Would you have used the atom bomb on Japan in WWII if you were Prez?

You are a liar.

 

The mistake of committing an atrosity of enormous scale and trying to excuse it! Crimes must be punished, the only thing this incident deserves from the honest people is REGRET!

 

What part of "The Japanese never needed to surrender" do you not understand? And FYI, the Chinese are not a US ally. To win a battle, annihilation isn't necessary. It doesn't matter if the Japanese had the will to fight to the last man standing, if you take away their ability to fight. Stop making this all about US humanitarian efforts to liberate China (that was never even a concern for the US in WWII). It is because of our lack of concern for China in WWII that China (today) still is not a US ally. And you want to deflect by focusing on civilians that the Japanese killed (how many of which were US civilians?) but ignore civilians killed by any other nation during WWII? You need to get you priorities straight.

 

The US didn't even have one million service personnel available to invade Japan in WWII, so how could it have been estimated that it would cost over one million US lives? The reality is that the US was incapable of overrunning Japan (period), the number that it would have cost one million lives was just another way to highlight that fact. Japan was impenetrable to invasion forces that were available.

 

Bottom line is we did not need to drop those bombs. Now we have your opinion and my opinion or the collective opinions of the greatest military minds of the day. And they said we did not need to do it.

 

The Japanese had no intentions of surrendering as surrender was abhorrent and cowards. Without exception both Japanese military and civilian personnel choice death over surrender time and again, and this also had been the order of the Emperor and Japanese military at every island.
The homeland defense plans of Japan (which I read in detail a couple of years ago) was designed to fight to the last person. Japan was militarizing the entire civilian population, moving its war industries and command to the Japanese mountains, and was starving to death Japanese who did not serve the war effort in some way to reserve resources.
They had held back over 2000 Kamika planes to hit our troop transport ships when just off shore - screaming in off the mainland could hit those ships within 2 minutes. Their submarines to specifically target troop transport ships. All civilians who could fight to be given a rifle and a simple RPG. They calculated they could not stop Americans making a beachhead but would kill a quarter of a million Americans in the landing. We would then have to mass kill - including Japanese civilians - across Japan. The figured a kill ratio of about 50 to 1 of their civilians, but civilians were less vital to them than their military personnel. Millions of mines and boobytraps.
They figured that as we had more and more tens of thousands of casualties killing millions and millions of Japanese - slaughtering across Japan - that we would not have the courage to continue all the way. In short, they were relying on those posting pro-Japanese messages on this thread to win out, that we would allow Japan to prevail by just surrendering in the sense of just going home - allowing Japan to continue its war in China.
Our own calculations were similar. We estimated 1,000,000 American casualties - minimum - and could only guess how many millions to tens of millions of Japanese we would have to kill.

There also was the element of the Russians fighting Japan over China, with the Chinese nationalists siding with Japan and the Chinese communists siding with Russia. Without a quick defeat of Japan, either China would go to Russia or China would go to Japan - unless of course we sent a million troops to China and got into that war.

The sobbing for the Japanese of their war industry cities - while having total apathy towards the continued killing of Americans, Chinese, Japanese and Russians in the war - does reveal the core opposition is the liberal and Democratic Party view that everything the USA ever did was pure evil, Americans are evil, and to have compassion for the enemy while apathy towards our own.

The war with Japan and the war in China was not over at all. Since we had yet to invade the Japanese mainland 80% of the fighting, dying and killing was left to come. The two atom bombs ended it. Nothing else short of massive casualties and slaughters into the tens of millions - and letting Russia have China and a piece of Japan - would have ended it. Short of believing they faced literal 100% extinction, the Japanese did not surrender - EVER.

The Emperor stated the single reason he surprise announced surrender. We had tricked him into believing we had hundreds of atom bombs and an endless supply, for which within days we were going to totally obliterate all of Japan, every inch of it, with atom bombs. The bluff worked. That was the ONLY reason for the surrender. The Japanese military would never surrender and was plotting to kidnap the Emperor to make it so he never could either.

 

The japanese had no intention of surrending.....BUT THEN DID SURRENDER. LOL. You are entitkled to your own personal military analysis but I will take the analysis of the greatest military minds of the time over yours anyday. And they said the war was over.

 

Your message is false every time you post it. Japan was never going to surrender. Peace talks were just diversions. The Japanese were in peace talks with the USA as their aircraft carriers were launching their attack on the USA in Hawaii.

