Major Study Finds Masks Don’t Reduce COVID-19 Infection Rates <<MOD WARNING>>

Nothing new here.

 

Call it what you like, but 340,000 excess deaths from any viral disease is something to be concerned about

 

Feb 1st 2020
"There's no doubt after reading this paper that asymptomatic transmission is occurring," said Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute for Allergy and Infectious Diseases. "This study lays the question to rest."
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/01/31/health/coronavirus-asymptomatic-spread-study/index.html

 

I’ve provided quotes of everything I’ve claimed he said. Please read them and comment on them. Then we will proceed.

 

I saw you posted an extract from an interview done in July but that is not relevant. He could have misspoke answering leading questions in an hour long interview. Whatever he said in July had no bearing to behaviour of people in February to June. What is relevant is what he said to the public at the time in February, at the time it mattered, and that is what I have posted. So do you have back up to your claims of what Fauci said when it mattered regarding homemade masks being equivalent to HCW masks, regarding him saying in march that he did not know Covid can be spread by asymptomatic carriers?

 

Me as well... he said that right before he made it his POINT that the country would be running out of masks, and so they should only be there for those who really must have them.
You're just deliberately taking 1 line out of context to end up with a lie.
tss tss

Indeed I am. You can not deny Fauci made A POINT... specific A POINT that his advise was based on the lack of masks, when you watch his interview back of 60 minutes.

He indeed didn't want to wear masks, and made it a thing to mock his political rival with it to appease his fascist back bone.

 

There is no relevance. You need to decide what masks Fauci wanted to save for healthcare workers. You figure that out and report specifically what you think it is he didn’t want you or I to take from healthcare workers.

“Right now in the United States people should not be walking around with masks”.
Direct quote from Fauci in the March 60 minutes interview. It’s been posted repeatedly in this thread.

This is either a lie or outright incompetence. We have known, as my links show, that masks do work and would work in March 2020 to slow the spread of disease.

On March 20, there were 3000+ daily confirmed cases in New York and about 80 people died of Covid that day in New York. Infection rates were in exponential growth.

In March people dang sure should have been wearing a mask. Any claim otherwise is outright denial of science or an outright lie.

No, I post facts.

Do you find it interesting at all that Fauci also claimed masks were to keep infected people from spreading the disease but then claimed masks were needed to protect medical workers from infected patients? Do you suppose all those masks Fauci saved by lying to you went on the mugs of healthcare workers, or on the mugs of patients? You people will swallow any kind of lie from the “right person” and ask for more. It’s unbelievable.

Your point is irrelevant. There were thousands of infections per day just in New York the day Fauci told that lie. What about those infected persons? Shouldn’t they have had masks?

The shortage is irrelevant to the lie. You want to be lied to. I don’t. I want the truth.

As I said, we’ve known all respiratory viruses spread asymptomatically. Here’s a John Hopkins piece on influenza from 16 years ago.
https://www.centerforhealthsecurity.org/cbn/2005/cbnreport_103105.html

Any virologist or epidemiologist would know Covid could spread asymptomatically as soon as it

Post #1603 of this thread.

Donald is irrelevant to lies told by Fauci. If you want Trump to be responsible for his lies, as he should be, Fauci should be responsible for Fauci’s lies.

I’ve quoted the interview repeatedly. He lied more times than I can count. Every time I watch it I find a lie I overlooked before. The man is a pathological liar.

I don’t want to scapegoat anyone. I want everyone to tell the truth. I want those who lie to be held to account. Donald, Fauci, the media—all the liars.

 

The interview was on 8th March, not the 20th.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/coronavirus-containment-dr-jon-lapook-60-minutes-2020-03-08/

By March 8th, there were 504 total cases across the whole country and 22 deaths

 

I don't need to decide a thing. Fauci was not talking about N95 masks. You brought it up for nothing.

You're deliberately leaving out that it was HIS POINT, he literally says it is HIS POINT that it is so, because they would be running out of masks.
You're refusing to comment on this, in order to come up with fake accusations.

Pathetic

It was a known fact that there weren't enough for them.

You're leaving out 2 facts to come up with fallacies.

 

Yes. That’s correct. How many cases were in China, or South Korea?

