They claim that Democrats shut them out of negotiations on the ACA. That is absolutely false. They were asked for input and they actually submitted about 100 ideas, many of which were adopted. But when it came time to vote, Republicans refused saying the ACA was going to be a Democrat plan with which the Repubs would hang them later. Now the Republicans are rushing to develop a new plan behind closed doors. They don't allow Democrats to participate, they don't allow journalists or experts to observe, they didn't even allow the AMA or AARP to participate, but they did allow lobbyists to participate. Lobbyists work for corporations, so guess who the product will serve. Republicans say the Democrats want a socialist plan of single payer type. They say that will increase costs, yet every developed country has a program that includes single payer national healthcare and their costs are half of ours and their outcomes are sometimes a little worse, and sometimes better, but usually as good..... at half the cost per capita. I think the writing is on the wall, and if the AHCA passes, it will lock in that writing. And we will end up with national healthcare as a last resort when it should have been first. Better late than never I guess.
It really goes to show the complete partisan hackery in our politics today, in particular with Republican supporters. They are so dishonest and are complete hypocrites. Maybe they think others are as dumb and/or dishonest as them and will fall for it. Not only is this bill horrendous (tax cuts for billionaires and 23 million losing insurance), but they are doing exactly what they falsely accused the dems of doing. It's like they forget that their constituency is only about 25% of the country yet they continue to cater to these people and ignore the rest. I hope they pass it, then they own it, and they will get crushed in the midterms. As long as republicans don't continue to get away with suppressing voters
For the Republicans, it's all about pandering to the rich corporate elite. And yet with words that so completely misrepresent their deeds, they gain and keep supporters among the working class. The Democrats are only marginally better. But this is a Republican healthcare bill that we're talking about and what is it really focused on? It's focused on a huge tax break for the rich to balance huge cuts to middle class, working class programs and supports.
Did you notice that when a thread is about indefensible, obvious Republican corruption and the evil it produces, no rightie will touch it because they can't spin it with any believability.
You are still pushing that BS about the Republicans having input into obamacare? The democrats were ramming it through, they had supermajorities and ignored the Republicans. Until Scott Brown (whose campaign promise was to be the 41st vote, not the 60th - meaning he would kill obamacare) won and joined the Senate, then having lost their supermajority the democrats played parliamentarian shenanigans to pass obamacare without another Senate vote. Conservatives should exclude the democrats. Democrats have proven they cannot be trusted, they do not deserve a voice in the government.
You clearly are a bit confused. The Republicans own the government at the current time, not the Conservatives.
With the gop house and senate bills, I think there are two main ideas. 1. They want to do away with men who were newly qualified for Medicaid with the Obamacare expansion. "Able bodied men" who are not working. As it turned out about half the money want to mental illness and opioid treatment. Whether you are for or against the gop's proposal, it is a philosophy. Get a job. 2. Paul Ryan's dream is to end Medicaid as a govt/state fund match program. His view is the feds should not be involved with defining care for people in nursing homes or kids with CP and the like. And, it's ok for poorer states to offer less per enrollee care than richer states. Whether one agrees or not is just a viewpoint. But it is ironic that Justice Roberts overturning the original Obamacare provision that all states must expand, or they will not get the fund match in the pre-Obamacare proposal. I see an inconsistency there.
Read post #5, the topic you jumped into is the claim that the Democrats allowed Republican input to obamacare. Democrats rammed obamacare through and deliberately prevented Republican input.
There's more than a bit of irony here. https://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com...nd-of-kennedy-warns-democrats-on-health-care/ I think the dems did reach a point of 'let's just get this done." Utah's other senator Bennett was tea partied for supporting a mandate. And the gop didn't agree that there needed to be some minimum one size fits all care, as I recall. I don't think either side is blameless in this. HOWEVER, McConnell intenationally torpedoed bipartisan efforts to get something done to stababalize Obamacare. This in no longer really about healthcare but more about delivering a win for Trump, and something that has a chance to pass the House in that it gives Ryan what he really wants. http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/senate-obamacare-working-group-expands/article/2623541
The Republican sumitted over over hundred amendments and had four months to review the bill. Not the Democrats fault that the Republicans had no intention of making any positive contribution.
Do your research and stop with the propaganda. Due to Kennedy dying and Republican Scott Brown winning that seat, the Senate version was the one that moved forward - the House version was dropped because to amend it would require a vote in the Senate, and it would fail since the democrats no longer had a super majority. Scrub all House Republican amendments right there. Of 788 Republican amendments in the Senate Committee for Health Education Labor, only 2 made it into the bill. One required Congress to enroll in obamacare - and that was neutered - and the other was about some obscure issue with medication. Republicans made no change in the ACA, dumbocrats would not allow it.
But it is not that the dems didn't seek some bipartisan approach. The gop could not politically vote for a mandate, nor was there enthusiasm for the dems' one size fits all approach. And the dems were unwilling to budge. The gop is determined to cut the taxes placed on the more wealthy and to roll back the Medicaid expansion. There's no intention of making the health delivery system better.
