Reforming Gun Laws

I'm very much a supporter of gun rights, but I believe there are some needed reforms in our system that would reduce criminal activity. One of the areas needing reform is mentioned below.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/11/14/opinion/webster-giffords-guns/index.html?hpt=hp_c3

Under federal law and most states' law, only individuals who attempt to purchase firearms from licensed gun dealers must present a government-issued ID, sign a form stating that they do not fit any of the firearm prohibition categories and pass a criminal background check. But criminals and gun traffickers are given an easy alternative. They can simply purchase firearms from private sellers who do not require any of these checks.

It gets even more interesting from there...

Closing this absurd loophole would not be political suicide for politicians who fear losing the support of gun owners. A recent survey found that more than 80% of gun owners and 74% of NRA members want this loophole fixed.

So, instead of focusing on automatic weapon bans or limits on clip sizes, it looks like one of the better ideas for gun reform is a relatively simple one. Regulate private sales more.

There's not much point to having so many restrictions in place at the licensed level if private sellers are just going to get around them. Regulating private sales more wouldn't end the illegal gun trade, but it would certainly make non-licensed individuals think twice before selling their weapons.

 

Why do you believe this would reduce illegal and criminal activity? Just curious because all of my clients bought their guns black market.

 

"A government-issued ID"??? Sounds racist!

 

It would create an unrealistic burden on private sales. It's one thing to check an ID, but if I were to sell a gun I would have to do a background check? It would be reasonable, from the standpoint of a gun-owner, if the government were to provide the service for free.

 

The OP should list some stats that show how doing this would reduce crime.

How many crimes are committed by people who use this loophole?

Not enough information here to make an informed decision.

 

"...individuals who attempt to purchase firearms from licensed gun dealers must present a government-issued ID..."


Taxcutter asks:
And what about when the government makes it difficult to get these IDs?


"... pass a criminal background check..."

Taxcutter says;
This would make it nearly impossible for an individual to ever sell a gun. A gun is just an artifact. Forcing people to get expensive criminal background check makes it a money-losing proposition to sell a gun you no long have a need for. Would they require you to be buried with that gun?

This whole think evinces a much greater trust of government than the US government has currently earned.

 

When you say "black market", are you talking illegal guns altogether?

I'm saying this reform makes sense because a large portion of guns used in crimes aren't even totally illegal in the technical sense. A lot of people sell weapons they legitimately bought from a dealer. Sometimes, this allows people with criminal intentions to get a weapon.

When it comes to illegal gun trafficking, obviously, regulations aren't going to have much effect. Regulations would have an effect on non-licensed individuals that aren't criminals but are interested in selling their weapons.

I guess what I'm saying is that criminals don't have to seek out illegal gun traffickers to get a weapon currently. All they have to do is buy a weapon from an individual. I'd prefer to limit their options more. It takes more effort for a criminal to seek out an illegal gun trafficker than to just go to a pawn shop.

 

Sure, I'd support making the check free. It would surely be worth the return on investment.

 

How many exactly.

I think you are just making this up.

 

"A recent survey found that more than 80% of gun owners and 74% of NRA members want this loophole fixed."

A) I don't believe that for a second

B) It isn't a "loophole". Private citizens have always had the right to sell their firearms to other private citizens.

 

http://www.jhsph.edu/research/cente...search/publications/WhitePaper102512_CGPR.pdf

Start on page 6. It talks about how a lot of criminals end up getting guns from both dealers and private sellers.

Primary sources are referenced on page 15 (sources 38 through 42 in particular).

 

A stolen gun is cheaper (whether stolen firsthand or bought secondhand), easier to attain, and harder to trace than a legal firearm. That's why criminals usually go that route.

Also, you're talking about two different things. A pawn shop selling guns has a federal license to do so and someone purchasing a gun there has to undergo a background check.

 

Sorry but none of those sources list the number of guns obtained in this way. They deal with other factors in relation to private selling, no hard statistics.

You have no idea if we are talking about 10 guns or 1 million.

 

Just like drugs are bought from individuals, people who buy guns to use in a robbery won't be going to someone who asks for ID.

 

If I sell a car, do I need to prove the buyer has a valid license?

 

Well, that would be why getting private sellers to do background checks would force more criminals to go the completely illegal route.

 

No, but people also don't usually buy a car to kill someone or rob someone.

I'm not saying most gun purchasers do either, but handling guns is different from handling cars or even drugs.

 

Which makes it more difficult for cops to trace the gun...

 

That depends on the gun. It is true that plenty of generic handguns can be bought for cheaper illegally than legally, but in general, contraband items cost a lot more on the black market than they would in legitimate markets.

For example, legalizing pot would dramatically reduce the street value of it.

 

Well, if we went the full libertarian route, and removed all gun laws altogether, I guess they'd probably be hard to trace too.

 

The whole idea just has too many moving parts that Eric Holder (or similar future villain) could use to stop private gun sales.

 

They already are. All you are doing is putting the onus on the law abiding people to do more paperwork. You want to end crime? Don't look at guns, look at the causes of crime. I realize that sick people feel a little bit better with nasal spray and cough drops, but it doesn't cure pneumonia.

Good intentioned people come up with these laws thinking they are helping and it does not help because they think of how THEY would do something. Criminals know what they are up against. They are smart. They know how to go below the radar. They will get around this the way that someone who wants heroin gets heroin.

 

The op makes the entirely unwarranted assumption that gun control equals crime control.

 

Your pot analogy doesn't hold unless we're talking about pilfered weed. Stolen goods generally sell for less than retail on the street. That holds true for firearms as well.

 

Illegal contraband costs more sure, but guns are a tool in crime. It's an investment in tools, an investment in "not getting caught".