Does a decline in religion/spiritualy, mirror a declining moral state?

Do you know what a court appointed attorney does? They take an oath to provide an aggressive defense.

 

Well, yeah, if he believed that the right thing to do was to be good to people, regardless of God, then losing his faith in God would not have made him evil.

This is of course under a number of caveats, for instance, only insofar that he didn't think that what he was doing was actually good, and that by encountering the idea, I don't necessarily mean explicitly.

 

My view is that religion has been used as a cover for morals that have been abandoned. Behave one way during the week, behave another way on Sunday and get absolution for your sins.

 

That is too funny.

You have to get to Matthew 5:23 before anything approaching morality shows up. Here is a review =

1. If you go to church and remember that yiu and your brother are on the outs leave the cash in the offering plate and then go make up with your brother.
2. Quickly agree with you adversary so that you won't get sued and thrown in jail.
3. Cut off your body parts if they cause you to sin. Really?
4. If you get married you have to stay married until death or else you're committing adultery. A man can't marry a divorcee.
5. Never swear an oath of any kind about anything.

6. Do not resist the evil person. If he wants to abuse you be happy.
7. If someone asks for your stuff close your yap and give it to him and do not ask for it back.
8. Love your enemies and treat them like they are the most wonderful people on the planet. So how will you treat your *friends*?
9. Do all of your charitable worth in private.
10. No public praying. I fully agree with this one.

11. Forgive everyone with mistreats you.
12. Do some fasting without appears to fast. Is this really a moral issue?
13. Do not accumulate wealth and stuff. So homeless and poor people must be more moral than anyone else who has anything at all.
14. Do not serve two masters. Go with the one who offers the better deal.
15. Do not worry about tomorrow. If you have nothing do not sweat it. You can always eat grass and bugs.

16. Never hold anyone accountable. You are worse than the other person.
17. While you are supposed to give whatever someone asks of you without a second thought you have to keep that holy stuff to yourself.
18. Do unto others as you would have them do to you. So if you are OK with being abused then you can abuse others.
19. Beware of false prophets (all tv preachers).

Are there any significant moral teachings there or is it all nonsense? How do you spin it?

 

decline in religion? here we go again! religion and morals do not decline they shift.

I dont have a problem with that any more than I have a problem with any gender washrooms.

thats what makes atheism so attractive.

I didnt make that a huge project but my review came up with the same conclusion.

Morality is based upon what people value not where religion comes into play. Like so much of the atheist mantra your hypothesis is bassackwards.

Then over the top and off the deep end, the exercise of ones morals creates the religion not the other way around. Going a step further religion creates culture. Instead of pissing away my time here maybe I will write a book and title it 'the problem with atheists'.

 

Morals can change, but there are some which are basic to human beings such as rules against murder and theft.

 

morals stolen from the 'religious'! .....and of course as soon as they are stolen then they magically become a secular creation.

 

Which came first: Human beings or religion? Obviously the former. Atheists want to believe humans invented religion out of fear, but I think it's out of spiritual need. The problem, IMO, is that religions often become dogmatic over spiritually fulfilling.

 

the problem is that everything becomes dogmatic once a person or group believes they found the best answer to any question,even the atheists religion.

 

You seem to be assuming (begging the question) that one must be brainwashed by Religion in order to be moral or ethical.

 

Do you think people are born moral or ethical? Or are they conditioned to be?

 

It could, in theory I suppose. But morality is not the only driver of the abandonment of religion. While religion might be a vehicle for teaching morals, it's primary use and reason for creation was to explain what could not be explained. Modern science is filling in those blanks in a far more authoritative way than religion ever has or will. There are still blanks and spaces for God to live in, but they are shrinking and a pittance of what they once were. People don't need religions to explain the sun and stars, diseases, mental illnesses, chemistry, and other wonders.

All the morality contained in human religions were made up by humans in the first place, there's no reason we need a deity in order to have morals.

 

Oh my.
I bet most of the 68 gender could reproduce. I bet the female sex still ovulate and the male sex still have sperm.
You are free to have your own opinions.

