The West If It Wanted Could Save Ten Thousand Syrian Civilians Lives Likely Perishing Within A Year!

Discussion in 'Western Europe' started by JimfromPennsylvania, Feb 21, 2020.

  1. JimfromPennsylvania

    JimfromPennsylvania Active Member Donor

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    The humanity of the West has dropped dramatically in the last twenty to thirty years, Western countries twenty or thirty years ago would never let the human catastrophe unfolding in northwestern Syria, Idlib province, occur; they would use their military heft to stop the shocking loss of civilian life that is in the process of unfolding! Granted American and the United Kingdom political leadership seemed consumed with throwing red meat to their political bases and are forgetting that countries have a duty toward the world if a country doesn't try to stop alarming abuses that occur outside itself, that is in other parts of the world, than it loses the moral claim that it should be stopped when the evil comes knocking on its country's door; but what about all you conventional Western countries! I am really surprised at the leaders of Germany and France, Andrea Merkel and Emmanuel Macron, where is your responsible leadership in this area. Ms. Merkel has had a career as a first rate leader, will she end her political career as a timid and weak German Chancellor? Emmanuel Macron is certainly not upholding France's reputation as a country that is a leader in standing up against scandalous human rights abuses and violations of international law as demonstrated by the presidencies of Jacques Chirac and Nicolas Sarkozy!

    It is readily militarily doable here to stop the large scale deaths of Syrian civilians what NATO and willing partner countries do is set up a zone barrier between the shrinking pocket of the Syrian rebels in Idlib Provence and the Syrian Army alliance forces the length of the zone only has to be about one hundred and twenty five miles long and NATO countries can impose a no fly zone against the Russian and Syrian Airforce over this pocket and the NATO barrier zone. This will stabilize the dangerous humanitarian crisis for the civilians in this region allow aid groups to establish survival camps for these people to stop the deaths. Over ensuing years when it is clear that Bashar Assad is not going on a revenge death campaign against Sunni Syrians throughout Syria the refugees in this NATO protected pocket can be resettled in Sunni areas of Syria. This would actually probably create leverage against Assad not to go on a revenge rampage against Sunni Syrians throughout Syria because otherwise he wouldn't get Idlib Provence back which would help create the situation where the four plus million Syrian refugees in Turkey and Jordan could safely return to Syria. The West stopped ethnic cleansing in Kosovo and stopped the massive human slaughter that was to occur in Benghazi, Libya back in 2011 at the hands of the dictator Muammar Qaddafi. The West, vis-à-vis European Union countries could lead an international coalition to stop the impending ten thousand plus civilian deaths that will occur in Syria over the next year if the West doesn't intervene; from a practical standpoint the European Union might want to consider that it is easier and better for them to try to solve this problem in Syria than deal with this problem in their own countries in regards to dealing with the flood of Syrian refugees trying to settle in their country!
     
  2. The Scotsman

    The Scotsman Well-Known Member

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    ....its cheaper to house refugees than fight over, stabilise and rebuild a ravaged country...its the practical solution to a country that has no strategic value whatsoever....its the pragmatic solution....?
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2020
  3. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Sounds like white imperialism.
     
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  4. Seth Bullock

    Seth Bullock Well-Known Member Donor

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    You realize that your no-fly zone would put NATO air forces in direct conflict with Russia, right? Try convincing European nations to do that. And how many Americans want to do that?

    By protecting one side of the conflict, we would be actively taking a side in what is a Syrian civil war. Syria is not the U.S. It's not even in the western hemisphere. It's not a part of NATO. Syria is not our ally, and never has been. And the Syrian civil war poses no threat to the U.S. or our allies.

    And you realize that this would put us in the position of protecting radical islamic terrorists in Idlib, don't you? Those forces are not a bunch of George Washingtons and James Madisons.

    To protect a 125 mile long zone barrier would take tens of thousands of troops and support personnel and a massive supply chain.

