Trump pardons former Army Ranger convicted of killing Iraqi prisoner

Discussion in 'Warfare / Military' started by Pred, May 7, 2019.

  1. Reasonablerob

    Reasonablerob Well-Known Member

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    You really have no clue do you? Saddam was a dictator and kept the Shia oppressed to the degree they couldn't even rebel against him, when they did he put down the Marsh Arabs killing over 100,000 in that campaign alone. It is unclear whether dismissing the Bathists caused more problems than keeping them in their positions would have which would have outraged the Shia. How exactly did disbanding the Sunni officials put shop keepers and gardeners out of work?
     
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  2. Reasonablerob

    Reasonablerob Well-Known Member

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    His base voters would be horrified because they believe in religious freedom but then so does Trump.
     
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  3. Turin

    Turin Well-Known Member

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    And, let me guess. In your opinion, a fair trial means he should be found innocent. Any other verdict and its an "unfair" trial. right?
     
  4. Turin

    Turin Well-Known Member

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    Most of them dont consider Islam a religion.
     
  5. PrincipleInvestment

    PrincipleInvestment Well-Known Member

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    That's extreme ... but you're certainly free to express your opinion. Who knows ... that could go viral. :thumbsup:
     
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  6. Reasonablerob

    Reasonablerob Well-Known Member

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    Why would you think that?
     
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  7. Reasonablerob

    Reasonablerob Well-Known Member

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    1. Learn to use an apostrophe.

    2. Substantiate your allegation.
     
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  8. Ddyad

    Ddyad Well-Known Member

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    The essence of a fair trial is a verdict from an independent jury.
     
  9. notme

    notme Well-Known Member

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    Well, for starters the 100.000's of Iraqi's who are dead would disagree. So would their families.
    And the country is not peaceful at all.
     
  10. 61falcon

    61falcon Well-Known Member

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    Murder is murder whether committed by someone in uniform or not.Stabbing a naked unarmed man multiple times in the neck is murder plain and simple, and his MILITARY BRETHERN agreed.
     
  11. notme

    notme Well-Known Member

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    The US went to Iraq to stop the WMD threat. There was no threat. The US lied that Iraq had WMD's.
    And the US is responsible for the safety of those civilians killed by the insurgents.
    It is so, because the US got rid of their police force, their justice system,... to deliberately throw the country in total chaos.
    It's not even an argument that the US is responsible. It's a FACT, that the occupying power has that responsibility.
    We all agreed on this. Don't invade if you don't want to be responsible. Such is the law.
     
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  12. notme

    notme Well-Known Member

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    No I mean the reporters of Reuters. The pilots laughed at it when they slaughtered them. It was recorded, and locked away as top secret. And than came wikileaks. That is what the US is about. You got the president giving a soldier a pardon, for disobeying a order by refusing to let a prisoner go,... instead of that the psycho had him strip naked and executed him out of .... "self defense".

    Dude... it aint no secret that the US was fully complicit by the WMD attacks made by Saddam on Iraqi and Iranian civilians. They supplied the resources they gave battlefield intelligence and advice to go. And the US supported this all the way in the UN Security Council.
     
  13. mdrobster

    mdrobster Well-Known Member

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    iraq may be better off in the long, but it was a serious sacrifice. that said, there is no guarantee it will be usa friendly, and if that does happen, those that sacrificed, will truly have nothing.

    iraq was a huge gamble, i am not sure it has paid off, especially since it is now more iran frienldly.
     
  14. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    More crap from you! "Over 100,000" marsh Arabs were not killed, they were displaced because the rivers were damned draining the marshes. The majority of them went to Iran and the rest moved to the cities. But over 500,000 Iraqis died because of your sanctions

    Those garderners and shop keepers were part of the one and a half million Baarth members who were all sacked in one go without any pay.
     
  15. Reasonablerob

    Reasonablerob Well-Known Member

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    Really? Look at it now? How many would Saddam have killed had we left him or his odious sons in power? Find me Iraqis who wish Saddam was still in power?

