Religion is Silly Fairy Tales

Not everyone that had the upbringing you did.

 

No one has the same upbringing. But the majority of those who were my classmates in the religious school I attended stuck with their indoctrination.

 

Interesting that's the opposite of what I would think would happen.

 

thats the beauty about religion, unlike law, you can choose which indoctrination you like best, the big bang fantasy or God.

 

But there is no indoctrination in Christia

 

depends, if they are from the same religion and that is THEIR accepted practice who am I or you to play budinski?

That why you shouldnt be claiming its a fairy tale in the first place, because its just your opinion that its a fairy tale, you cannot assure anyone that if you teach that to your kids that in fact you are not teaching them a fairy tale.

Just look into philosophy and religion here, plenty do it all the time, you didnt bother to prove it, you simply accept it without proof.

all the time. not able to prove a negative is a myth.

childrens shows, anything on tv their friends, its all indoctrination.

but its done, there are millions of beleivers world wide only researchers know otherwise, such is most religions.

you have the right to believe anything you want you do not have a right to any religion you want.

your process is reversed

they can and are just as well narcissistic fringe liberals or conservatives teaching their kids some seriously wacked out approaches to life. Seen it all too often with my own t2 eyes.

Yep you get to practice what you believe in.

they are allowed to believe whatever they want, the guv allows you to pray.

not true for religion, guv religion trumps your religion, bigamy law and baking gay wedding cakes come to mind

It should punish any one who damages others outside their own personal religious community not do as they do today by ESTABLISHING and setting religious standards.

 

anything 'learned' from another is indoctrination

 

We shouldn't need antibiotics, either .. but we do.

Humans do best (as in most harmoniously) when there is external pressure to conform and behave. We do worst when we imagine ourselves sufficiently evolved to need no guide. That creates a society of narcissists, all working at cross purposes.

I'm an atheist, but fully accept that 'conforming pressures' are a survival enhancer. While most of this pressure comes from the pragmatics of a given society's material conditions, some does still come from religion.

 

But in Christianity is it learned, or does the influence come from the Holy Spirit? The prophets in the OT were Saints, so they were definitely Christian, yet Jesus hadn't come yet.

 

there is no way for me to answer that question. Im into the material based arguments.

 

Our Founding Fathers wrote before the advent of the French revolution and had no idea of what the outcome would be. I know Catherine the Great corresponded with Voltaire and others, but with the horrors of the French revolution she forbade any of their books into Russia. Little did she know then that Russia would suffer even more so.

Half the people killed in the terror were priests, which didn't surprise me since Rousseau said he had converted to Catholicism and then became shocked when he heard the priests talking about their mistresses, so that he became Protestant again.

The great sin of the Catholic Church was its imposition of celibacy on priests solely for monetary gain. They didn't want the money to go to the priests family but rather to Rome - so the Church turned a blind eye to the sins of the clergy - something that destroyed the Church in France. Afterwards there were no more priests. They were all killed.

 

didn't say the founders knew what the outcome would be .. said that the ideas were around prior to the French revolution .. the enlightenment thinkers .. Rousseau being one of them - and his ideas on the Social Contract.

Agree that Celibacy was one of the many sins of the Catholic Church.

 

I agree. Indoctrination carries with it an element of deceit which leads astray or to a form of imprisonment. But Christianity carries the element of charity, light and truth, which frees one from the imprisonment of the worlds indoctrination and ugly spirit. Not to mention the promised salvation and rescue from the imprisonment of death and the sufferings of guilt, which is Christianity's mainstay. To say then that Christianity is the equivalent of indoctrination, is to say that our Heavenly Father and Satan are equal by virtue of holding an interest in us in common, or that our freedom is like their prison. But if it is, then there is none so sweet, nor jailer so kind as to give the bread and water of life and the keys to come and go at ones leisure.

 

Don't get me wrong on celibacy since I belong to a monastic Church and have the highest respect for them. For someone to be spiritualized on earth though, like our glorified saints, they have to be free of all carnal desires. It's not possible though unless a person is an ascetic, cloistered or lives in a very devout society.

The sin of the Catholic Church in France at the time, or at least in my mind, is that they knew these priests were sexually active and instead of making allowances for them and allowing them to marry, the Church turned a blind eye.

 

The history of the Papacy is one of despotic nepotism. These were not men of God . these were political figures in positions of high power. When one fellow got in all his relatives filled the rungs of power underneath. The Popes themselves -- when not scoping out the nunnery for fresh meat .. not torturing, persecuting and stealing from people - they were diddling young boys..

Visited Portugal just prior to the Pandemic . .. you have been to these churches im sure - the high families represented by some shrine - went to the square where the heritics were burned ..

Note that the Eastern Orthodox were not doing these things - despite what big D might think.

 

And yet the Catholic Church had its great Saints like Saint Francis, and its immense charities - which I think out does all of its faults as a whole. Also would the humane laws of Christianity, which have become the foundation of almost all the countries in the world, have been able to spread without the institution of the Catholic Church?

 

It does not outdo its faults .. think about that statement .. its faults are its faults .. and no amount of good works will change the evils done in the name of our lord .. no need to apologize for atrocity to be a follower of Christ.