    We would be spending hundreds of billions of dollars and putting our young people at risk to die for a side in a Syrian civil war.

    This mission would never end.

    Would you give up a son or a daughter for Syria? Is that what you raised your children for? If the answer is no, then we don't go.
     
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  5. The Scotsman

    The Scotsman Well-Known Member

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    yeah.....don't know about you but I'm getting sick and fcuking tired of watching men and women being shipped off to die in flyblown shiteholes in order to save one set of brain dead bellends from another set of brain dead bellends....can't solve all the problems of the worlds stone age shiteholes
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2020
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  6. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Oh I agree. I was one of them. I was just lucky enough to come back.
     
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  7. The Scotsman

    The Scotsman Well-Known Member

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    yeah...got the t-shirt
     
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  8. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    With all due respect to @JimfromPennsylvania , his plan sounds insane. Considering there are several oil rich nations right in the area, they could fund a relief mission if they were interested. I'm unclear how we, on the other side of the globe, are responsible.
     
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  9. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Is it? I don't think that's true in the long-term.

    I just don't see moving people from one part of the globe to another as being able to solve the root of conflicts.

    Give it some thought, it doesn't make sense. Are there just "bad" and "good" countries, and the solution is to move all the people who are in the "bad" countries into the "good" countries, and then everything will just be fine and dandy?

    There's been absolutely zero studies looking at how much these refugees cost us in the long-term. (Taking into account government services, substantially higher rates of poverty/crime, and the children they have)
    No one is keeping track of it.

    It would be far far cheaper to provide services for them in the countries they are already in, since those poor countries have lower costs of living.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2020
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  10. The Scotsman

    The Scotsman Well-Known Member

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    That was my point, just shove a few quid at the aid agencies and the like so they can build refugee camps and hand out food and water. Much cheaper.
     
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  11. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I think he means refugee camps near/in their own countries instead of flying them 5,000 miles into Western civilization.

    You could certainly help more people for the same amount of money, and immigrating the 3rd world into the 1st world isn't exactly working out well.
     
  12. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yes, create some refugee camps in a safe corner of their own country, maybe along the border with one of their neighbors, and then station some military forces to protect them.

    If those refugee camps have to be there for more than 5 years, it may be time to think about invading and "stabilizing" the country that is not safe for their own people.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2020
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  13. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Don't forget about the Yazidis the US ignored.

    40,000 Yazidi people who got cornered by ISIL fighters on Sinjar Mountain
    Wikipedia article on the Sinjar massacre
    received very little coverage in the news and most Americans are not aware it happened. It happened only 6 years ago.
    US forces in Iraq at the time could have protected them, but chose not to.

    Mount Sinjar, Yazidi, and Noah

    Also see this thread about what the Yazidi women went through:
    A Rape Survivor Just Won the Nobel Peace Prize. ‘Feminists’ Are Nowhere to Be Found.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2020
  14. The Scotsman

    The Scotsman Well-Known Member

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    no...no.... and a whole convoy of whopping great trucks hauling huge quantities of sodding great big red balloons with the word NO scrawled on them...what is it with this invade narrative?? And why would one be implying some form of responsibility for their plight? I mean, don't get me wrong I understand that for these people its a right royal pile poo and if it were me I'd sell my left testicle to get out but...well... its their pile of poo and their testicles....and to be frank we have countless piles of poo throughout the world and a massive over supply of left testicles on the world left testicle market. So what do we do...I mean how many stone age shiteholes are we supposed to invade? How much cash do we invest on stemming the supply of testicles and poo ridden countries.... I mean where does it all end?
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2020
  15. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I sympathize with your perspective, but let's just suppose we set aside a special land in the world to house all these refugees. Let's say we designated Paraguay (small country in the middle of South America) to put them all. How long until that country destabilized and turned into the same type of war zone that these refugees fled from in the first place?
    Where would we put them then? Ruin another country, and another?
     

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