Correct The Golden Rule - "Treat others as you would be Treated - do unto others as you would have them do to you" Matt 7:12 " The Rule that sums up the Law and the Prophets".
So the only thing Hitler did wrong was lose. Right? So if your daughter went abroad and it was done to her, you'd feel no sense of injustice. Right? No one ever drew breath who actually believes this.
Starting Second Thessalonians for the second time in my new one, on the first round I marked 5:15 on the second I marked 5:21: “Prove all things; hold fast to that which is good.” Like, no use of unverified dossiers before swearing to a FISA court. In the new one I have, a compact Holman, it says, “reading the Bible through from Genesis 1 to Revelations 22 is not the best way…you would be a long time getting to the life and ministry of Jesus…” I followed their scheme, Genesis, Job, and Matthew, about a chapter in each per day, it was funny because at times the new and old would contrast in such a way that some would say “contradict.” I get where MoHamMad got his bad from, and it wasn’t Jesus.
I do not spend too much NT time on Pauline scripture. Not that there are not some good things but, Paul conflicts with the teachings of Jesus and so some of Paul's (and the books not written by Paul but attributed to him) should be taken with a grain of salt. Mark and Matt are the primary source docs to try to understand the teachings of Jesus and James comes from this perspective. Reading John with any clarity requires an understanding of the time in which John was written and what the Author was trying to do. John uses the term "Logos" (mistranslated in modern bibles as "the word"). While it is true that Logos can mean word, this term, when used in a religious context, had a very specific meaning to any Greek person living during the time of John. The term Logos already had a long history dating back to before Plato. In a religious context this term means "emissary between man and God". The author of John was trying to broaden the appeal of Christianity to Pauline Christians ( most if not all of which who Greek or Greek speaking) by using terminology and ideas which they were familiar. Jesus was the "Logos" and he conveyed the message of God to man through the Holy Spirit. This represents another evolution in the divinity of Jesus. In Mark Jesus is made divine at his baptism. Mark is the oldest and first of the Gospels (dating to around 65 AD) It is also the Gospel that has a somewhat credible link to the disciples - Tradition holds that the author was a student and interpreter for Peter. In Matt, which is written at least a few decades after (80-100 AD) uses all of Mark as a source document sans a few passages the author finds derogatory to Christ and/or the disciples. In Matt Jesus is depicted as being divine at birth. Matt also adds the smoking gun - the story of Jesus appearing in the flesh after death. The story in Mark ends with an empty tomb (the long ending of Mark was added centuries later) There is some question as to whether or not the "smoking gun" was originally in Matt as Clement (first Pauline Pope/leader of the Church around 95-100AD) has no knowledge of the physical resurrection story. The author of John is writing (90-120 AD) Christianity has evolved and with it the dogma. The divinity of Jesus is elevated further - rather than being divine at birth, Jesus is now "Pre-existent". John however does not go as far as claiming that Jesus "is" God - as much as folks would like to believe. Sure there is an early form of the Trinity - Father, Son and Holy Spirit but, they are not one. The Son is not the Father. Jesus is not viewed as being "homoousious" - one substance with the Father. All of the early Church Fathers and Christians at this time were Subordinationinsts - believed that Jesus was subordinate to the Father. It took another 200 years for Jesus to be elevated to "God - God of Abraham". This was decreed by Emperor Constantine. The Church had been fighting over the divine nature of Jesus since his death and even after Constantine the fight raged for many more centuries. Constantine wanted to end this fighting and set up a new "Universal/Catholic" Church with himself as "Pontifex Maximus" ... essentially usurping Christ as the next Logos - one who speaks for God. Standard practice for all of the most powerful Emperors. If one's desire is to understand the message and the teachings of the Logos, one must understand the history of the time and the history of the Church. Modern Christian Dogma often has little connection to the message of Jesus.
“For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.” 1 Peter 2:25 People get lost in the translations, fighting over words, whether wine was new wine (grape juice), sprinkled or dunked, circumcised or not, we just don’t listen enough. I don’t buy that anyone must know anything about history of time or history of church to get any of it. There probably is no Paul, John, or Peter on the planet Giedi Prime, no our time or history. I bet if we actually could see the Universe, we would find more Spirit of Truth than the typical ark builder could imagine.
I think there was a messiah. His name was probably Jesus and he likely had disciples. I laughed at your comment on "wine/grape juice". In my younger years I knew Pentecostals that would try that line. Given that the Sumerians were making beer as far back as 5000 BC ... I think the writers of the Gospels some 5000 years later knew the difference between wine and grape juice. The most significant sacrament - aka the Eucharist/communion - the eating of Gods Flesh and Drinking the God's blood .. involves wine and not grape juice. The idea that some Christian groups have changed this most sacred ritual due to silly dogma is very much ,,, nonsense and only renders the ritual less meaningful. Sure folks can get something out of the Bible without knowing the history but, the chances of getting the wrong thing are greatly increased. In term of the spirit of truth... the truth is that Christian dogma has drifted far away from the Truth contained in the message of Jesus.... and this is unfortunate.
