The French go OTT on the Champs Elysees

Discussion in 'Western Europe' started by LafayetteBis, Dec 2, 2018.

  1. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    From the Independent here: It’s not surprising that fuel protests in Paris turned violent – the French establishment has long ignored social inequality

    Excerpt:
    It's a bit of a shame that a movement to awaken the present misery of those low on the economic totem-pole in France has gone so awry. Their demands are legitimate, but they do not understand the the president of France (Macron) is doing his best.

    France had a Socialist president last time around, who is a brainy do-nothing intellectual. He got elected because the previous President (from the Right) was also a do-nothing president. That makes ten-years (between both of them) that France, evidently "broken", has needed to be fixed.

    But this president is evidently doing it in a way that hurts income for the bottom classes (who need income most just for daily living). His only mechanism, as in most countries, is his country's budget. And what the country lacks most is Internal Demand that creates jobs. Well, not enough and not soon enough. (The French are an impatient people.)

    What most of the French do not understand is that the Treaty of Maastricht (that introduced the Euro) called for a maximum governmental deficit of not more than 3% of GDP. Today it is approaching 100%!

    The EU Central Bank is getting skittish, and rightfully so. But, the French are not a people to suffer-in-silence as do the Germans (or Nordics).

    Nope, they march right down the Champs-Elysees and wreak havoc on their way. Well, actually it was a bunch of nerdy young-adults with a grudge who did it - but, still ...
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2018
  2. VotreAltesse

    VotreAltesse Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Here people are hopeless but almost nobody see any hope for the country.
     
  3. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Interesting innuendo. I gather what you mean by "here" is France.

    I remain convinced that what is happening is well-deserved. The French for far too long think that established parties are the "way democracy works". Not in my book, they don't.

    This attitude has allowed French politicians to become "ensconced". That is, politics became a "profession". It should not be. Why?

    Because when any activity becomes "professional" it is human behaviour to "optimize income" in that profession. And, that is a particular illness of southern European democracies, of which France is a member.

    The real problem with France is that the French get out and manifest for just about anything. I am amazed to see the amount of "protest" demonstrations that are made from top-to-bottom against French governance. I just don't see how that "demonstrating" translates into positive action. It seem like people just letting off steam.

    The reason for this may be historic in nature. The first time this happened is when the "Parisian rabble" stormed "La Bastille", which was a political prison in the heart of Paris. They succeeded, and from there the French monarchy went rapidly downhill - ending with Louis XVI losing his head at Place de la Concord on a guillotine. Very dramatic!

    Maybe kids learned this lesson in French schools and as adults have ever since tried to demonstrate either their anger or simply their disagreement about a subject in such a forceful manner in the streets?

    I really don't know - I'm just an observer. What I do know is that the last time that happened in the US was at the National Mall in Washington, DC. Where Martin Luther King said there, "I have a dream" - but not much has come of that dream either ...
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2018
  4. VotreAltesse

    VotreAltesse Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yes, we have a long tradition of protest and self-destruction, but a lot of people are hopeless. Partly for good reasons, and partly because we're a very pessimistic country.
     
  5. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yes, that pessimism seems to be inherited biologically. (Joke!)

    The fact of the matter is that if you want to do anything in this country, one is obliged to find the pertinent law that says how, where and what you do and do not do.

    That bridles freedom-of-action and is the singular reason why any smart European goes to the US to start-up a company - and when it succeeds brings the company back to Europe.

    I have no solution, however, to suggest what to do. Neither do I think that Macron is the Ideal Solution. What can he do when a political class thinks it has to pass laws to show that it is "doing something". A solid economic fact is that - within reason - markets should be left alone to function. Where they need "rules" is wherever there could be harm done to any of the parties involved.

    Some interesting and contrasting stats:
    Statistic---------------- US ----- France --- Germany
    Hours worked* ----- 1789 ---- 1472 ------- 1288
    GDP/hour worked -- 75.0 ---- 59.2 -------- 57.36
    *per year

    Why such a large distance between France/Germany and the US in GDP per hour worked? (I have no answer.)

    How is it that Germany obtains about the same GDP per hour worked as does France, but Germany works fewer hours? (My answer - Germany obtains more of its GDP from Industry whilst France obtains most from Tourism. Whereas the Germans work far fewer hours than the French, but more effectively.)
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2018
  6. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Oh please, if you don't count the migrants and their children, France's inequality rate is lower than the UK or Germany.

    Even the owners of chalets or castles often have to run a business offering public tours and hosting events to make ends meet and be able to keep the property.

    Unlike in a "normal" situation where the inequality rate would go up because the top 1% are richer, in this case the inequality rate is going up because the bottom 20% have been imported from other impoverished countries.

    Furthermore, all this sudden influx of foreigners into the urban areas is only driving up inequality and concentrating wealth to the rich by creating housing shortage issues driving rents up. I'm sure there are pressures driving low-skill wages down too.

    The Left is too stupid too realize they're the cause of rising inequality.
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2018
  7. LafayetteBis

    LafayetteBis Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Validate that comment with statistical proof please. Btw, nowhere on this planet to migrants figure into the unemployment rate.

    That happens nowadays, but only because fewer Europeans are "voyaging". There's an economic crisis going on. Everybody shares the harm.

    Bollocks! You don't get it - the refugees do not figure into unemployment rates. Only nationals do.

    In Germany, the foreigners are a godsend. Angela was right about this one - she opened the gates and Germany has put the foreigners to work. Often sweeping the streets, but that does matter. Those who were doing that kind of job before are retiring.

    Germans are retirement is siginficant and the influx of refugees is helping to keep German business running. Yes, there have been some scattered street-fighting between populations - but nothing to get overly worried about.

    In fact, for many industrial jobs requiring skills, even African blacks have been trained to do the job. Yes, these are the low-end jobs - but people retire from those jobs as well and have to be replaced. What keeps Germany going is the same condition that has existed for more than a century - it is a HIGHLY INDUSTRIALIZED NATION!

    Spite is not a good rebuttal. Try harder ...
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2018
  8. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Inequality levels and unemployment rates are two different issues (although closely related).
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2018

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