Should / can Labor distance itself from unions?

The political axe fell on Gillard's head for the constant lies she kept telling the Australian people. She's such a pathological liar, even to this day, she refuses to admit that she lied. There is no escaping the truth, she told the people of Australian on national TV, that there would be no carbon tax under a government she led. When she got elected with the help of the Greens vote, she was forced to re-pay that debt back to the Greens by intruding a carbon tax, which they wanted, as part of the deal for giving her the Prime Ministership. She lied to the people by introducing a carbon tax. In essence, she sold her soul to the Greens, and sold out the people of Australia just to become the first female Australian PM. Did you also agree that it was a good idea for Gillard to give the UN 10% revenue from the Australian carbon tax - an estimated $10billion per year? Don't you think that was overly generous, considering the financial and social problems that is facing Australia right now? Was that really HER money to donate to the UN, or it the Australian tax payers money? What's the term for an employee who spends his employers money without the employers knowledge or permission? Theft is it not?

 

Fraud

But let us not forget the stabbing of Rudd… Morning TV she backed him 100% by 5pm she had stabbed him in the back and accept all the praise on public media… Another lie of course.

Ah, we could recount the lies all day long but she is gone now and this new one thinks it is OK to continue in the same… Telling the WA voters he would support the axing of the carbon tax then opposing it in Canberra the same week… About time the ALP started to be more honest with the public…

 

It just gets up my nose how seemingly smart people like Catter, can be so easily hoodwinked by obvious liars like Gillard are her crew of bandits. Gillard is a 'bald-faced' liar, and how anyone can say she did good is beyond me, when every word out of her slimy mouth was a lie. Politicians acting honestly would be like Satan kissing the crucifix.

 

Most people have tendencies, either more left or more right. Forget those for a moment.
Do you really believe that there is a difference in the lies of Gillard to those of Abbotts?
Once you become a politician, the bending of truth will remain the top subject of your life.......
Regards

 

I remember to well what Gillard said: "there will be no carbon tax under a government I lead." That was just one of her numerous lies.

I also remember to well what Abbott said: " don't trust anything I say unless its written down on paper."

I also remember the adage my father drummed into us when I was young: "you always know what a thief is, but a liar can hang you."

When someone tell me a lie more than twice (everyone is entitled to a second chance in my book) I never trust that person again, or have anything to do with them.

 

The difference is SHE GOT CAUGHT. At the moment it appears the inept ability of the ALP at this time has not changed. Even this latest opposition is the same. I have maintained Abbott has lied in the past and will do in the future, YOU just don't know what about.

I don't believe when it comes to policy they should not lie along with many other things. However, as demonstrated within these forums the normal is that if your found to be lacking or wrong never admit your wrong just run and hide and pretend nothing has changed. That seems to be the political way in Australia and the people appear to want to remain ignorant of it. Political leanings should never accept lies, misleading or simple fabrication. The ALP at this present time seem more intent at remaining as the inept party. Abbott at the moment appears (by rhetoric) to be more competent but again their first budget is due in a couple weeks. Abbott's party appear to want to address the problems of future economic problems which are increased by bad management of the last 6 years. YET TO BE SEEN.

 

Abbotts not caught in lying? Hello, is someone home?

And so what?
Labor has spent too much, agreed, but they didn't overspent, as they kept us out of recession.
23% debt of GDP is chicken(*)(*)(*)(*), in an international context.

The negativists of Libs always promise, but since in office our debt went up by how much? Or is that also Labors fault?
There are now more big players closing their factories under Libs then ever before. Also Labors fault?

We need to become aware, that the mining dollars just don't roll in as before, Howard was only a lucky bastard....

Your constant blaming of Labor doesn't change some facts. I wish however they would get a new drift, slightly less involved with the Unions.
If not, the Greens will become the major party one day, and to me I like it balanced, with a slightly greenish flavor....

Regards

 

You asked the difference... did something happen between the first ignorant sentence and the second??? You could not find the lie you want to claim???

Um, are you drunk??? Perhaps the drugs are wearing off??? Labor has spent too much but didn't overspend??? REALLY, how can that be??? If they spend TOO MUCH they overspent...

23% debt to GDP NOW, what was it in 2011 17%??? Perhaps you have not noticed, manufacturing is leaving Australia. Do you really need the economy to crash to see there is a problem???

YES, because Australia is committed to the ALP budget which had blown out and relied on such large borrowing. Fact is by ALP government figures budget deficit would have reached 64Billion, at present the budget deficit is now expect to reach 56Billion. Now I don’t know about you but that is actually LESS than what was expected under the ALP watch…

Another thing, while the ALP was pulling funding for promised grants and other funding measures to try and reduce the budget blow out, how do you consider the debt should have gone???

