this story is a lie!

i read this story, and found it to be a complete lie. link https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/ghost-guns-easily-assembled-firearms-without-serial-numbers-are-now-banned-in-denver/ar-AASr7lK?ocid=msedgntp a friend of mine, built his own ar-15. and the there was a (serical-number) on the lower receiver. that can be traced back to him. the seller put that number into his records so if the gov. starts looking for that receiver, it can be traced to my friend.
this is a scare story to frighten people who know nothing about firearms. what do you all think? i will not argue with anyone on this story. just stated the facts from the gun and paper work of that ar. thanks.

 

You can just 3D print one anyway.

 

While I believe anecdotal information has value, it doesn't represent the totality of *all* experiences so it helps to find a balance that can give us a clearer picture of the things we read about. So, while it may be true that your friend has a weapon with a registered serial number, it doesn't mean that the concerns raised in the article are invalid or untrue.

They are just untrue for the one person you know.

 

ok, just asking. the main housing of any (so called) ghost gun, has a serial number on it that is recorded by the seller. so unless you can machine that receiver/ housing, all (ghost) guns will have a serial number that can be traced back to the seller. and that seller had better have the name of the person that they sold it to on file. so imo this story is a lie. not saying you are!!!!! these main receivers/housings are traceable to the owner. a person would need to be a machinist to build a receiver/housing plus a machine shop worth of machine tools. wouldn't they?

 

Not if the parts were 3D printed, and/or custom manufactured by a dishonest machinist. Those BIG exceptions torpedo your OP.

 

The "ghost guns" referred to in this article are 80 % finished lowers. No serial numbers, no background check
They require machining or routing out the pocket for the fire control group, (trigger assy and safety)
Google "finish your own ar".
The part you referbto is a "stripped lower" , serialized, and recorded as a firearm.
Please do a little research. Im a 2a advocate. And have built several AR's of my own.

 

agree to a point. you can e-d print a lot of the parts. --but to take the explosive force of the round going off, the critical parts must be metal. if you 3d print recivers/housing that explosive force could shatter the firearm that you are holding and firing. look at glocks, ar-15's- h.k's 1911's. there is a lot of force there to contend with.

 

really? can you name the company that makes these lowers without serial numbers? that is a company i would like to know about. and where can i buy one --without-- a back ground check. please don't say (gun shows) i've been to plenty in different states. and you just make my point. on machining!!! you would need to be a machinist with a machine shop full of tools to complete that job. and how many machinist have you heard of making a (ghost gun) then using it on civilians. just asking, no offence
meant i'm really looking forward to the name of these companies and states that are doing this. thanks.

 

https://slate.com/technology/2021/02/3d-printed-semi-automatic-rifle-fgc-9.html

They're already making 100% operable submachine guns. They have released a CNC milling machine called the Ghost Gunner that does indeed use metal.

 

5d tactical, 80% lowers.com, etc.

https://thundertactical.com/product-category/ar-15/ar-15-80-lowers/

That should help you.

 

from your source:
Types Of 80 Lowers
80% lowers are available in a wide array of calibers and firearm platforms. For example, you can purchase an AR-15 80% lower or one for an AR-10, a 1911 frame, or a polymer 80% pistol frame that are considered 80% receivers and are therefore not regulated the same as actual firearms. With these 80% lowers, you can build your own rifles and pistols yourself and ship them straight to your doorstep, no background checks or extra steps required!
as you can see, it doesn't say the receiver has no serial number. but it does show you need to be a machinist with access to a machine shop to finish these receivers. that limits the buyers to who can finish them to a functioning receiver. thanks for the info. if you have more i'm interested in learning all i can.

 

I have bought and finished 6, 3 were polymer, (plastic) and three were aluminum. I finished them with a router and a jig, about $300 for both. ( I borrowed the one i used).
NONE WERE SERIALIZED BECAUSE THEY AREN'T CONSIDERED FIREARMS UNTIL FINISHED! Read the part about " not regulated the same as actual firearms".
Now, if you dont want to google finish your 80% lower on youtube, then you really dont want an answer.
Its not hard, just about an hour to completely mill one with a router, and drill 4 hole through the jig.

Look, you're wrong. And the more you argue, the dumber you look.

 

Heres one i finished.

 

This is where it started. Notice no milled opening where the trigger assy goes.

 

This is the area i milled out

 

https://www.80-lower.com/products/80-lower-raw-1-pack-1/

Heres where you can buy your own......once you get your foot out of your mouth.
You can even see all four sides and verify there is no serial number of any kind.

Now......Any more smart ass remarks?

 

you do know that owning a fully auto machine/sub machine gun is against federal law, unless you have a federal license to own one, right? i would seriously think the federal gov. would put any company out of business, unless highly regulated on all parts and fully operable guns are logged and followed by the gov. i can't get your source address to work so when i post this i will try again to get it to work. thanks.

