New research reveals truth about inequality: When the rich get richer, everyone loses

We didn't see income inequality suddenly start shooting up in 1981 when the Reagan trickle down revolution designed to make the richest richer happened, simply because 90% of Americans coincidentally decided to stop earning wealth at the exact same time.

 

Apparently, you are clueless as to what Lucas meant by this:

Nobel laureate Robert Lucas declared, “Of the tendencies that are harmful to sound economics, the most seductive, and in my opinion the most poisonous, is to focus on questions of distribution.”



He is slamming your entire economic view.

 

So he must be appalled at how so much of the nation's income and wealth have been redistributed to the 1% from the middle classes since the Reagan "trickle down" revolution.

Or is he just another 1% apologist excusing how the 1% now get 20+% of the nation's income and have about 40% of the nation's wealth, double from just 30 years ago?

 

Wealth is CREATED and EARNED, Comrade, not "distributed", until the GOVERNMENT LEFTISTS get involved.

 

It's created and earned by workers, as well, 1% apologist. Why has virtually all the gain from their wealth creation and earning been distributed to the 1% since the Reagan "trickle down" revolution?

 

As a conservative, I am going to tell you that you are flat out wrong and you’ve been sucked into the leftist propaganda that has floated out there for decades about what conservatives want. You realize the vast majority of people that invest are NOT wealthy. But just because conservatives are for cutting investment and capital gains taxes, and liberals aren’t, doesn’t mean conservatives are ONLY for cutting taxes for the wealthy. Conservatives want to include EVERYONE in paying lower taxes on EVERYTHING: income, investment/capital gains, gas, sales, etc… and doing away with oppressive taxes like higher taxes on alcohol and cigarettes (which affect mostly the middle class and poor). This conservative supports a flat tax where EVERYONE pays the same rate across the board.

15% is what is taken out of their paycheck. For most folks in this lower income bracket, after deductions are applied, pay nothing – they get it all back. Cutting that tax won’t help or hurt the rich. Each tax bracket pays 15%, 25%, 28%, 33%, 35%, and 39.6% respectively. In other words, the top 3 tax brackets pay more than twice the taxes as the lower bracket. You propose to lower the burden on those that pay half what the upper 3 pay, while hiking the upper three because they just don’t pay enough? Your think is disproportionate to the reality of who pays what taxes, AND in light of the overall shared tax burden the upper brackets pay.

Here’s a neat little fact you might want to consider… If you look at this chart, you’ll see that as you go down in the income brackets the total share of income crosses at the ‘fourth 20%’ bracket where the total share of income exceeds the total share of taxes paid; the converse is the case as you up the income brackets. Then you have to consider property taxes. The upper middle and wealth tend to own larger properties thus paying higher property taxes. They also spend more, thus paying more on sales taxes.

Yes, less government. It happened in '96 when the GOP took control of congress. Lower taxes for EVERYONE. Lower sales taxes and property taxes. Get rid of oppressive taxes (rain tax, routine car registrations, don’t force people that don’t have kids in public schools pay taxes for public schools – this would affect mostly kids in their teens and lower 20s and the elderly). Remove regulatory strangleholds on corporations that would allow them to expand and hire more. Reform public assistance programs - like welfare reform.

The only plan you folks from the left have is to continue raising taxes on the rich, while continuing to lower taxes for the poor so that eventually you get to a point where a certain minority percentage of the “tax payers” pays all of the taxes. THAT is what you folks on the left consider fair. Well, if you work you pay taxes. Those taxes should be as low as possible for EVERYONE. And as a fair exchange, government should be as small as necessary.

 

You're confusing marginal rates with effective rates and you're also only looking at federal income taxes. Here is what each bracket actually pays in all taxes combined, including state, local and federal property, sales, income, payroll, capital gains, etc.:



Total tax burden by income bracket

What that chart does not discuss is that the top 0.1% pay even less- often as low as 15%- because they derive most their income from investment income rather than wages.

 

You realize that the vast bulk of investments are owned by the very richest few.

Sure it does. They own the vast bulk of investment assets. Poor people aren't generally living off investment income. By definition.

