Ukrainian pilot Nadya Savchenko released from prison

Discussion in 'Latest US & World News' started by MrFirst, Apr 16, 2019.

  1. MrFirst

    MrFirst Banned Past Donor

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    Nadiya Viktorivna Savchenko (Ukrainian: Надія Вікторівна Савченко; born 11 May 1981) is a Ukrainian politician and former Army aviation pilot in the Ukrainian Ground Forces. People's Deputy of Ukraine 8th convocation from 27 November 2014.[9][10]

    During the 2014 War in Donbass Savchenko, a first lieutenant in the Ukrainian Ground Forces, served as instructor with a volunteer infantry unit, the Aidar Battalion. In June 2014, she was captured by pro-Russian forces in eastern Ukraine[11] and handed over to Russia where she was accused of having directed artillery fire that killed two Russian state-television journalists at the positions of pro-Russian forces in Ukraine.[12]


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nadiya_Savchenko

    Short history of Western hypocrisy.
     
  2. MrFirst

    MrFirst Banned Past Donor

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    Yesterday she was released from Ukrainian prison.
     
  3. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    What’s the hypocrisy? All I read is the story of a an Ukrainian pilot imprisoned by Russian thugs, brutalized, and finally released, only to be arrested by Ukraine for terrorist activity. Excuse my ignorance, but, what am I missing?
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2019
  4. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I think the implication is that it's ridiculous that she could have been the one who killed those two journalists, and that that was just used as a fabricated excuse to arrest her.

    Of course, that depends very much on what the evidence is, but in cases like this we very rarely hear all the details of that.

    Ukraine was practically at war with Russian separatists, who were practically backed by Russia. So when the Russian side arrested a Ukrainian, it's not such a simple matter of everyone believing what the accusations are.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2019
  5. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I think the Opening Post is trying to claim that Ukraine and the West is hypocritical to hold someone up as a hero who is accused of terrorist crime by Russia, and then when Russia finally releases her, Ukraine basically arrests her for the same thing Russia did, validating what Russia had done.

    Sort of a like a "You were complaining about what I was doing, but now your actions prove you agree with what I was doing" thing.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2019
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  6. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Oh. Well, her arrest in Ukraine is confusing.
     
  7. Jeannette

    Jeannette Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It does show the West is hypocritical because the West was demanding that Nadiya Savchenko be released from the Russian jail before the trial, and that she was being mistreated and that was proven false at the trial when she was acting like an idiot.

    Later on she was the one pushing for peace with the separatists and for a prisoner exchange to free the men. Poroshenko and the others could care less.

    Actually Nadiya would have been great as the president of Ukraine, because she really did love her country, but the mafia families running Ukraine would never have allowed that.


    This is how I remember the events:

    Two Russian reporters were killed by the Ukrainian army at the time, and I'm sure the Russians had some proof that Nadiya was involved.

    It was an open trial and she made a mockery of it. She acted like an idiot. It proved though that she was not being mistreated.

    She became a hero and was very popular in Ukraine and became a member of the Rada. She could have easily become president if there was a fair election.

    She wanted to exchange and free the prisoners and to stop the war so the Donbass could remain with Ukraine as per the agreement at Minsk II.

    Nadiya was furious later with the government and their indifference to the sufferings, and when they assassinated the Donbass hero Givi, she said there was no way now that Donetsk and Lugansk will want to remain in Ukraine. Before that the other hero 'Motorola' was assassinated, and afterwards they assassinated the very popular president of Donetsk; Zacharchenko.

    She did organize to overthrow the government when she saw what Poroshenko was doing to Ukraine, but she wasn't the only one. They have had quite a few Maidan's to get rid of him but they all failed.
     
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  8. Jeannette

    Jeannette Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    To understand the demographics of Ukraine, if the Donbas area with its Russian majority was to remain in Ukraine, Poroshenko and the other mafia families wouldn't have the votes to remain in power. They took control with the coup, and have used mafia methods to maintain it as well as the media - which they own. Anyone running for office that represents the south and east of Ukraine, were being thrown in trash bins and under threat not to run.

    In the meantime the mafias and the Nazis they support in Western Ukraine do not want to lose the richest parts of Ukraine, and want to ethnically cleanse as much as they could. So they keep shooting missiles at civilians areas to get them to leave.

    What Kiev has done by not going along with the Minsk II agreement, is force the people in Donetsk and Lugansk to integrate with Russia for their survival - something that Putin really didn't want. He wanted Ukraine to federate like Russia and Germany, so each area would have more rights.

    This is logical, because if Donetsk and Lugansk leave Ukraine, they'll be leaving all the other Russians in the Donbass and South at the mercy of the Nazis of Galatia.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2019
  9. Jeannette

    Jeannette Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    This is the 5th anniversary of the Declaration of Independence by Lugansk and Donetsk, so in honor of this I'm quoting the last 2 paragraphs of an article from Fort Russ. It reflects the feelings of the people in the Donbass, who had seen Crimea join Russia after only three weeks and with no blood shed, while they are still suffering.

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Donbass: Our Choice is Russia — a panegyric to the spirit of this Russian people

    "...this choice of Russia is that of a heroic and legitimate destiny, in reaction to the western madness of the Maidan. It is not a political reaction but the expression of the common sense of this “collective unconscious” which forms the deep roots of peoples. It is a natural and popular choice of identity.

    And 5 years of loneliness, tears, and blood are more than any ordinary people can endure, but the Republics of Donetsk and Lugansk, renewing their confidence and plans for the future with Russia call out to Kiev, despite the blows received, that the divorce is definitely consummated and to Moscow, despite the disappointments experienced, only by the fresh earth reopened daily in their cemeteries, that they deserved their true homeland, both by the blood received and by the blood shed right up to today.
     
  10. MrFirst

    MrFirst Banned Past Donor

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    You are wrong.
    It's not about Russia, it's about Savchenko.
    While she was imprisoned in Russia, she was considered as a "hero", "freedom fighter", "political prisoner" and so on. Ambassadors, human rights activists and various people all over the world spoke for her, blamed evil Russia and so on.
    But when she, all of the sudden, got into Ukrainian jail, everybody forgot about her. No claims, no speeches, no diplomatic demarches. No anything. Complete silence.
    The same person is a hero while being in Russian jail, and a criminal in Ukrainian jail. :)
     
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  11. kazenatsu

    kazenatsu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I think there may be language barrier and you misunderstood. I said exactly what you said.
     
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  12. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    She was a tool, to discredit Russia and when she stopped being a tool she was discarded.
     
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  13. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If this is rational, then truly there are little green men living on Mars. What a bunch of tribalist twaddle.
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2019
  14. MrFirst

    MrFirst Banned Past Donor

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    Ok, sorry, maybe so.
     

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