So you agree that the Senate Republicans had plenty of time to consider the bill and put forth 778 amendments. The fact that only two made it into the bill does not negate the fact that Republicans had plenty of time to contribute productively. That they chose not to was their fault not the fault of the Democrats. Contast that with the Senate Trumpcare bill where the Democrats were totally excluded and the bill is not open for debate or Amendment.
The Republicans wanted to contribute, they tried to contribute, but they were not allowed to contribute. The democrats had a super majority, they did not need and did not want Republican input. obamacare is the creation of the Democrats, and they will receive the consequences of forcing an unwanted and disastrous law (the ACA) on the nation. A consequence due to the Democrats proven incompetence is being shut out of health care reform.
Cutting taxes is good, even if its targeted tax cuts its still good. Starve the beast. Some will say tax cuts without spending cuts is a bad idea, and it is - but the govt has never cut spending. When taxes are increased, govt spending increases even more than the tax increase. When the govt says it will cut spending, its always cutting a program 10 years in the future and it never happens. The feds will always spend more than they have, so cut the taxes no matter what. I agree. The GOP claimed for the past 4 elections they would repeal obamacare but t was a campaign lie. All the House votes to repeal obamacare was a scam. For several years, some conservatives pushing for a 3rd party have stated the GOP would not repeal obamacare, the GOP wants the power and money that obamacare brings. The GOP loves govt controlled healthcare - as long as the GOP runs it.
I can't start threads because while I've been registered here for a long time, I rarely post. I may begin doing so, but I haven't made up my mind. Anyway, here's how both parties play politics. the dems for control, the gop for the 1% Medicaid expansion for healthy people is efficient and low cost (comparison to other US delivery system). Provider rates are below both medicare and private insurance, and the administrative cost is on a par with medicare. In terms of improving HC in the US, it factually cannot be disputed. However, it’s politically stupid. Medicaid is a huge problem for poorer states. It’s 20% of a state budget. Talk about expanding it sends shivers down state politicians lives. Here in Miss, you have to add together ALL state spending on K-12, community colleges and universities to say education gets more funding than medicaid. Saying the feds would cover 100% for ten years is akin to saying "Kid you should try smoking this really cheap good ****." The only way the dems could even try this route was they tried to make expanding medicaid mandatory, unless states wanted to lose ALL federal medicaid dollars. That was holding a gun to the kid until he took a hit off the pipe. Justice Roberts rewrote the law to let states choose to keep the original medicad match. Medicaid is also politically stupid because it pits taxpayer against taxpayer. Someone smarter than me put up the excellent Vox link. https://www.vox.com/science-and-health/2016/12/13/13848794/kentucky-obamacare-trump The problem with medicaid all along is you have families with two earners making 35K apiece, and their kids’ insurance isn’t as good as an unemployed, never married single mom. Anyone think that doesn’t rub workers the wrong way? But then, Obamacare made it even worse by expanding it to 130% over the poverty rate. You could sell Schips to the people paying for the less good insurance, because Schips was for kids. People are generally nice to kids. Assuming the gop had ANY interest in actually making HC more accessable and affordable, they could just double the Obamacare taxes on things like short term stock trades that add NOTHING positive to the economy. But that was never the gop’s aim. The gop’s aim is to cut the 1%’s taxes, first and foremost. Don’t try to even argue otherwise because the gop had done Roberts’ rewrite on steroids. NOW they won’t even keep the original medicaid match. So poor states will have to cut care. As a goper, I COULD argue that, while Trump Ryan and McConnell are shitty human beings, simply adding money into the pot for insurance subsidies is throwing good after bad. The ENTIRE US HC delivery system rests on paying doctors (and all providers like hospitals) a set dollar figure for each service they provide. So NOBODY has any incentive to not deliver (or get) as much treatment as they can possibly consume. That is, at some point even private insurance pays 100% after co-pays. Now in fairness to the three shits in the Swamp, we could as a nation budget how much, on average, it takes to provide HC to the entire population, and pay for it with non-deficit dollars. But that is not what the three shits are doing. They’re only doing that to the poorest, sickest and powerless among us.
Think how national healthcare could completely eliminate all these problems and much more. You pay $400/month in a tax dedicated to "Medicare for All" but you no longer pay for a medical plan at work or the Medicare part if FICA. If you're in need of medical care, you go to a doctor. No copay. No deductibles. No Medicaid. No kids insurance concerns. No pre-existing conditions issue. The coverage is yours and is in no way connected with your job.
How, exactly, was Battle3 confused when he was talking about a previous time and you are discussing the current time?
Please explain how this sentemce is on reference to the past: " Conservatives should exclude the democrats. Democrats have proven they cannot be trusted, they do not deserve a voice in the government." You are an English speaker I assume, and should know that " should" is not a past tense.
In 2015 health care spending amounted to about $3.2 Trillion, $9,980 per person, or about 17.8% of the GDP. An $832 tax per month on each man woman and child would provide that, although likely it would be more today.
This is a chart of annual increases in total healthcare spending http://kaiserfamilyfoundation.files.wordpress.com/2014/02/slide31.png Source: http://www.kff.org/report-section/health-care-costs-a-primer-2012-report/