By March 11 even the WHO had to admit it was a pandemic. The WHO did so based on their concerns of skyrocketing cases and inaction. Probably watched Fauci on 60 minutes and made the inaction determination.

At what point of a pandemic do you prefer action? At the beginning? Do you think Fauci was denied information the WHO had? Or South Korea? Why do we need an out of control pandemic before an “expert” decides the common folk need protecting?

 

No evidence? If you want to use March 8, the date of the interview on 60 minutes, there were 504 active cases that day in the US. That day there had been 22 deaths. That’s a basically 4.36% case fatality rate. And you think we should have compared that to the flu? South Korea had seen cases go from 98 daily cases February 21 to 850 daily confirmed on March 3. Don’t you think Fauci was aware of these facts? Who would have laughed if Fauci would have presented these facts I just presented and recommended mask wearing March 8? South Korea advised their population to wear masks in the presence of others on February 27. Are South Korean health officials smarter than Fauci? Or do they care more about saving lives? Or did Fauci lie?

For perspective, you would have laughed at and scorned Fauci for recommending masks on March 8. I had already gone into voluntary self quarantine because I recognized the danger.

Post #1603

I’ve not “claimed” he said anything. Everything is directly attributed to him in links I’ve provided. He’s on record saying everything I’ve presented.

You’ve presented evidence here that proves my point. Fauci isn’t stupid, he lied knowingly. In July he said he didn’t recommend masks early (March) because he didn’t know C19 could be spread asymptomatically. He said when it became clear it “could”, he had to recommend masks. So in February he admits knowing it could spread asymptomatically, but on March 8 he flat out lied and said there was no reason to wear a mask. If Fauci really decided he had to recommend masks based on knowledge C19 could spread asymptomatically, he would have had to recommend them on March 8.

Your attempted defense of Fauci confirms the false statements are lies and not incompetence. That’s been my take all along. I thank you for providing proof of my assertions Fauci ought to have known about asymptomatic spread of respiratory viruses. You’ve taken the incompetence defense off the table and confirmed his statements were intentional lies.

On masks specifically, if masks were for infected persons only to protect others, why would we save them for healthcare workers? Did he think the healthcare workers were all infected? Were the masks really for healthcare providers as he claimed on March 8 or just for hospitalized patients? The man has you guys so tied in knots the lack of logic in his lies doesn’t even register.

 

If you say he was not comparing homemade masks to N95’s then you are saying the masks he was protecting the supply of for healthcare workers were not N95 quality masks. You can’t have it both ways. If he wasn’t protecting supplies of N95’s then what was the point of his lie? Healthcare workers could have just seen two pieces of cotton together and been fine.

I’ve never refused to comment on the shortage of masks. I’ve repeatedly talked about how South Korea fixed their problem and we didn’t.


If you continue to defend a liar based on the liar having a point, why do you guys complain so much about Trump lying? Some people think his lies make a point, should we excuse him because some people think he has a point? A lie is judged on whether the statement is factual or not. Not on if people think it makes a “point”.

Ok. So there isn’t enough vaccine for everyone today. Should Fauci (or anyone) go on television and state there’s no reason for anyone in the US to get a vaccine? Your arguments are frankly absurd.

Nope. You get all the facts from me.

 

IF YOUR TIME IS SHORT

• In early March, Fauci said “there's no reason to be walking around with a mask.”
  
  
• In the same interview, he said people could wear masks if they liked, but they wouldn’t get perfect protection, and it would further pinch what at the time was a short supply of masks for doctors and nurses.
  
  
• After researchers discovered that asymptomatic people were spreading the virus, the public health community shifted to recommending that everyone wear a mask.
  

See the sources for this fact-check

PolitiFact | Marco Rubio says Anthony Fauci lied about masks. Fauci didn’t.

 

This is the story of another avoidable tragedy in the Trump administration’s bungling fight against the coronavirus. It draws from internal emails and memos, a federal whistleblower complaint, and congressional testimony by federal officials and private executives. That record provides a startling glimpse behind the scenes of an administration deaf to timely and dire warnings beginning in January about the need to accelerate N95 mask procurement and production to protect healthcare workers. Despite these urgent appeals the Department of Health and Human Services dragged its feet until the middle of March before signing contracts to buy significant quantities of masks. The president failed to use his powers under the Defense Production Act to require mask production until April — and even then in quantities far below the nation’s need.
The Trump Administration's N95 Mask Failures Are Deadly - Rolling Stone

He didn't need Fauci to tell him.
They left him a book with directions, but alas.........