To the Japanese, only cowards and traitors surrender. They openly saw POWs as the worst people on earth - weak cowards and traitors because they had surrendered. Surrender was the worst offense, a death-penalty crime, anyone could possibly commit. Even civilians had committed mass suicide rather than surrender or allowed themselves to be captured. They killed their own children to prevent their capture.

The Japanese did not share your values towards your nation and leader. The Japanese people saw their life duty to serve, even die, for their nation and leader. Your messages show a belief in a duty to hate your country and curse your leader. On essentially any military topic involving the USA your stance is we should oppose our leader and we should surrender. Surrender to radical Islamic terrorists, to the Taliban, to ISIS, to Iran...

The Japanese were diametrically opposite from the values you portray. They were ingrained with something totally devoid in your messages - personal honor and devotion to their country and their own people.

 

For you to say Japan was never going to surrender implies you have a greater understanding of the military intelligence and military situation at the time then the greatest military minds of the day. The arrogance is laughable and easily dismissed. And you have no clue about my own military stance about over conflicts we served in ESPECIALLY THE ONE I DID SERVE IN.

 

Hmm, what an irrelevant message. The Japanese military did not decide to surrender, the Japanese Emperor did. What military minds thought was irrelevant on either side. What mattered was what civil minds thought that mattered - and they were proven correct. You non-experts had been repeatedly proven wrong.

The greatest tactical minds of the day were in agreement that the atomic bombs would cause Japan to surrender, where nothing else had, thus ending the killing and war. These great minds were proven 100% correct, the experts you cite proven 100% wrong over and over before when they got their way.

Cite any time the Japanese Emperor, the Japanese location commander or Japanese military command authorized a surrender when the troops faced starvation and total annihilation?

Since you claim the Japanese would surrender due to they couldn't win, name even one time when they did. Ever. Or admit you don't know jack about how the Japanese viewed surrendering.

 

I do not claim to know more than the military experts of the day. YOU DO. They were quite clear the bomb was not needed. You have stated your opinion....and then we have theirs.

 

Hmm, what a stupid message. The Japanese military did not decide to surrender, the Japanese Emperor did. The greatest tactical minds of the day were in agreement that the atomic bombs would cause Japan to surrender, where nothing else had, thus ending the killing and war. These great minds were proven 100% correct, the experts you cite proven 100% wrong over and over before when they got their way.

Your experts were wrong 100% of the time on the question of Japan surrendering. The experts I cited were 100% exactly correct. Experts said Clinton would win by a landslide. They were wrong too. Your military experts said we should drop atom bombs on China and Russia and your experts said N. Vietnam would surrender. Generally in your messages who you claim at the experts are essentially always proven wrong - about the past, the present and the future.

The proof is in the reality - and that reality is the experts I cite, civilian and military, were proven 100% correct and your's were proven 100% wrong.

Cite any time the Japanese surrendered when facing certain defeat and destruction on any island? Nothing, not even death, was more abhorrent, traitorous, cowardly and condemned a person spiritually than surrendering to the Japanese. This was a known, repeatedly proven fact including about Japanese civilians. Even mothers would kill their own children before herself instead of surrendering or allow capture. It was those FACTS as to why the decision was by the real experts - the final decision by our civilian government (which you despise favoring military dictatorship in your messages) made to drop the atomic bombs.

 

Lets be clear. Atomic weapons (or nuclear weapons today) will ALWAYS cause an enemy to surrender. Certainly if you use enough of them. But we did not need to use them ACCORDING TO THE GREATEST MILITARY MINDS OF THE TIME. We could have used nuclear weapons in every conflict we have been in and gotten a surrender. Every single time. But you don't use them unti, you have to. And we didn't need them. You can keep denying it but what you say will still never be true.

 

Maybe someone [Russia, Iran, Obama] sold/gave them spare parts? Outside Ft Hood, there are generations of junk thieves who braved the post for military discards.

 

The Japanese were given orders to never surrender during the course of the war. It wasn't until the juicy Abombs that they decided to. You know what this means?

America is back to back World War Champs!

 

Yep we can get everyone to surrender if we just use atomic weapons on them. EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. LOL

 

Sweet

 

The war with Japan was our last war with national survival at stake and the last war in which the USA was militarily attacked by a foreign country. We were only in "police actions" afterward.

The greatest experts of the time were proven 100% accurate and your experts were proven 100% wrong. No, wait, I should have put that in all capital letters as that would make it more persuasive.

It is revealing that by your messages that you would surrender to an adversary knowing the adversary was going to hang you or otherwise kill you if you did. Sounds fatalistic and suicidal to me.