 

Interesting that you left out the word "fantasy" after "God". The major difference is that unlike "God", the "big bang" is not an "indoctrination" that has been and is being peddled over thousands of years. Even in scientific circles, it is a just a disputed theory that is an alternative to the static Universe theory. No one prays to it and there are no elaborate expensive houses of worship built around it and no one lives their lives in accordance to that theory and best of all, no one is threatened, forced or ridiculed to believe the theory. You are not making a case for a scientific theory being an "indoctrination". Apples and oranges.

It sounds like you're saying you're ok with religions that include committing human rights atrocities based on whatever beliefs they are indoctrinated with. That you have a laissez-faire mentality with such cults.

When a belief has no scientific basis, it is either a theory or a fairy tale or both. There is a huge difference. So I can easily claim a belief that has no scientific basis can merely be a fairy tale.

Yes and no. Everything is a learning experience but religion is formally taught and often enforced on children with a specific purpose. Children's shows and friends are not formally taught nor enforced.

The former is true, the latter is not. You do have the absolute right to follow any religion (assuming you're in a relatively free society) or even invent your own if there are enough gullible followers.

 

There are more than a million rapes, assaults, murders, and robberies in the US every year, with over forty million 911 calls in tow. And essentially none of this has a whit to do with Christianity. Just good old fashioned godlessness. This is happening right here and now, day and night, year in and out. And what are Christians doing? They're working, taking care of their families, obeying the secular laws, going to Church, praying, and trying to get along in the world.

 

yet people build their whole lives around unproven physics fantasies et al.
I lost count how many people actually believe in multiple universes, time travel, warped space and other physics and cosmological nonsense as a genuine physical reality. That is as much a religion and ranks right up there with the best fantasy you can hang on a God based religion.

I left it out because I can prove big bang is a fantasy, and I cant prove God is a fantasy and frankly in the final analysis neither can you or anyone else. Hence I am agnostic for that very reason. I dont buy into either side of that equation.

No 'deity' is required for a religion!

Atheist Sunday Assembly


The assembly at Conway Hall on 19 October 2014
Legal status Charity: No. 1162995[1]
Headquarters London
Location

• UK, Australia, Germany, Ireland, Nertherlands, New Zealand, United States

Website www.sundayassembly.com

If you are up to the challenge, by all means join 'The False Gods of Physics' thread and lets talk about it in more detail.

oh yeah okay, you're talking about the war against Muslims and the false flags used to kill them, those atrocities?

or do you mean the stalinist purges?

How about Waco that was only what less than 200 people massacred by religious fanatics?

it's all part of the religion that took out JFK, Martin Luther King and other atrocious nasty do-gooders throughout history!

The religion of 'cant have any damnable do-gooders runnin around' ****ing up the golden cow when thars mo-money to be milked!

Money talks, the rest walk, or are converted to fertilizer.

Last I heard no 'deity based' religion was not responsible for stalin's purges, JFK, Lincoln, MLK, holohoax, Tungaluska, Mao, can you show otherwise?

If you can then I can certainly understand why you would blame 'deity based' religions and give the modern day 'all hail the money...mo fo me less fo you' religion that created those atrocities get out of jail free and pass go coupons.

Can you?

 

Jesus didn't exist until about 1631 AD.

 

When I was a child my parents shipped me off to religious school to receive my indoctrination. So they had me read this book called the Old Testament and the teacher went into elaborate detail supporting the incredible stories I was supposed to take as truth. How some magical all powerful guy created the Universe and everything in it in 6 days. And on the 7th day this all powerful guy rested because as all powerful as he (not she) was, he needed to rest. Because everyone knows creating the Universe is a friggin exhausting job for anyone who has tried to do that. But children don't often question a story like that when an adult is telling it and seems quite serious about it. And that was just the first few pages of that book I was asked to study. There were many more stories in that book where most of them centered around this guy. Of course as my brain matured and I went through my growth learning experiences, the stories in that book started making less and less sense obviously. The problem was that in the society I grew up in people around me lived their lives as if these stories were all true.

That's true but that is not at all like religion because no one is forced to believe "unproven physics fantasies" under various threat, no churches are built around these, no one prays to it and there are no other rituals to follow.

See above, you are trying to conflate religion with scientific or other theory.

I doubt it's true but if you can prove the Big Bang theory is a "fantasy", all you're doing is eliminating one possible scientific theory as to the origin of the Universe. No one I know of can prove the origin of the Universe and proving "God" is a fantasy is an exercise in futility. I'm not into proving anything is a fantasy I just accept that certain things are silly man made inventions unless some expert I feel is trustworthy can realistically and scientifically prove they are real and it can be backed via the scientific method (e.g. Dr. Hulsey's proof that the NIST hypothesis of the "collapse" of WTC7 caused by thermal expansion due to fire alone is impossible).

True but all religions are based on groups of people blindly accepting stories on faith (i.e indoctrination). For example, the Heaven's Gate cult:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...cult-committed-mass-suicide-15-years-ago.html

 

So to follow up, the above religion had deadly consequences.

 

Religion is a little more complicated then believing in fairy tales. It serves multiple functions that people need or it would not have persisted. It seems much more than superficial crowd control.

 

Less so anyway. And it took decades for secularists to achieve, and the fight continues. There are plenty who still long for Christian theocracy. We have done considerably better here than they have in some other places in the world, but we must remain vigilant. It isn't like Christianity isn't capable of inspiring similar attrocity as Islam is, as we have seen in history.