 

You proved yourself you never watched his interview when you're saying this, yet you claim he lied on it.
What a joke! You're just parroting fake news you read on farcebook.

You're not paying attention. I already told you he was talking about masks people wear in China and South Korea... them are 3M.
You proved yourself you never watched his interview when you're saying this, yet you claim he lied on it.
What a joke! You're just parroting fake news you read on farcebook.

You're forgetting 3M masks. You clearly got no clue what this is about.

Facts? You never watched what he said on 60 minutes but wrongfully accuse him of lying on it.
Hydroxychloroquine, a hell of a drug to covfefe way.


All you're doing is parroting fake ultra right wing news.
The crap that got people rallied to attack the capitol.

 

Well there’s a lot of misleading information in your source. The claim researchers didn’t know about asymptotic spread at the time is false. And verified above in a post defending Fauci. Post #1166.

It’s also confirmed by existing research at the time on every other respiratory virus exhibiting asymptotic spread.

Your source also fails to address the inconsistency of Fauci claiming masks were only useful for infected people, but in the same statement claiming they were needed for healthcare workers.

And yes, in March would have been the best time to wear masks. Pandemics are easily controlled early when infections are low. There is no justification for saying what Fauci did in March. As an epidemiologist he shouldn’t need me to tell him that.

This just shows people will believe anything if they like the source. Facts don’t seem to matter at all.

 

This statement by Fauci was not in the 60 Minutes interview. I never claimed it was. I posted the source, an interview with Nora O’Donnell. And I posted the pull quote with the statement.

So you now claim he was protecting Korean 3M masks for US healthcare workers? You know 3M makes over 15 different medical mask types? Saying “them are 3M” is meaningless.

I’ve quoted directly from the video. LOL

What 3M mask? Was Fauci protecting N95 masks, Korean masks, 3M dust masks, or homemade masks? You need to pick one type. You can’t claim he was protecting mask supply for healthcare workers if they weren’t high quality N95 type masks.

I’ve repeatedly quoted the interview word for word. He told numerous lies in the 60 Minute interview. He told more lies in the O’Donnell interview.

That’s impossible. I don’t watch any news. From any wing. Media (all media) almost never reports facts. I want nothing to do with media.

 

I think we are talking about Fauci, aren't we?
I don't see anything in #1166 saying Fauci said anything about asymptomatics.
I know
WHO said some strange things about that time.

From the link. Seems it applies in this case.

Fauci’s critics have focused on his words "there's no reason to be walking around with a mask." But in the same interview, he also said that it was "fine" to wear a mask, although it wouldn’t offer perfect protection. And he said the main point was to preserve masks for those who were already ill and people providing care.

On March 27, Fauci spoke to a San Francisco NBC affiliate. He said given the shortage of masks, the general public ranked last behind doctors and nurses, and people who are infected.

"When we say you don't need to wear a mask, what we're really saying is make sure you prioritize it first for the people who need the mask," Fauci said. "In a perfect world, if you had all the masks you wanted, then you could get some degree of protection, but make sure you prioritize it well."

 

Yes Fauci.

Well, a few days after Fauci said there was no reason to wear a mask in the US the WHO declared a pandemic, citing rising cases and lack of action to stop spread as justification. They got that one right. Blind squirrels found a nut. Fauci surely wasn’t taking action.

I suppose some people are awed by “fact checker’s” logic. But saying an action is fine after saying it isn’t necessary in no way negates the lie that it isn’t necessary. I don’t understand why it’s hard to accept that a lie is an intentional statement that isn’t factual. It doesn’t matter “why” the statement is made. It doesn’t matter if the statement is later contradicted by the one stating the false information. Fauci has repeatedly made false statements that can be proven to be false. I understand if you guys want to forgive him or give him a total pass. But thus making excuses and claiming he didn’t mean what he said just starts to sound like a bunch of Trumpers excusing Trump’s lies. I’m sorry to interject Trump, but he’s brought up repeatedly to excuse Fauci’s lies here in this thread.