Again YES, as with your problem of working out just how the mining boom happened, these things do not happen overnight. People like you simply want to throw more money at these industries to stay open to make your party preference look good. BUT when the industries themselves state they are leaving due to unsustainable policies of government, it is not something simply born from six months of government. It actually shows lack of intention to address the issues of the manufacturing sector of government.

BUT what are the big manufacturing factories closing under the Coalition than the ALP??? If you talk cars, Mitsubishi and Ford under the ALP… Holden and Toyota under the coalition… Catapillar under ALP…

Howard was not luck at all. This is exactly why you show you really don’t know how things work. Keating is the architect of Growth in the mining sector by floating the dollar and promoting sales to China as he was aware that the major player in Australian mining JAPAN was going to cheaper sellers. Howard, continued the same which was deftly manipulated by introduction of policy to arrive at the best time for his political career. No luck about it.

Who else should we blame??? The poor??? The ALP has been in government for six years, their policy to garnish as much money from the tax pay and NOT address detrimental issues to Australian economy IS their fault. Don’t complain when the rhetoric coming from Canberra and the building of confidence around the world in Australia since they were unceremoniously kicked from office has been incredible.

Australians considered the ALP to be deceitful along with the rest of the world. Fact is while you and a few others have tried very hard to smear Abbott internationally when the world is in flux at the moment and Abbott has gained far more respect than either previous prime ministers. Who were they??? That’s right Gillard and Rudd…

Greens have run their course. They had power to make real change and they squandered that time because they simply don’t have reasonable policy or understanding of how policy works.

Me, I have hopes for Palmer but disappointment is looking more the course there. One thing Palmer has shown is that NEW parties are not out of the question. My problem is that now they want change the electoral process which will make it more difficult to elect not just new parties but independents. Which again is a green push, showing how badly they need to remain in the position they are…

 

Um, are you drunk??? Perhaps the drugs are wearing off??? As with your problem of working out just how the mining boom happened, these things do not happen overnight

Yes Garry,
a boom is starting somewhere in time, and when it comes to our mining, it undoubtedly reached its peak under J.Howard. No one on the planet would put that in question, except for Garry.....

As you are a world champion in taking things out of context (see above, to honor you), we would have accumulated debt under a Liberals government during the WFC as well.

May be not as high, I agree, but we would have. Please take off your pink glasses you are wearing, they must have been a gift from your Liberal Party....

Regards

 

And what's the Greens logical agenda, we open our doors and accept 100,000 refuges per year, but they cannot tell us where we are going to get the money to build the additional 100,000 homes per year, or the 1,000,000 home required for people already on public housing lists + building homes for the estimated 300,000 homeless. Where are the Greens suggesting we get the money to build 1.3million properties, and where are they going to be built? Where are we going to get the money to support all the new infrastructure like schools, health, transport and employment for these additional 100,000 refugees, when tens of thousands of Australians are losing THEIR jobs every year. Ok, we tax the rich mining companies for a few years, until they realise they can go to another country and pay less tax. Now the mining companies have all left Australia for greener pastures, where are the Greens going to get the money to fund all the social issues? Do the Greens really think a mining company will stay in Australia paying extorted taxes, when they can go to another country and pay less?

The Greens are a bloody joke when it comes to business logic, and if left up to them, they would have humanity revert back to the stone-age.

FFS, why do you that mongrel lot GMH-Holden has abandoned Australia for manufacturing in Malaysia for - cheaper taxes and cheaper wages, means more profit for their CEO's and share holders.

 

Hmmm,
many many years back I heard a US custom officer saying, that the people in his country believe, that all human beings living somewhere else would love to live in the US, and nowhere else.

When reading your lines, I appears they bear the same logic. Why not state, that 7.5 billion will arrive in boats one day....

We are a nation of immigrants, and to me anyone is welcome, who dares to hop on one of those stricken boats.

We have so many people in this country, who take advantage of our social system, and carry a very white skin.....

It should be clear by now that the scare mongering tactics of Abbott's and his pals were successful.

regards

 

You have failed miserably to answer the basic question. If we cannot afford to build low income homes for 1.3 million Australians that are already here living in Australia - then how the hell do YOU & the Greens propose we find the money to build an additional 100,000 every year for refugees, on top of the 1.3 million already needed? How do we find the extra money to support all the additional social services like schools, medical, transport and new jobs for the additional 100,000 refugees per year?

When you & the Greens have answered these question logically, then I might start taking you both a little more seriously, but until then, you both come across as zombie do-gooders thinking we live in Utopia.

 

I don't think it would be too much fun for the 300,000 Australian homeless living on the streets or in cardboard boxes on these cold nights without homes or permanent shelter, but if you think its fair and reasonable we bring over refugees and support them first over these homeless Aussies, then your heart and empathy must be in the right place -right?