When was the last time a Republican president tcut the payroll taxes that middle/poorer class working folk pay?

Cutting investment, income and estate taxes helps the very rich a lot but doesn't do much for a poor family that isn't paying much if any income tax, doesn't have investments, and doesn't have an estate.

No. Deductions do not offset FICA taxes. It's a regressive tax the poorest pay on every dollar they make.

Agreed. SS taxes are capped at about $110k in income. And it isn't levied on investment income. Meaning the super rich do not pay effectively FICA taxes as a percent of their income.

Yes, the richest pay more taxes, because they get more income.

What the chart shows is that when all the taxes are thrown together, we just about have an unjust "flat tax" system. The very thing billionaires like Steve Forbes wanted so badly. The poorest, who can least afford taxes, are almost paying the same proportion of tax to their income as the very richest.

It's been class warfare, and the rich have won.

First of all, even were that true, it certainly isn't something the Republicans have done that helped the middle/poorer folks over the richest. Quite the contrary.

Second, it is not true the Republicans "lowered taxes for everyone." You've swallowed the RW propaganda hook line and sinker.
How did the Repubican lower taxes for the tens of millions of working Americans who pay FICA taxes but not income taxes? They didn't. Those folks didn't get a dime in tax cuts from the Republicans.

Care to try again? Good look coming up with even one thing. The Republicans have championed or done over the past 30 years that would benefit the poorer or workers over the richest or businesses. So don't tell me their equivalent to the Democrats in that regard.

I've stated numerous things I would do to reverse trickle down, including reversing the tax raises on the middle/poorer and the tax cuts for the richest.

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It does show that the very richest 1% pay taxes in the same proportion to their income -- essentially a flat tax that the billionaires like Forbes wanted to shift the tax burden away from the richest to the middle classes.

It's been a class war by the rich against the middle/poorer classes, and they've won.

 

And this all happened under Obama's watch.

 

False. Obama didn't take office in 1981.

 

Obama's stimulus is the very same trickle down theory.

 

It did have the large tax cut component in it to placate conservatives.

 

Yes the wealthy in this country are getting ridiculously wealthy thanks to the fed and goverment programs to prop up and inflate the stock market. But ignoring that the poor in the US have been extremely neglectated. We need large redistributional programs, where politicians take their cut of course, before giving the poor money from those filthy rich who did nothing but exploit, pillage and plunder from society!!

Here are facts to prove my point!

This is what the rich in America have given us!! Most of the poor in this country live on less than $2 a day or $730 a month... and over 28% live on less than $1 a day.... Oh wait... no thats not true. The poor in this country live far far better than 56% of the worlds population. But that still doesn't mean that the rich have lifted any boats. If anything the poor in this country would be making $100k a year if it werent for those evil CEOs forcing them to work for minimum wage and spend $100 on fast food that makes them fat!

Give me a break, get some perspective on poverty and economics.

 

The 1% had been getting richer during Obama's watch he they not?
YES THEY HAVE.
Example the Clinton's were broke after leaving the White House. Now during Obama s administration they are stupid rich.
The 1% thanks Obama for making them richer.

 

and the vast majority of conservatives voted against it... if this was the case why did they put it in there? Is it because that econimist recongnize the value of tax cuts? That they do actually do something?

 

Oh yes, the 1% are still getting more and more of the nation's income and wealth. Trickle down is still very much in effect. The conservatives have done everything in their power to ensure that is so.

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RW 1% apologist propaganda has thoroughly permeated politics.

 

What has Obama done to change that beside a few words said every six months or so about it? Talk talk talk is all
He has done while doing nothing for the poor and middle class beside raise their taxes. The whole time giving the unions tax breaks for helping him push the obamacare lies upon American people. Hello governmental rewards given to those that donate. What a lying turd.

 

He passed the stimulus that allowed millions of people keep their jobs. He gave the middle class the first every FICA tax cut, granted that it was only temporary. He fought to extend unemployment and Govt assistance to people who were in terrible straights because of the recessions that Republicans wanted to cut off. He fought to provide health care to millions who otherwise wouldn't have it.