 

It is one of life's biggest questions: Are we born knowing the difference between good and evil? Or are we taught our moral beliefs by parents and society?
Philosophers and psychologists have long believed that babies are born "blank slates," and that it is the role of parents and society to teach babies the difference between right and wrong; good and bad; mean and nice.
But a growing number of researchers now believe differently. They believe babies are in fact born with an innate sense of morality, and while parents and society can help develop a belief system in babies, they don't create one. A team of researchers at Yale University's Infant Cognition Center, known as The Baby Lab, showed us just how they came to that conclusion.
https://www.cnn.com/2014/02/12/us/baby-lab-morals-ac360/index.html

Depends if one believes studies done.

 

Thanks for the link. It makes sense that there would be a genetic predisposition to "good" social behavior since tribes with those genetics are more likely to survive than those without them.

 

My opinion also, if we were not built with some innate of right or wrong, we'd all be wild animals.
Maybe we are, but empathy gave us morals?

 

I am talking about the Enlightenment view of Natural Law, not the revised progressive one.

MORALITY, and ethics are the issue, not religion.. though how can one have moral absolutes without a religious basis? And, is not 'moral relativism', aka 'amorality', a conclusion of atheistic naturalism? The state religion?

'Memorized dogma' exactly describes indoctrinees from the state institutions, indoctrinating the state religion of atheistic naturalism.

The actions, whether they be defined as 'moral!, immoral!, or amoral!', all proceed from the ideological beliefs. The harvest of crime, corruption, immorality, greed, and social decline DIRECTLY correlates to the seeds of atheistic naturalism, amorality, and relativism. We have reaped what we have sown, as a culture.

How does one have morals or ethics without a philosophical or 'religious!' basis?

Even amorality assumes atheism, a belief about the universe. There is a basis for all thoughts, words, and actions. We do not exist in a philosophical vacuum.

 

Secular laws against these things go back thousands of years. Taboos against them ate as old as our mirror neurons -- ie, for as long as we've been a species. Religions sometimes adopted and codified them, but have often been selective about their application. Murder is bad in the Bible for example . . . except when it comes to killing apostates or murdering Canaanite infants, etc.

 

No.


Thanks for asking.

 

Good grief this is misguided. Atheism encourages no such thing - nor does secularism.

It was secularism that is responsible for the founding principle - respect for individual liberty.

It is the Protestant doctrine of "Sola Fide" - Salvation by Faith alone which encouraged no responsibility for one's deeds.

 

No, that's just plain false.

The human body is not even remotely that simple.

There are numerous systems. These systems do not work in some sort of binary lock step. And, that is certainly true for sex.

You admit the existence of hermaphroditism, but that is only one kind of evidence of the complexity of sex.

 

OP...Yes! Religion & gods are no longer popular. Conservative views are no longer popular. And lack of values has a trickle down effect on all aspects on American life.

 

You have it backwards. The "enlightenment" tried to create something new and different out of natural law. Natural law is natural law. Period.

There is a sound history of philosophy that is not an expression of religion. It's a false idea that the threat of hell is required.

You'll have to explain this "state religion" thing.

There you go again with your totally undefined "atheistic naturalism" - and now you extend it with claiming that there are "seeds"!!!

Our culture is deeply seated in the western concept of God and the various versions of the Christian religion.

If we're failing, it's because Christianity is inadequate.

For example, please show me where Christianity is keeping capitalism in check, so that wage earning Americans can play along. Please show me where Christianity is supporting democracy and our universal right of suffrage. Please show me where Christianity is standing against sexual abuse - whether it is assault accepted (TWICE now just on the SC) within our justice system or the Catholic Church.

You don't get to claim Christianity is the answer if it isn't actually an answer to anything.

 

[QUOTE="FatBack, post: 1069704066, member: 79158"Do the morals go away as religion/spirituality is increasingly abandoned by society?[/QUOTE]
That depends upon the religion. I would dare say that morality probably increased with the extinction of the Mya and the Inca. On the other hand, Christianity brought us the enlightenment and the scientific method; as well as, the Judeo-Christian traditions which has, thus far, been far superior to all others especially when it comes to morality.

 

Utterly false and ridiculous. Rational, secular thought brought us those things, and they eventually flourished rather in spite of christianity.