On what date do you think Fauci came to these conclusions?

 

I don't know about you but what I see he said was:
Masks are good.
Masks aren't perfect.
Masks should go to healthcare providers first.
I see nothing wrong with those statements especially since they were made at the same time.

 

What did Fauci need to do in March?
On Feb. 23rd Navarro told Trump to order 1 billion face masks.

 

Here’s what I see. On March 8, when Fauci told this lie, there had been 22 deaths in the US out of 504 active cases. By April 3 when masks were finally recommended to Americans, 1200 Americans were dying per day.

Fauci had already seen the same thing happen in China and South Korea before his March 8 comments. He knew masks were effective. He knew about asymptomatic spread.

It’s time to pick a side. Do masks work or not? There was sufficient data on mask usage for South Korea to recommend masks to citizens February 27. Why would the same data lead Fauci to say people in the US shouldn’t be wearing masks—that there was no reason for it?

Let’s say you and I are firemen. We are playing card in the firehouse talking about a training video we watched earlier. The video started with footage of a sleeping man in bed with a lit cigarette smoldering in the folds of the bedsheets. Within seconds the sheets ignite, producing smoke and fumes that render the man unconscious. In less than a minute, the whole room is engulfed in flames and the man is charcoal.

We finish a hand of cards just as a call comes through. We jump in the trucks and go to the address. We bust the door down and find a sleeping man in bed with a lit cigarette smoldering in the folds of the bedsheets. I turn to you and say “there’s no reason to put out the cigarette, it’s just a little smoke, lets go get a burger and come back later to take care of this”. We go get a burger and by the time we get back it’s way too late to stop the fire.

That’s essentially what happened.

This argument that masks are only necessary after the pandemic is out of control is troubling.

If masks work, masks should have been recommended on March 8.

 

Fauci at the very least should have told Americans to make homemade masks in the March 8 interview. Lying and saying there was no reason to be wearing a mask is the worst thing he could have said.

 

O dear !!!
How stupid can people be that they STILL NOT CAPTURE the basic principle of the masks, why they should be worn and what they can and should do ???

Bloody hell!!!

# 1 - How is Corona spreading?
Through the so-called droplet infection. This means that the virus is distributed as an aerosol when you breathe out, especially when you cough and sneeze. This can be inhaled directly by other people, but it can also settle on all sorts of surfaces and the virus survives there for a considerable time. If a person touches such a contaminated surface and then the contaminated hand wanders, for example, to the nose, mouth or eyes, then you have most likely become infected. The spread of the aerosol is about 1.5 to 2 meters (4 to 7 feet) if you don't have any cover on your mouth.

# 2 - What does a mask do?
Even a simple scarf in front of the mouth reduces the area around the aerosol, but above all the saturation of the aerosol itself. Regardless of whether it is just a scarf, a self-made mask or a normal mask that you have bought ... it is NOT about not getting infected! It's about distributing less aerosol less widely ... nothing else!
If instead of 2 meters (about 7 feet) with such a simple cover it is only 0.5 meters (1.5 feet), then it makes a lot of sense to wear a mask!

ONLY a so-called FFP2 mask offers protection against infection AND spread!
But even the best mask or, to put it exaggeratedly, an NBC protective suit like the fire department or the military are pointless if you do not wash and disinfect your hands regularly!
Whatthe hack is it for you to wear even a FFP2 mask in Walmart, to touch the shopping cart and everything else that could be contaminated with your hands, then to take the mask off in the car after shopping without having disinfect yourself your hands, and then to the first put your hands on your mouth, eh? Woops you can be infected!

 

You claimed he lied in March 2020!
And the Nora O'Donnell interview was from October 2020.

My point stands you never ever watched the 60 minutes interview, yet claimed he lied.

I've claimed that for posts on end. You're refusing to pay attention.

Not the right one where you accused him of lying.

Last time... he told in march 2020 it was about masks worn by the people in China and South Korea. Those are 3M masks!

So you admit again you never watched the 60 minutes interview on CBS.
Yet you stick to claiming he lied there. Pathetic.

You do everything to protect Donald for not arranging the masks needed for the people.