Just a few things off the top of my head.

He hasn't done nothing, I gave you a few items.

Fact is, of course, since the Republicans took the house in 2011 there's very little he could do. He's not dictator. He's had the Republican Tea Party who claims to be for Americans when they do everything they can to undermine the economy. What a bunch of lying turds.

 

Too bad its not as strong as the democrat Propaganda about being for the poor people.

 

I agree that money permeates politics way to much at every level.

But to pretend the Democrats just like the Republicans in regards to the poor and working people is a giant false equivalency.

 

And when the stimulus ran out? Job loss. So borrow from the rest to extend the jobs of a few for a couple of months, thats success to you? Someone needs to learn cost benefit analysis.

Fica Taxes given to us by Democrats, tax cuts on it just mean less benefits in the the future. God giveth and god taketh away!

Take from some give to another, there has to be limits to assistance or it changes from assistance to sustenance.

Obamacare? YOu mean he fought to provide insurance not healthcare. If he wanted healthcare his law wouldnt have done things like ban Doctors from starting their own clinics. Ohh well, meddling to give benefits to the few over the many. A real hallmark of this joke of a leader. Hes finally surpassed Bush as worst president ever in my mind.But hey its perception over reality!

Rethink

A few items that are all in all sad attempts and honestly in most cases more damning than helping.

Yes ohh yes, if it werent for the Republicans everything Obama wants would have been done and it all would be Rainbows, kittens and prosperity. Hes A #1 awesome, the bestest ever. The boogie men took him down.

 

Not when one looks at history, war against poverty, war against drugs, war against terror. All accepted and pushed by both parties, all wars with no results and wasted money. But Hey Democrats frequently push to take a little bit of money from those with it, to give to those without, they must be A OK! Or perhaps they realize those without make up a bigger voting block, so if they pander to them they can get their never-ending devotion, and then when they get power they do the same thing Republicans do to maintain power, give favors to whoever gives the largest campaign contributions. The same rich guys who pay for their anti rich propaganda. Hey if you want to believe Democrats in 100% control will fix all our ills go ahead, I don't begrudge people believing in god.

 

One area that has gotten richer in the past few years is Washington DC. How about we take that wealth and redistribute it back where it came from: taxpayers.

 

That is inaccurate. By the time the stimulus ran out the economy was creating jobs.

Where we continued to have job loss is in the state and federal governments thanks to the Republicans' austerity.

They don't mean that at all. Remove the SS income cap and investment income exception that shields the very rich from paying it. Pay SS benefits out of general revenue.

So it helped the middle class. What is your point? Republicans have done more? They voted against it. Didn't help the rich. Until they were shamed into it.

It's helped millions of middle class folks who didn't have insurance get it. What's your point? That the Republicans have done more?
Ohh well, meddling to give benefits to the few over the many. A real hallmark of this joke of a leader. Hes finally surpassed Bush as worst president ever in my mind.But hey its perception over reality!

No need

To the contrary. So tell us, name one thing the Republicans have done to help the poor or middle class or workers over the 1% or business in the last 30 years.

Why do you think Republican caused uncertainty and austerity would help the economy?

It's all part of the plan:

Step 1: Obstruct and use control of the House to (*)(*)(*)(*) up the economy. E.g. Create as much uncertainty as possible by threatening to cause the US to shut down the government, default on its obligations, and wreck the economy. Add 700,000+ people to the unemployment lines by eliminating government jobs. Block every single proposal by the President to create jobs. Force austerity cuts in Govt spending to prevent or limit economic growth.


Step 2: Blaaaaame Obaaaaaamaaaaaa and count on the sheeple being ignorant and misinformed or simply blaming whoever is president.



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Write your Republican Tea Party rep sand tell them to raise taxes on the rich. That'll show those folks in DC.

 

Complete nonsense. Everything the Republicans have done over the past 30 years has been about "tickle down" and making the rich richer, and often at the expense of the poorer and middle class and workers. Trying to equate them with Democrats is rank political spin.

I challenge you to name one thing the Republicans have done over the past 30 years for the benefit of the middle/lower classes or workers over the rich and business.