 

Re the boat people issue, I can`t see any relevance in the fact that many Australians came here in boats. To suggest that this somehow absolves us of our responsibilities, nullifies our sovereign right as a Nation, that since our forebears came here by sea, for ever more it`s OK for anyone to come here on a boat, is on the mindless side of ludicrous. We don`t see mention of the millions stuck in refugee camps, who are awaiting for a chance of resettlement, and who are shoved aside by queue jumpers. Please resist the temptation to say "there is no queue, we don`t see people standing in line, like at a movie theatre", this is one of the dumbest arguments for open season people smuggling, that I`ve ever seen.

It doesn`t take much knowledge of the world, to spontaneously recognise the potential for expansion of the people smuggling "industry". All we need to do, is to learn take the hint from the results of the failed policies of the Rudd / Gillard governments, to immediately recognise that the boats have to be stopped.

What annual number of boat people arrivals would you find acceptable?

 

Charity begins at home. People smuggler supporters never consider the consequences of their policies. They never instigate discussion of issues such as, the number of unskilled people that we have here, who can`t find work.

I`m convinced that these agendas are driven by emotional self gratification, not mature logic. We constantly see childlike arguments, shallow mined dogma, in attempts to justify feelgood "policies". Meanwhile, the adults have to pick up the load, make informed decisions on ALL of the available information. Not just making emotional decisions, based on selectively censored information.

 

I trust the boat arrivals to work their ass off, and not to claim welfare. That's the majority of course. Question answered.....
AT LEAST THE GREENS HAVE SOME PLANS, IN STARK CONTRAST TO OUR GOVERNMENT.....

 

What annual number of boat people arrivals would you find acceptable?

Hmmm,
as many as arrive from war torn countries.....

The rest of your lines are not worth commenting, as it is just the usual Liberal/National scribble.

Regards

 

No, you're wrong, and your trust is misplaced. The ALP release a report stating: that over 85% of boat refugee/asylum seeker that arrived in Australia were still on some form of welfare benefit up to 5 years, and still counting.

Again you have not answered the question, and I believe the idiotic Greens would not be able to answer it either. Where is all the money coming from Catter? Australia does not have enough money to build the 1.3 million homes for our own low income individuals, but you want to bring over an additional 100,000 refugees.

 

If we have 300,000 homeless Australians living under bridges, park benches and cardboard boxes, how the hell can YOU morally and ethically justify leaving them in those horrific conditions in favour of refugees, who have a better standard of living in refugee camps than Australia's homeless? Shame on you!!

 

1.3million homes?????????????????????????

Anyway, refugees from war torn countries are welcome, the ones who want to make a better life should follow proper immigration process. That's my point of view, if you don't like it, bad luck.....

Regards

 

We are quite often engaged in fixing houses, left by state tenants (centrelink).
Please don't ask for details about what we see and have to fix, it can be very revolting at times.
And by the way, whites, not blacks.
I have to admit, although not all people are the same, that I rather care for war refugees at this point in time....
Regards

 

We have an estimated 1million low income Australians and Australian families on public housing list throughout Australia, desperately wanting for accommodation. Some for these people have been of waiting lists for years through no fault of their own. These Australian people are forced to live in tents, cars, garages and other destitute places just to survive, because we don't have the money to build them permanent accommodation. How is bringing over an additional 100,000 refugees, who will compete for housing resources going to effect this situation. It will put massive pressure on a public housing system that already cannot house its low income people or its homeless people. Yes, we can take refugees, but we have to be able to provide homes for our own low income people, and homeless people first. When we have accomplished that, then we can bring over the refugees.

 

We will never accomplish that, and we both know that. People from war zones are a million times worse off.

 

In the last 15 years the divide between rich and poor was allowed to expand. Divide the lower socio economic from the middle and then slowly create a chasm between the middle class and higher class is the order of the day for this government led by Abbott. Australia needs to demand it's socialist roots back to ensure we live in a relatively cohesive society filled with respect and value for human life. I certainly don't want to continue to play this childish game of the extreme right, which is typified by ......well he doesn't pull his weight, why should I do that, attitude! I did this, so I should demand more respect!

Howard now abbott are going to destroy our society by deception in favour of upper class rule and supremacy. The liberal party need a new leader with a new ideaolgy different from the Howard, now abbott led government. The liberal party need to ensure the balance is brought back for the sake of the country.. What has worked for many generations should not be changed because one leader feels the need to think more highly of himself. If Abbott gets back in at the next election we as a nation are f@#ked.....I've never been so confident of a particular future occurrence.

 

You haven`t thought this out at all, we can see that.