If God didn't create evil, then it's out of his control. Isaiah 25:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
Yes, this is called the problem of evil. God is either not all powerful, or he is evil himself. An all good, all powerful being would never allow evil to exist. So god is either not all good, or not all powerful.
God created evil to give everyone the choice. God IS the creator. God doesn't make bad things happen, like the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah, evil did that....they chose evil.
What about when god "hardened the pharoh's heart and forced him to refuse to release the Hebrews? And according to the new testament, Judas was driven to betray Jesus by god...that he was "chosen" and predestined to betray Jesus, and had no choice, but is then punished for the act that god forced him into.
What about when god "hardened the pharoh's heart and forced him to refuse to release the Hebrews? No different than any other atheist that doesn't have the "God gene". But it doesn't mean that God won't give it to them in the next incarnation. Think about Pharaoh's karma that he received..."you shall reap what you sow." And according to the new testament, Judas was driven to betray Jesus by god...that he was "chosen" and predestined to betray Jesus, and had no choice, but is then punished for the act that god forced him into. Jesus did say to Judas, "Go and do what you MUST do." But God didn't punish Judas....Judas couldn't live with what he had done. No different than Peter denying Jesus three times, accept Peter's destiny was different.
Ah, karma, another superstitious, childish concept ... just like god. I suggest you spend more time dealing with factual material and science, 'hangover ... and less time thinking about childish crap...
The Pharoh refused to release the Hebrews because god made him do so. This is what is meant by god hardening his heart. He made it so that Pharoh would be deaf to all pleas from Moses. It wasn't a matter of him refusing to on his own and god sending plagues to punish him for the choice. God made it so that he would refuse no matter what and then punished him for something that wasn't his choice. God never gave him any choice, his intent from the start was to make an example of the Egyptians.
Funny how Grugore continued to insist that the Bible does not teach that his god creates all evil. But in making cites from that same Bible, he conclusively proves that his god DOES create all evil. Funny about Grugore, ain't it?
I do not think it is a lack of ability to understand the simple logical theorem If A=B and B=C then A=C .. that is the problem here. Its that when reality conflicts with dogma logic goes out the window. If God made Humans and Humans are evil then God made evil Its not complicated. If God is all powerful, all knowing and so on. Could God not make a being that was not evil ? ummmmm ohhhhhh oooofffff duuuuu UUUUHHHHHH .. If one agrees that God has the power to make a non evil being then obviously God intended the existence of evil. That the Bible says "God sent Evil" is priceless no getting out of that one. The silent treatment is all I will get out of that post.
Dogma comes from texts and “the history of the time and history of the Church,” which sustains it; the texts and “Hadith” become an unchangeable constitution and a tyranny over the Spirit of Truth. My point is that what you said here is wrong because it assumes by its “must” charge, the Holy Spirit does not exist: “If one's desire is to understand the message and the teachings of the Logos, one must understand the history of the time and the history of the Church. Modern Christian Dogma often has little connection to the message of Jesus.” (Giftedone) “I don’t buy that anyone must know anything about history of time or history of church to get any of it. There probably is no Paul, John, or Peter on the planet Giedi Prime, no our time or history. I bet if we actually could see the Universe, we would find more Spirit of Truth than the typical ark builder could imagine.” (My response to that) The chances of getting the wrong thing are greatly increased by worshiping idols (Prophets, texts, and history). Jesus was trying to get us away from that Idol worship, and making a direct connection with the Father. The very concept of that Spirit in all of us amplifies the ancient Law of Hospitality, it is not just worrying about Odysseus maybe being transformed into a beggar, and finding the mistreatment of the beggar in his home to be the worst crime of the suiters, now you must respect more and fear more. Once you get away from that Idol worship, you logically progress to where the Spirit is there is freedom (of speech and the press…). PS. I did a bad thing during the Bush administration; I sent a Sumerian beer recipe to one of our men in Iraq.
the problem with so many religious pundits (most of whom come from the far right side of politics) is that their thinking abilities are too limited and they lack the ability to think logically - small wonder why they lose these debates so often as happened with Grugore
The Bible requires its adherents to be humble. Let's see if "Christian" Grugore has enough character to admit he was defeated in this thread and for him to concede that his god does create all evil.
Would someone please turn off the Robot, or maybe upgrade its stupid program to have some artificial intelligence so it can create something.