Fifth time: Name anytime with the Japanese forces faced totally obliteration where the Emperor, local Japanese commander, or Japanese supreme military command did anything but order them to fight to the last man or any occasion with a Japanese army surrendered despite defeat a certainty - since YOU claim that Japan would have surrendered because they couldn't win. Not winning does not equate to losing. It equates to perpetual war, something we now tend to do - stupidly.

 

YOUR "experts" wanted to drop atom bombs on China over Korea and Russia over Berlin. My experts - the same who approved of dropping atom bombs on Japan - said no - and fired your experts from the military. So much for your experts opposing atomic weapons. Like always, they were always wrong.

 

The Humvees were given to the Iraqi military - and then were captured by ISIS. This was heavily covered in the media.

 

Thanks, I'd forgotten that.

 

We are not talking about China or Russia. You have cited one expert, Marshall. The president was far from an expert in any of this and you know it. I have cited over a dozen experts....and they all think the bomb was not needed.

 

No, I did not just cite Marshall. You asked who was the TOP military "expert" and my response was General Marshall as he was the EXACT general charged with the final defeat of Japan AND the General having to send all the letters telling parents and spouses their son/husband/father too had been killed by the Japanese. You just keep repeating the same false claim and the "experts" you cite were 1.) military commanders who had killed far more civilians in mass firebombing raids, 2.) advocated dropping atom bombs on both China and Russia and 3.) were 100% wrong in the past.

Once again, cite ANY example of the Emperor or any Japanese military leader ordering or even allowing ANY Japanese to ever surrender even if their deaths were not a certainty if they did not. You can not. The Japanese NEVER surrendered, nothing was more criminal, cowards, spiritually condemning and traitorous. Even their civilians committed suicide rather than being captured or surrendering. The Emperor stated the one reason he surrendered - he believed the entire Japanese race faced immediate total extinction because he had been tricked into believing we had hundreds of atom bombs and more on the way - and were imminently going to use them because Truman threatened to do just that.

 

That your "experts" has massively killed far more civilians than the atom bombs did and repeatedly wanted to go to atomic warfare discredits them fully. You have never had any response to that - other than to claim the opinions of the generals you cited about atom bombs and mass killing civilians by bombing is irrelevant - while at the same time claiming their opinion on the exact same topics means you win. It doesn't get any more absurd than that in a debate. "What my experts said on the topic is irrelevant! But those experts opinions prove my point!"

No, I did not just cite Marshall. You asked who was the TOP military "expert" and my response was General Marshall as he was the EXACT general charged with the final defeat of Japan AND the General having to send all the letters telling parents and spouses their son/husband/father too had been killed by the Japanese. You just keep repeating the same false claim and the "experts" you cite were 1.) military commanders who had killed far more civilians in mass firebombing raids, 2.) advocated dropping atom bombs on both China and Russia and 3.) were 100% wrong in the past.

I also pointed out that military opinions in both Japan and the USA did not matter. The decisions were made by civilians - including on the Japanese side. The true experts were the civilian experts, not the military commanders.

Once again, for the 6th time - cite ANY example of the Emperor or any Japanese military leader ordering or even allowing ANY Japanese to ever surrender even if their deaths were not a certainty if they did not. It is YOUR claim the Japanese would surrender because they could not win. In fact, they ALWAYS did the exact opposite. The Japanese pursuing peace talks was proven to be preludes to and attempts to divert from military attacks.

You can not give on example where your analysis was anything but 100% wrong - always - 100% of the time. The Japanese NEVER surrendered, nothing was more criminal, cowards, spiritually condemning and traitorous. Even their civilians committed suicide rather than being captured or surrendering. The Emperor stated the one reason he surrendered - he believed the entire Japanese race faced immediate total extinction because he had been tricked into believing we had hundreds of atom bombs and more on the way - and were imminently going to use them because Truman threatened to do just that.

 

Yeah, your Russia allies without whose enormous help the outcome of WW2 might not have been so certain. Then again America is used to betrayal...

Furthermore as a fighting force Japan was spent; it had no fuel bar a very poor synthetic, hopeless for its few remaining aircraft, hardly any food for the population, no navy and a decimated army. The bombs were little more than a demonstration for Stalin, and pretty pointless at that, as the USSR very soon developed her own nuclear weapons capability. All of this 'millions of lives saved' nonsense has become a historical 'truth'; an invasion of Japan would have been a walkover.