant of service econmy. Considering all the farming industry, it's absolutly dependant of oil and phosphate, so those countries aren't even autonomous from a food point of view.

 

MSM = main stream media

 

There were people saying the same thing after the Spanish Civil War and the same thing could easily have been said right after Stalingrad or after the invention of effective hand held AT weapons during WW2. In fact, people make absurd statements like this all the time based either on very limited scenarios or theoretical claims untested in actual combat.

Tanks remain one of the key elements in modern land warfare, which is why every significant land power spends so much on buying & developing the best tanks they can get. There are situations in which tanks are more or less effective depending on terrain, adversary and tactics. Ever was it thus.

Oh, and thanks for the Iranian propaganda. I like a good laugh, and talking up Iranian weapons systems is a great way to get one. You have to admire a nation that can talk up a patched together 40+ year old US plane as some sort of regional game changer. I eagerly await the annual announcement that an Iranian 'fleet' will sail to the US or one of those hilarious videos of Iranian 'stealth' aircraft. Keep up the good work.

 

We will see you gets the last laugh, but for now, and to be a bit more accurate than you have been accustomed to, the reports I posted (including about Iran's F-14s) were not from any Iranian sites. Or sites anyone would suspect are engaging in promoting "Iranian propaganda", unless you happen to be ignorant and only like to hear the things that confirm that ignorance.

 

The Iranian airforce including it's pussycats will be destroyed on the ground in a conflict with the US

 

Iran's defense and deterrence against the US isn't based on its air force. And as I have mentioned, Iran's missile arsenal in particular was developed to offset Iran's weakness in that regard. To give Iran a different mechanism to deliver its bombs (missiles and drones instead of manned aircraft) and to shoot down enemy planes (anti air missiles instead of air superiority planes). In this regard, given the wide range of conflicts which the US/Israel have been involved in, whether the Israel/Hezbollah war, the Syrian civil war and the fight against ISIS in Syria and Iraq, or elsewhere including more recently the shooting down of the US Global Hawk drone, many of Iran's systems have already been tested and proven their worth.

In terms of our air force, their main function (like the main function of the regular Iranian navy's major surface vessels, as opposed to our submarine force, small speed boats, anti ship missiles and the tactics of asymmetric warfare honed by the IRGC), is to deter and defend against regional adversaries and similar type of threats.