 

Not saying it's legal, just that it's possible and there's nothing anyone can do about it, government included.

Guns are physical objects made of the most common materials on Earth. You can therefore make them yourself with a little know how, with centuries old tools if you have the time and intelligence, but increasingly anyone can do it with very little knowledge.

This is a good thing.

 

ok, steady pie, i got your source to work, so here is my answer. from your source: Up until recently, however, the best you could do with a semi-automatic rifle like the AR-15 was 3D-print the lower receiver (the core part that’s regulated as a firearm). Users still had to buy real magazines, triggers, and barrels to complete the kit and build a working gun. That’s easy to do if you live in America, where most people can purchase gun parts (minus the receiver) online.
as you can see your source says--quote: (minus the receiver)!!! it does say they can 3-d print the receiver. but i don't think that will hold up, in any amount of firing. a lot of other parts--yes--i agree can be. but the receiver? that needs to be able to take the shock of the round going off in the barrel and the shock of the bolt going backwards. & holding all the other parts in place so another round can be fired. this is interesting, i like your info.

 

really? do you think the average American has a drill press, and the jegs, and the training to do this job properly. and trying to use just a power drill? a average American would screw this job all to heck. a person would have to be a machinist to do this job, just watch the vid. this is not for a non- machinist. imo.

 

You're worried about longevity? Few criminals reuse their guns, they get rid of them ASAP because of their connection to a serious crime.

I have no objection to people owning weapons as long as they are stored in a fashion that restricts use solely to the owner.
There were over 300,000 guns reported stolen in 2020 in the US. Mind you that is just the reported stolen, total estimates are closer to a million. 7-20k per state largely because people store them improperly.

Now we add untracable gun kits without serial numbers. Why? Why are we making it even easier for the criminals? If you are a legitimate gun user then you don't care if it has a serial number because the only time it matters is to recover stolen guns or in the case of insurrection.

 

Note that in order to make this particular gun the 3D printer they used cost over a million dollars. Not your every day 3D Printer. However as time goes on that 3D printer will become mass produced more and more. And eventually it will make its way into your home. Think of it like a computer. At one point they too cost millions (in todays dollars) and now you can get a real cheap one for a little over $100 and it still does more than that old timer one.

I'm telling people right now, if we're going to address violence committed by people using a gun we have GOT to start addressing the core issues instead of trying to limit/ban gun ownership. Because the cat is out of the bag. Guns are not going away. And they're going to be easier and easier to get. In fact I'm actually a little surprised that more "ghost guns" haven't been found yet. The cartels easily have the money to buy multiples of the machine that was used to make the above gun.

 

The reason that people don't want registration numbers is because they like their privacy. They don't want a system in which the government can use to try and take their guns because someone claimed that they were a danger to others. (red flag laws for instance)

Also contrary to popular opinion criminals don't just "get rid of them ASAP". At least not if you're just talking about "throw it in the garbage or river" type of "get rid of them". Many guns are re-used by criminals. Just not the same criminals. Guns get passed around. Especially by gang members who pass it from one gang member to another.

 

It may be referring to 80% receivers. Those are receivers where at least 20% of the machining must be completed after purchase. From a legal perspective, a receiver that is only 80% or less finished is not a reciever but is instead a random chunk of metal. Which makes sense, since all gun parts indeed start as random chunks of metal, and at some point between when the machining process and started and when it is finished its legally turns into a 'firearm.' The ATF rules that point is 80% completion. Given that some of the work required to turn a chunk of metal into a reciever is relatively simple to do (such as drilling holes or grinding edges), if those more simple processes are left undone, they can instead be done after purchase, which means its not a reciever being sold, but rather just machined metal, and so no serial number is required to sell the 'weapon' aka chunk of metal. So far as I know, the serial number is only required to be on weapons that are transferred from one person to another. So if someone builds a weapon and keeps it, there is no requirement for a serial number. Carrying that weapon in public is a lot more messy, from a legal standpoint. In some states you can transport and/or carry a 'homebuilt' weapon, in other states its basically illegal the instant it leaves your home or property. But unless Denver has done something new, its legal nationwide to build a firearm at home and keep it there (as long as the builder is not prohibited from owning a firearm due to being a convicted felon or adjudicated mentally ill).

So the question is: did Denver make it illegal for people to manufacture a firearm themselves at home?

"The Denver City Council voted 10-1 to pass the bill, which outlaws the creation, carriage, transportation, discharge, and sale of firearms without serial numbers."

It appears that is precisely what Denver has done. If true, expect this to be challenged in court very soon.

Either that, or this can be avoided by simply stamping any random number onto DIY firearms. It wouldn't be the first time that a gun law was hastily passed by people with no intelligence leaving it full of so many loopholes and vaguities as to make the law nothing but worthless virtue signalling and pandoring.