    The Iraq death toll is unclear but most agree it is between 100,000-200,000 although about a third of those are insurgents.
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2019
  16. Reasonablerob

    Reasonablerob Well-Known Member

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    Of course there were WMDs, come on, everyone knows that!
    Saddam had about 5000 nerve agent bombs and shells from his 1990s stockpile, he could easily have provided it to any number of the terrorist groups he supported and they could have smuggled it into the US.
    https://www.nytimes.com/interactive...t/us-casualties-of-iraq-chemical-weapons.html
    Saddam continued to develop (but not manufacture) chemical weapons whose sophistication shocked inspectors and were still lethal enough to poison the troops who found them a decade later.
    https://www.cia.gov/library/reports/general-reports-1/iraq_wmd_2004/chap5.html#sect3
    Saddam maintained his vast Uranium stockpile and never lost his desire to attain WMDs, despite the fact he could have sold it on the civil nuclear market for tens of millions of dollars (as the post liberation Iraq's democratic government later did).
    www.nbcnews.com/id/25546334/ns/world_news-mideast_n_africa/t/secret-us-mission-hauls-uranium-iraq/#.XKMfuPZFzIU
    Saddam did have connections with AQ, meeting up with them to see if he should sponsor them but turning them down as too wild for him. No one EVER claimed Saddam was behind 9/11, that was a link people made in their minds but not by the administration. The worse you can accuse the administration of is believing what they wanted to hear from the Iraqi exiles, just like in the first Gulf War? Remember the Kuwaiti nurse who gave heartrending testimony of the babies who died because the Iraqi soldiers stole their incubators? Turned out all to be baloney and she was the daughter of the Kuwaiti ambassador? But who wouldn't tell a few white lies to be liberated from a tyrant?

    The US is not responsible for the murderous actions of the various terrorist groups, they should be praised for defeating them.
     
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  17. Reasonablerob

    Reasonablerob Well-Known Member

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    Don't talk nonsense, even Assange to give him credit states that pilots had no way of knowing they were journalists (and not terrorists recording their attacks for propaganda purposes) or that they may have mistaken their camera gear for weapons. These pilots were firing on terrorist RPG teams, even if they knew there were journalists there it would still be justified,

    Bro, the US was not complicit with Saddam's WMD attacks, they just didn't want Iran to win.
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2019
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  18. Reasonablerob

    Reasonablerob Well-Known Member

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    Ahem;

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1991_uprisings_in_Iraq

    Looks like I was wrong, the death toll could have been up to 180,000? You're right about the draining afterwards, ethnic cleansing by Saddam.
     
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  19. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    LOL. Your link even uses similar words as in my post! "the Iraqi government intensified a prior systematic forced relocation of Marsh Arabs and the draining of the Mesopotamian Marshes in the Tigris–Euphrates river system."

    And the rest of your link refers to a civil war against, direct quote out of your link, "Islamists", and other groups "you" have listed as a terrorist group. Oh and your link states "25000-180,000" with the word "edit" on every paragraph; hardly a reliable source!

    So much for your claim that over 100,000 Marsh Arabs were killed. As I said, you have no clue
     
  20. Reasonablerob

    Reasonablerob Well-Known Member

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    You really have no clue, do you? If you want to back-pedal get a mountain bike! Yes, Saddam ethnically cleansed them as you admit after slaughtering them. Sure the marsh Arabs were Islamist but all that means was they were Shias who opposed his dictatorship and had been persecuted under his rule, they weren't a terrorist group, they weren't using violence for political means within a free and democratic society, they just wanted to be free.
    The figure is 25,000-180,000, the evidence is mass graves uncovered and reports by Human Rights Watch and was strong enough to send chemical Ali to the gallows.
     
  21. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    LOL, "as I admit"! I am the one who informed you after your clueless claim that over 100,000 Marsh Arabs were slaughtered. And I did not say that the Marsh Arabs were Islamists! You clearly did not even bother to read your own link
     
  22. Reasonablerob

    Reasonablerob Well-Known Member

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    Yes, you admit it that Saddam ethnically cleansed the Marsh Arabs by draining their habitat. You did say 'Islamists and other groups' and you are now desperately flannelling rather than admit the truth. Just say you were wrong, people would respect you more if you did.
     
  23. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    You even struggle with comprehension!
     
  24. notme

    notme Well-Known Member

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    Yes really a 100.000 Iraqi's would disagree, and their families. There are polls made in 2007 that show the majority of the Iraq's support attacks against Americans troops. They are having a vote these days to actually kick out the entire American army out of Iraq.

    https://www.counterpunch.org/2008/01/05/the-us-occupation-and-popular-opinion-in-iraq/
    https://www.thetrumpet.com/18625-iraqi-parliament-oust-us-forces

    The US is still responsible. I already explained this.
     
  25. notme

    notme Well-Known Member

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